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Author Topic: Another Slo-Mo-Shun!  (Read 9121 times)

marksaab

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Another Slo-Mo-Shun!
« on: January 15, 2007, 05:54:56 PM »

Hello All
My first thread , hopefully it will work OK!
A big hello to Orby, if I had the same grief you have I think I would consigned my build to a "Viking" funeral!!

This is my first ever build....didn't notice the ** Experienced Builder notice on the box when I bought it so its been a bit "difficult"  at times!
I've not been in the modelling game for a while so I had to start from scratch with equipment and tools...first pic is my newly acquired collection, which of course cost me as much as the kit did...but hopefully there will be more kits to follow.



Next post to follow in a min!

Mark

 
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marksaab

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Re: Another Slo-Mo-Shun!
« Reply #1 on: January 15, 2007, 06:06:33 PM »

I didn't think to take any pics until I had planked the top deck.

I built the hull up on a thick ply base board using angle blocks set out on a metal straight edge and then clamped the keel against the blocks using metal straps screwed into the base, this kept it all nice and straight.

I started by using normal wood glue then switched to CA glue which really worked well, the planking was very easy, quite enjoyed it!

Only did some minor sanding on the ends so most of the planks are parallel, I started in the middle and worked evenly to the sides, one thing I did was to dry assemble the planks so I would end up with an even number each side, the side planking went OK, I was able to twist the planks on the underside....hadn't discovered steaming then!

To echo everyone elses comments....Billing parts fit is really appaling!!!  Dont mind about lack of instructions...who reads them anyway! But it would be nice if the bits fit together, although I must say that it has not spoiled my enjoyment of the build and it makes it all the more satisfying.



The next pic shows the underside AFTER the parts had been trimmed, I found a razer saw worked really well for this, 


  

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marksaab

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Re: Another Slo-Mo-Shun!
« Reply #2 on: January 15, 2007, 06:21:22 PM »

Hi
More progress...well a catch up on work so far!

The sheeting of the underside was.....challenging! As Orby said, none of the parts fit, I used all the original parts supplied, didn't really occur to me to make new ones...I will next time!

I used pins and rubber bands to hold the parts in place, the most difficult was the bow...getting it positioned was hard and then as later pics will show the sheet distorted badly.

I should have done a bit more prep work on the frames to get the parts to sit properly...my inexperience showing.

So rather than trying to make it all fit together I assumed I would have to use filler and concentrated on making to the hull symmetrical.







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marksaab

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Re: Another Slo-Mo-Shun!
« Reply #3 on: January 15, 2007, 06:30:42 PM »

Disaster at the bow!

Planking was so easy I got carried away and clamped the planks at the bow too much, result was the "nose" went very wrong! I decided I could either 1) cut the whole section out and make it again using solid balsa wood or fill it, I decided to fill it.

Pics show the original shape, not too clear but you should be able to see how it pinches at the tip.

I used standard wood filler...more money at B&Q!! It sands very well.

Reading the posts on Orby's thread about sanding....I always use a cork block and just use drawing pins to hold the paper on, normally use 320 grit sandpaper for final finishing.








 
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marksaab

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Re: Another Slo-Mo-Shun!
« Reply #4 on: January 15, 2007, 06:44:14 PM »

The thin veneer!

After cutting out the "hole" on the top....courtesy of a newly acquired Dremel (tool bought for work use of course!) I started on the veneering, one bit that had me thinking was the direction of the side veneer, the plans show it all "pointing" forward but the box shows the sides going backwards....I decided it would look nicer all going in th same direction.

Never done veneering, but Orby I'm glad I read your thread...didn't let water near it!  Used Evostick for most of the veneering, overlapped the 90 Deg centre joints then drew a pencil line and used a scalpel to cut them off.

Didn't chamfer the edges until I had put a few on so I had to do some filling after. I used CA to hold the short side ones on, good job too as I had to replace a few which didn't look right.

Steamed the ones on the end and was quite pleased with result, had to make up a few thin filler pieces though!

Veneer pics below

















It goes on!!!
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marksaab

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Re: Another Slo-Mo-Shun!
« Reply #5 on: January 15, 2007, 06:51:45 PM »

Veneering cont

Short update with pics to follow.

Sanded the whole hull last night...I think it took me 4-5 hours! Used sanding sealer on the underside, I'm going to use varnish on the top.

Used a sanding block with 320 (I think) paper, got the veneer very smooth BUT did a bit too much sanding so in some parts it is paper thin!!

had to repair a couple of holes...used mahogany filler, did a bit of testing before and found some brands too light, I will post the brand I found to be the best match.

The instructions for the varnish said "wipe down bare wood with a damp cloth" nervous about this but did it anyway, i think its or but it did raise the grain a bit in places.

Starting varnish tonight....should end up with 8-9 coats.

