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Author Topic: anyone sail multihulls?  (Read 19711 times)

martno1fan

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anyone sail multihulls?
« on: December 14, 2006, 07:14:33 PM »

hi ive just aquired a set of plans for a trimaran called the nightmare from the designer Ernst Zemann from austria.does anyone here sail tri marans?.heres the boat in question he has given me permission to make the plans available to anyone check out the link and download them if you want them all he asks is you say thanks to him and poat pics of your build. heres his builds next link will be for the plans.the drawings were done by Eric Stolz.

]]http://www.rc-network.de/forum/showthread.php?t=48237


]]http://www.rc-network.de/forum/showthread.php?t=45060

http://http://www.rc-network.de/forum/showthread.php?t=49502
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gribeauval

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Re: anyone sail multihulls?
« Reply #1 on: December 14, 2006, 11:49:42 PM »

All it is is a simple typing error, nothing to get upset over. ;)

The correct site address is here;      http://community.webshots.com/user/boatbuilder
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martno1fan

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Re: anyone sail multihulls?
« Reply #2 on: December 15, 2006, 12:50:10 AM »

All it is is a simple typing error, nothing to get upset over. ;)

The correct site address is here;      http://community.webshots.com/user/boatbuilder
was actually a site problem not mine i merely pasted it on here dunno what happened anyways its done now.has anyone else built this boat yet? anyone know of it or how it sails?.
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andywright

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Re: anyone sail multihulls?
« Reply #3 on: December 15, 2006, 02:36:04 PM »

I used to sail mini 40 tri's, I was also the secretary of the British Model Multihull Association. I can help with tips, but the main one if you are building from scratch is to keep it light.
 My last boat was a mix of Andy McCullocks latest main hull, Freight Train, and french floats from the club at Cergy Pontoise in France. The boat was about 4lb all up weight and came third in the last Coupe De France I entered. I also used swing rigs, originally the boat was conventional rig, but it was re-rigged to swing rig when I fitted the French floats. I make sails, (www.windpowersails.8m.com) and particularly used to specialise in Multihull sails. Though now In do have patterns for most classes.
You also need to fit a wing on the bottom of the rudder, typically a spitfire shaped wing with plenty of depth, this can be set at zero angle of incidence and will stop the boat from nose diving and tripping, this is another reason the boat needs to be light, so that it accelerates rather than tripping over the lee float.
If you make the wing to slim, you will not get the same down force (the wing is upside down) and will need to set a couple of degrees down into it which will cause drag. The wing can be made adjustable so you can slip acouple of washers in it to alter the angle, but if the shape is correct this will not be required.
More info can be found at
http://www.apolloboatservices.co.uk/
Anthony is not related, just a similar name. GBR6 is my second tri.
The British model multihull assoc
http://freespace.virgin.net/model.multihulls/

If you need any other info let me know, you can send a pm or through the forum, my contact email is at my sails website.
Regards Andy


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martno1fan

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Re: anyone sail multihulls?
« Reply #4 on: December 15, 2006, 05:13:45 PM »

thanks for the reply andy id be glad of any help as this is al new to me.i havent had the plans printed as yet so im not sure if it has the wing you talk about but id be interested in finding out how to build one for it .even if its not on the plans.ill be sure to pm you about sails and a few tips soon many thanks.
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martin-R

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Re: anyone sail multihulls?
« Reply #5 on: December 15, 2006, 05:24:45 PM »

Tks for posting the link to your website and that of Apollo. It gave me an interesting and long :-[ tea-break.
As I matter of interest, maybe you could pm me with a price indication for a set of sails to the drawings in the first post of:
http://www.modelzeilen.nl/forum/viewtopic.php?t=19
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Welsh_Druid

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Re: anyone sail multihulls?
« Reply #6 on: December 15, 2006, 06:43:53 PM »

You also need to fit a wing on the bottom of the rudder, typically a spitfire shaped wing with plenty of depth, this can be set at zero angle of incidence and will stop the boat from nose diving and tripping, this is another reason the boat needs to be light, so that it accelerates rather than tripping over the lee float.
If you make the wing to slim, you will not get the same down force (the wing is upside down) and will need to set a couple of degrees down into it which will cause drag.


