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Author Topic: For the Master Mariners and old sea dogs!  (Read 3413 times)

RobinStobbs

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For the Master Mariners and old sea dogs!
« on: February 08, 2010, 10:51:45 am »

One often hears the term "Full steam ahead" which I have always thought of as a corrupt term in a nautical sense.  An old engineer once told me that he would never use the term and that it should be "Full ahead, both", or "Full ahead, All", or whatever.  What do Mayhemers think?
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BarryM

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Re: For the Master Mariners and old sea dogs!
« Reply #1 on: February 08, 2010, 11:42:39 am »

Never heard it in my time at sea unless used as a joke. Just another Hollywood-ism in the same class as that other phrase that makes me cringe - 'Over and Out'.

Barry M
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Bryan Young

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Re: For the Master Mariners and old sea dogs!
« Reply #2 on: February 08, 2010, 12:40:52 pm »

Normally it's just "Full Ahead" (with a designation if there is more than one shaft).
Or....jokingly.....in a time of mock trouble...turn your cap back to front, grab hold of w window sill and yell "Full Steam Ahead And Trust In The Lord".
Just a moment of daftness, a bit like playing cricket in the wheelhouse using a rubber (eraser to you Americans) and a chart straightedge. BY.
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Notes from a simple seaman

Tankerman

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Re: For the Master Mariners and old sea dogs!
« Reply #3 on: February 08, 2010, 01:47:44 pm »


 I only ever heard "Full ahead" and it was generally the instruction that the "Old Man" or whoever was in command on the bridge, gave to the Deck Apprentice or Junior Deck Officer standing-by the Engine Room Telegraph. This was rung on the telegraph so that the Engineers could bring the main engine up to the revolutions that had been established when the ship was built as correct for that command.
 Once the ship was clear of land, the pilot had been disembarked to his launch and there was no more shoreside interference we would get "Full away on Passage" which was rung on the telegraph by swinging the indicator round to "Full ahead" twice, to which we would reply in the engine room by two enthusiastic swings on our telegraph. Following that the Senior Engineer (Chief or Second) would leave the engine-room to the watch-keeping engineer. Boiler tubes would have to be "blown" to clear them of the soot that would have accumulated during the time in port. The stand-by steering motor, boiler feed-pump, and generator would be shut-down. The sea-water evaporator would be flashed-up to start replenishing the fresh water tanks and various adjustments would be made to things as H.P. & L.P.Extractions, Turbine shroud clearance, Gland steam and a myriad of other things, all the while bringing the main engine full sea speed.
 I am sorry this has been such a long-winded post, even so I have skipped a lot that occurs when "Full ahead" is ordered. I hope it shows just how irrelevant "Full steam ahead" would be certainly on a Merchant Ship.
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norry

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Re: For the Master Mariners and old sea dogs!
« Reply #4 on: February 08, 2010, 04:32:02 pm »

...Hi Guys...

The problem with the phrase " Over and Out " is that words "Over" & "Out"  should never be said together in the same sentence...

When conducting a conversation on Radio...
 
The word Over is used to inform the other party that you have ended your sentence,  Please Reply...

The wiord Out is used to inform the other party that you have finished your Conversation ,  Dont Reply...

And Who Is Rodger...I only ever sailed with one guy called Rodger and he was,nt quallified to use the Radio...

...Best Regards...Norry...
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BarryM

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Re: For the Master Mariners and old sea dogs!
« Reply #5 on: February 08, 2010, 04:48:49 pm »

My point exactly but it still goes on.  >>:-(

Barry M
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Netleyned

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Re: For the Master Mariners and old sea dogs!
« Reply #6 on: February 08, 2010, 05:36:32 pm »

Rodger is a throwback from the old Phonetic Alphabet
R was used in Teletype conversations between we
ops who had our own codes as well as the Q code and Z code
Iam very QRL so RAR!

Ned

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meechingman

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Re: For the Master Mariners and old sea dogs!
« Reply #7 on: February 08, 2010, 05:54:43 pm »

I heard 'Over and Out' a lot when I was on board my Dad's tug in the 60's and 70's, Norry. The other joint master and the mate both said it, and I said it too, but my Dad always said 'Over and Down'. Port radio also said 'Over and Out'. Correct or not, it definitely was used.

As for 'Full Steam Ahead', never heard it. And 'Full Diesel Ahead' would have sounded plain daft!  {-) It was always 'Full Ahead Both'. The tug had Bloctube direct controls anyway, but 'Full Ahead' would invariably have the Chief haring up to the wheelhouse asking 'Where's the (insert banned word of your choice ;)) fire?'  %%

I was listening to a tape of HF radio conversations of a tanker fire and salvage incident from 1968 a few days ago. HMS Mohawk was co-ordinating operations and almost every transmission from her had a 'roger', sometimes accompanied by an 'out'.