More to follow soon. 
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tobyker

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Re: Another Slo-Mo-Shun!
« Reply #6 on: January 15, 2007, 08:10:26 PM »

Thanks for showing us that - it looks very nice. I admire people who build boats covered in veneer, but wouldn't wish to emulate them. If it's an oil based varnish I'm surprised you had to wipe it with a (water) damp cloth - usually it's a white spirit damp cloth. Hope you saw the TV documentary on the slo-Mo Shuns last year -I bet it did a lot for sales of the kit!
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BobF

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Re: Another Slo-Mo-Shun!
« Reply #7 on: January 15, 2007, 08:30:24 PM »

Hi all,

Yet another tip that you can try at your peril. I was told about this by a chap who could produce a finish you would not believe.
When the wood was sanded and ready for the first coat of what ever, he would mist spray with water. He would then dry the wood with a blow lamp. He claimed the heat dried the fine hairy timber which scorched away, leaving no small raised bits.

Go on, give it a try on some scrap.

Bob
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Colin H

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Re: Another Slo-Mo-Shun!
« Reply #8 on: January 15, 2007, 10:53:21 PM »

Hi,

Don't know about the blow lamp but in the gun trade when working on walnut stocks I have seen the gunsmith wipe it with meths then set it on fire. The stock is kept moving at all times whilst the meths burns off to prevent scorching.

This is supposed to remove any hairy bits and bring out the grain. Never tried it myself as these gunsmiths are rare birds and spend years learning their trade.

Colin H.
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BobF

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Re: Another Slo-Mo-Shun!
« Reply #9 on: January 16, 2007, 08:25:59 AM »

Hi Colin H,

Re the above tip. He was a retired gun smith actually. I didn't think to mention that bit.

Bob
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marksaab

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Re: Another Slo-Mo-Shun!
« Reply #10 on: January 16, 2007, 09:55:25 AM »

Hi All

Veneer sanded down prior to varnishing








mark
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marksaab

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Re: Another Slo-Mo-Shun!
« Reply #11 on: January 16, 2007, 10:00:46 AM »

More pics showing first two coats of varnish, rubbed down in between with 400 grit paper.

I was using a rubber backed sanding sheet but its quite pricey at one sheet per coat!









mark
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marksaab

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Re: Another Slo-Mo-Shun!
« Reply #12 on: January 16, 2007, 10:09:10 AM »

Hi Toby

Missed the doc last year...was it on Discovery? Lost my Sky access last year....so I think thats why I have more time on my hands!!!

The varnish is..as expected..strengthening the veneer, I will do a few coats then do the underside and finally the last few coats on the top.

Without sounding too sad...I really am enjoying the challenges that the "poor" kit quality throws up! Even the veneering/varnishing is satisfying!

Mark
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orby1

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Re: Another Slo-Mo-Shun!
« Reply #13 on: January 16, 2007, 02:02:45 PM »

Hi Mark,
Your build looks ace! The varnish is looking good already after only a couple of coats, it all looks so simple.  Why oh why oh why oh why oh why (you get my drift) didn't I just use varnish???? You might have had some problems earlier on but it all looks very neat, well done.
And what has me laughing here, is that what has taken me over a year, about 110 forum posts and countless questions, you've done in 12 posts! ;D  Ah, you gotta laugh....
Anyway now you're ahead of me I'm going to be asking you things as I go gradually along.  What are you thinking motor-wise? Have you looked into 'surface drive' or whatever it's called?
Well done again, she's looking like a beaut already.
All ther very best, Orb.
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tobyker

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Re: Another Slo-Mo-Shun!
« Reply #14 on: January 16, 2007, 05:37:30 PM »

Pictures on post #13 - absolutely gorgeous. The doc must have been on terrestial as we don't have the others. I'll follow you pogress with interest. I think you have to go surface piercing for the greatest speed - she should plane on the sponsons and propellor boss, though stability in pitch becomes a bit of a problem!
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BobF

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Re: Another Slo-Mo-Shun!
« Reply #15 on: January 16, 2007, 06:01:12 PM »

Hi all,

I know that orby1 had problems with his epoxy resin, but  I have always found that the pores/holes in the grain of the wood will show through for many coats of varnish. I know it does depend on the wood, but I mainly use mahogany which is bad for this.
I always use two coats of epoxy thinned 50/50 after which I flat it down to what looks like bare wood, and then apply paint or varnish as required. In fact I have several IC powered wooden boats that I have run for a couple of seasons with just the two thinned down epoxy coats, with no finish yet applied, and they show no signs of water damage. I have noticed that lite ply and balsa has less of a tendency to puddle the epoxy resin than Birch ply has. I think that is because Birch is less absorbant.
In the days before epoxy, if I was varnishing, I always used two coats of varnish thinned 50/50 before trying to get a shinny finish with the top coats.