Andy

I am building the "Snapdragon" ( STAVROS - keep quiet about this  ;))  and of course it has the wing on the rudder. I appreciate that it should be thick in order to produce a lifting force at the (aerodynamically) low speeds .
 However a symetrical section is shown on the plans whereas I would have thought a cambered section placed inverted would be more effective ? I would appreciate your comments on this .

Don B
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Stavros

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Re: anyone sail multihulls?
« Reply #7 on: December 15, 2006, 07:21:14 PM »

Pay me on Sunday then Don :D
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andywright

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Re: anyone sail multihulls?
« Reply #8 on: December 15, 2006, 07:34:10 PM »

Welsh Driud
The snapdragon is a nice boat, you are correct in that the upper surface of the wing should be flat, and the lower surface aerofoil shape, the same goes for angle of attack, to keep drag low a neutral or as near as poss angle of attack, letting the foil shape give the required downforce. When building keep the weight as minimal as possible, I know you can't do much about the hulls as these are ready moulded, but be weight conscious when fitting out.
Andy
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Welsh_Druid

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Re: anyone sail multihulls?
« Reply #9 on: December 15, 2006, 08:24:52 PM »

Andy

Thanks for that. It confirms what I thought. I am building this from the plans so have produced my own hulls. I have just weighed them and all 3 are about the same at just under fourteen ounces each  (without decks). The plan says 6.5 lbs so I should be able to match that I think. How about the sail area - I was thinking of about the Marblehead B rig or equivelent. Would that be too much to begin with ?  We don't have a rescue boat  >:(

Thanks

Don
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martno1fan

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Re: anyone sail multihulls?
« Reply #10 on: December 16, 2006, 08:50:40 AM »

hi are the plans available on the net fro the snap dragon?,also i have the nightmare plans and ghost train plans im still unsure which one to build either of these or? any suggestions?.preferably free 0ones i can download lol ;).thanks.
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Welsh_Druid

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Re: anyone sail multihulls?
« Reply #11 on: December 16, 2006, 10:20:26 AM »

hi are the plans available on the net fro the snap dragon?,.

No - you have to buy them from Traplet. They are not comprehensive building plans - just outlines and frames with a few suggestions for building. OK for an experienced builder though.

Don
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MikeK

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Re: anyone sail multihulls?
« Reply #12 on: December 16, 2006, 11:07:36 AM »

hi are the plans available on the net fro the snap dragon?,also i have the nightmare plans and ghost train plans im still unsure which one to build either of these or? any suggestions?.preferably free 0ones i can download lol ;).thanks.

Hi, see the topic '20% off' by tigertiger under plans and information, both the snapdragon and a few other multihulls are advertised

MikeK
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martno1fan

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Re: anyone sail multihulls?
« Reply #13 on: December 16, 2006, 12:26:34 PM »

hi are the plans available on the net fro the snap dragon?,also i have the nightmare plans and ghost train plans im still unsure which one to build either of these or? any suggestions?.preferably free 0ones i can download lol ;).thanks.

Hi, see the topic '20% off' by tigertiger under plans and information, both the snapdragon and a few other multihulls are advertised

MikeK
hi where can i find the thread? cant seem to find it .thanks
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MikeK

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Re: anyone sail multihulls?
« Reply #14 on: December 16, 2006, 02:18:31 PM »

It is under Research and Information Heading entitled 20% Off by Tigertiger

MikeK
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martno1fan

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Re: anyone sail multihulls?
« Reply #15 on: December 16, 2006, 04:10:20 PM »

got it thanks!!.
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andywright

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Re: anyone sail multihulls?
« Reply #16 on: December 16, 2006, 09:41:45 PM »

All you budding multihull fans I can not stress enough build them light, keep them light, if I had the time to seriously campaign a multihull in any sort of competition, it would have to be light.
Andy
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martno1fan

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Re: anyone sail multihulls?
« Reply #17 on: December 16, 2006, 11:04:12 PM »