Andy
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Netleyned

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Re: For the Master Mariners and old sea dogs!
« Reply #8 on: February 08, 2010, 06:14:09 pm »

Roger meaning 'Understood'
Out meaning finished transmission
Simples!
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BarryM

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Re: For the Master Mariners and old sea dogs!
« Reply #9 on: February 08, 2010, 06:53:52 pm »

I heard 'Over and Out' a lot when I was on board my Dad's tug in the 60's and 70's, Norry. The other joint master and the mate both said it, and I said it too, but my Dad always said 'Over and Down'. Port radio also said 'Over and Out'. Correct or not, it definitely was used.

Andy

You may have used it but it doesn't make it right and Norry is spot on. How does it make sense to say 'Over to you I'm waiting on your reply and also clearing down'?

Barry M
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Jimmy James

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Re: For the Master Mariners and old sea dogs!
« Reply #10 on: February 08, 2010, 08:07:10 pm »

Been at sea over 50+ years and have never heard the expression full steam ahead on the bridge of a British ship...Usually the order is for FULL SEA SPEED or on some ships MAKE XXX TURNS FOR  XXX Kts ...I for one wouldn't like to put the main engines FULL ahead with out informing the engine room in advance because that is one sure way too have an irate Chief E/R storming on the bridge screeming about wrecking his engines and fuel consumtion {:-{ %% O0 :}
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RobinStobbs

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Re: For the Master Mariners and old sea dogs!
« Reply #11 on: February 09, 2010, 05:24:55 am »

QSL ......... Many thanks to you all for confirming my forgettory (It used to be a memory!).  Re. Phonetic alphabet and Q-codes.  I was a trained military radio op in the early 50s and also start twitching when I hear that idiotic Hollywoodese  'Over and out'.  It's become part of our family language to use 'QRM' when anyone is causing verbal strife and I still use the words 'Roger' and 'Wilco' as originally intended and prefer to use the 'Able, Baker, Charlie, Dog' over the modern 'Alpha, Bravo, etc' which I can never remember! ;-)     UW
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meechingman

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Re: For the Master Mariners and old sea dogs!
« Reply #12 on: February 10, 2010, 10:56:55 pm »

You may have used it but it doesn't make it right and Norry is spot on. How does it make sense to say 'Over to you I'm waiting on your reply and also clearing down'?

Barry M

Well, I've been chastised.  <:( But we can't all be perfect!  ;) I did actually say that 'it might not have been correct'...... But it was used down here, by us lowly tuggies and the port radio ops. Maybe those on the ferries were taught better. We almost had to put on a posh accent when working them, or Niton! %%

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BarryM

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Re: For the Master Mariners and old sea dogs!
« Reply #13 on: February 10, 2010, 11:19:17 pm »

Ferries my a***!!  >>:-(  I was deep sea and after I came ashore was responsible for, among other things, 'lowly tuggies' of several nationalities who would have choked on their ale if anyone had said 'over and out'   <*<

Cheers,

Barry M
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Bryan Young

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Re: For the Master Mariners and old sea dogs!
« Reply #14 on: February 11, 2010, 07:22:47 pm »

Alas, for years now (or at least since VHF was introduced), radio discipline has gone down. Never mind the absurd "over and out" business, how about the clowns that just use Channel 16 as a general chat channel and so deny its use to others who may have great need of it. Even worse are the complete morons who play their own favourite music over Ch.16. Not being Nationalistic here, but the Brits (and other N.Europeans) are better at channel discipline than many of the mid-East outfits.
The advent of VHF also saw a massive decline in the use of the Aldis Lamp to call up a passing ship.....another skill lost. BY.
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pheonix

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Re: For the Master Mariners and old sea dogs!
« Reply #15 on: February 13, 2010, 04:32:31 pm »

Have been at sea now for 25 years and totally agree on the abused use of chl16.

We are involved in oil exploration and are usually towing alot of gear behind us (12 cables, 7000m long and 1100m wide). The very nature of the job takes us world wide and the worse areas we have found are likes of Nigeria and Egypt for chatter/music and even offers of interesting "personal services". This usually occurs when we are desperately trying to contact some rogue ship or fishing vessel as they run directly for our gear.

The number of vessels that either ignore or don't listen to Chl 16 is amazing.

We do on occasion use the Aldis light but in the end we end up using the white flares and our chaseboats to ward them off

Mind you, we have had a recent incident in the Gulf of Mexico where a vessel just ignored all warnings and actually run over our gear. Fortunately we managed to dive it in time so no damage was done - just a lot of paperwork afterwards!!!!
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