Waffle over Bob
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orby1

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Re: Another Slo-Mo-Shun!
« Reply #16 on: January 16, 2007, 07:51:35 PM »

Hi Marksaab,
If you missed the tv documentary (as did I) about the Slo Mo Shuns, maybe I could do you a favour.  In MMI magazine from last May, Ernie Lazenby wrote a good article about the history of the world water speed record, including a section about the Slo Mo, with a few pictures of his models too - well worth a look.  Also, in the August edition, one of the magazine staff has built 'our' model and featured it as a write up in the magazine with step by step intructions and photos.  It's pretty helpful and I wish WISH WISH I'd seen it before I started!!!
If you'd like a copy, PM me your postal address and I'll photocopy them at work and post them to you.  I know you've managed to get a good way into the model without any help from the article, but every little helps, as they say.
Julian.x
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marksaab

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Re: Another Slo-Mo-Shun!
« Reply #17 on: January 17, 2007, 10:01:16 AM »

Hi All !
More varnishing last night...slowly learning...latest lesson...dont use quick drying varnish in a warm flat...it dries as it comes of the brush and means more sanding!

Buying some normal stuff today.

Dead right about the grain showing through but I'm hoping lots of coats will help, sanding down with wet and dry, seems to be going ok.

Now I'm feeling a bit guilty cos I'm building this one for static "display" actually I may be really mercenary and sell it after to finance the next one and make use of all these new "skills" I've learnt. I would like to see it mobile, world speed record boats have been of interest to me since the 70's and I actually bought plans for Slo-mo-shun at the Model Engineer Exhibition when it was still held at the Wembly Conference Centre!

I will try to do a bit of digging about the TV doc if it was in C4 I may be able to get a copy from someone I know at RDF.

Have good day everyone and thanks for the positive feedback!

BTW orby i have sent my address via PM.

Mark
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kayem

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Re: Another Slo-Mo-Shun!
« Reply #18 on: January 17, 2007, 11:15:04 AM »


Dead right about the grain showing through but I'm hoping lots of coats will help, sanding down with wet and dry, seems to be going ok.


Good workmanship, slightly spoiled by the quality of wood used, though that's all you can expect from Billing unfortunately. They've always had a reputation for crap wood, though believe it or not, things do seem to have improved a little in recent years. To lose the grain, you have to use a suitable filler before applying varnish, you aren't going to do that with varnish alone. It's pretty low tech, but I use ordinary dope based sanding sealer, 2 or 3 thinned coats should be enough on cheap mahogany like this. Dry sand with 180 silicon carbide, dusting off all the time, and only then apply the varnish. I've never had any adhesion problems with this method, and you'll need far fewer coats of varnish to achieve a good finish.
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Re: Another Slo-Mo-Shun!
« Reply #19 on: January 17, 2007, 12:07:50 PM »

Hi all,

I know that orby1 had problems with his epoxy resin, but  I have always found that the pores/holes in the grain of the wood will show through for many coats of varnish. I know it does depend on the wood, but I mainly use mahogany which is bad for this.
I always use two coats of epoxy thinned 50/50 after which I flat it down to what looks like bare wood, and then apply paint or varnish as required. In fact I have several IC powered wooden boats that I have run for a couple of seasons with just the two thinned down epoxy coats, with no finish yet applied, and they show no signs of water damage. I have noticed that lite ply and balsa has less of a tendency to puddle the epoxy resin than Birch ply has. I think that is because Birch is less absorbant.
In the days before epoxy, if I was varnishing, I always used two coats of varnish thinned 50/50 before trying to get a shinny finish with the top coats.

Waffle over Bob
How and with what do you thin down epoxy resin ? ???

Richard ;)
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marksaab

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Re: Another Slo-Mo-Shun!
« Reply #20 on: January 17, 2007, 12:22:33 PM »

Hi  I guess I'm too late to use sanding sealer now?  I used it on the underside and it certainly fills the grain.

My next kit will not be a Billing!  Any recommendations for good quality all wood kits, thinking about a sailing boat next.

I'm reluctant to try resin because any mishaps need a lot of rework...sorry Orby!!

I plan to have it finished in a couple of weeks...fingers crossed!

Mark
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BobF

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Re: Another Slo-Mo-Shun!
« Reply #21 on: January 17, 2007, 12:58:13 PM »

Hi DickyD,

There have been quite a few posts regarding epoxy and thinners in the past, so I will keep it short.

I use meths, I have never had a problem with any make of epoxy when using it.

The correct book name for the thinners  (not too sure about spelling) is De natured alcohol.
Which is meths with added colour and smell.

After I have mixed in the two epoxy components, I just stir in the meths. For the first two coats I use equal quantities of epoxy to thinners  (50/50)

Regards Bob
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DickyD

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Re: Another Slo-Mo-Shun!
« Reply #22 on: January 17, 2007, 03:42:27 PM »

Thanks Bob, nice straight forward answer, short and to the point ;D

Richard ;)
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Re: Another Slo-Mo-Shun!
« Reply #23 on: January 17, 2007, 03:53:24 PM »

BTW orby i have sent my address via PM.

I'll get the articles away to you today Mark. ;)  Being B/W photocopies they're sometimes a little contrasty and it might be hard to see the fine details of the photographs, but they'll still be a good read for you.
Cheers, Julian.
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marksaab

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Re: Another Slo-Mo-Shun!
« Reply #24 on: January 17, 2007, 04:03:25 PM »

Cheers Julian

Easy to get a bit carried away with this boat stuff...better get on with some real work!!!

Mark
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