All you budding multihull fans I can not stress enough build them light, keep them light, if I had the time to seriously campaign a multihull in any sort of competition, it would have to be light.
Andy
andy mine will be light its going to be balsa for the main hull covered with glass cloth 120g and the floats will be either the same or i may go with a foam block build covered with glass cloth.12.7mm alli for the mast and 20 mm for the cross beams.im going to use ripstop for sails and make them myself using double sided tape as ive used this method before.i used the balsa and glass cloth covering on my sail boat and she is very light and strong too.also once we get these babys built we need to all get together and sail em  ;)
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Eddy Matthews

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Re: anyone sail multihulls?
« Reply #18 on: December 16, 2006, 11:20:59 PM »

I have to say that I've always fancied building a trimaran, and I have the plans for Freighttrain.... But my local club has unrestricted yacht races, where any boat can race irrespective of size/rig/whatever. Surprisingly enough, the results are always very close at the end of the season, some boats do well in strong winds, some in light winds, and overall things level themselves out over the year....

So I was wondering how competitive a trimaran is likely to be racing against mono-hulls? Would anyone care to comment?

Regards
Eddy
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martno1fan

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Re: anyone sail multihulls?
« Reply #19 on: December 17, 2006, 12:41:52 AM »

eddy ive never sailed one so not sure but from what i have seen and read they are way faster than a mono hull.im sure andy can tell us in more detail,one thing i supose mono hulls have over them is they dont tip over as easy but im just guessing .heres a link to a discusion about it check it out http://http://www.rcsailing.net/forum1/showthread.php?t=2920&highlight=10R+sterne+viper
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MikeK

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Re: anyone sail multihulls?
« Reply #20 on: December 17, 2006, 09:54:44 AM »

Watching a multihull sailing at my club, it is difficult to say which type wins out. On a broad reach the multihull tips a float in the air and takes off like a bat out of hell, leaving a mono way behind, but and the end of the run (providing it didn't tip just too much !) when tacking or gybing it can come to a dead stop as the lack of weight doesn't give it the impetus to move across the wind and quite some time is spent stuck in irons. It seems a bit of all or nothing progress but it most certainly is on the edge sailing. I'm sure you will have a great time with them

MikeK
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martno1fan

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Re: anyone sail multihulls?
« Reply #21 on: December 17, 2006, 02:09:43 PM »

mike can i ask what size the muti was? i know there are small multis available in some shops but they are not very good by all accounts.i would have thought the lighter the boat the better especially in light winds.a lot of mono hulls keel bulbs weigh as much as some multis do fully rigged.im hoping to keep mine arround the 5 1/2 to 6lb mark.its 4 ft long and 87"from deck to mast top.i think from what ive read and been told keeping them light allows them to accelerate rather than the float dip under which can be a problem im told especially if the floats are too narrow in the bow section.which most of the small rtr ones ive seen are.i cant wait to get mine started next year but i have a project to finnish before i can start which is why im spending some time on researching about them.they certainly look lik fun though.mind you i might need to get a resue boat too or a good pair of waders  ;D.
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MikeK

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Re: anyone sail multihulls?
« Reply #22 on: December 17, 2006, 02:55:59 PM »

Hi, I don't know the exact size, but the floats must have been near Marblehead length (around 4ft) , much the same size as your intended build. The centre hull was a thin blade affair looking a bit like a plane fuselage in profile. I can't recall if the radio gear was squashed in there somewhere or in one of the floats. Very light and very very fast except for the irons bit I mentioned. I don't think my nerves could handle sailing one for long, nor my patience be enough when it tipped over which I think it would often with me on the sticks  ;D ;D

MikeK
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martno1fan

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Re: anyone sail multihulls?
« Reply #23 on: December 17, 2006, 04:30:13 PM »

sounds like it was a bit of a home built experiment!!,i think its certainly going to be a big learning curve for me driving one of these but it should be fun.lets hope it spends more time upright than on its side though as i dont fancy swimming as its a big lake and salt water and its full of eels and crabs lol.normally when im there theres no one in the club house so i cant even get the resue boat out lol.looks like ill have to buy my lad an inflatable dingy lol.
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MikeK

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Re: anyone sail multihulls?
« Reply #24 on: December 17, 2006, 07:57:53 PM »

Too deep for chest waders ??
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