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Author Topic: Oops...  (Read 5873 times)

wbeedie

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Re: Oops...
« Reply #25 on: October 25, 2010, 12:16:41 am »

if they didnt have enough way gongsteering would be unresponsive especially in that tidal area and I suppose they could have had problems Geoff but as you said shouldve stayed in deeper water , and to think they took the anti radiation tablets from the locals a few years before as well
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Netleyned

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Re: Oops...
« Reply #26 on: October 25, 2010, 06:23:45 am »

An echo sounder only gives depth below it
They are normally fitted towards the fore ends to give warning of a shelving bottom
not much use if the stern swings on to a shingle bank.
Still no excuse though

Ned
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Colin Bishop

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Re: Oops...
« Reply #27 on: October 25, 2010, 05:08:26 pm »

I just wonder if the grounding could be down to poor low speed control.

Nuclear subs are designed to 'fly' through the water using their propellors/propulsors and control surfaces. On the surface they only have their prop and rudder to control them. In the Astute class the rudder is ahead of the propulsor and an ex crew member of Courageous told me at Plymouth last year that conventional props are actually more efficient but propulsors are fitted for maximum stealth and quietness. Unless the vessel has significant headway the rudder is effectively useless. It was reported that the vessel was stopped to transfer personnel ashore at the time in a comparitively narrow channel. In that situation, if the boat had been caught by the tide it may have been impossible to do very much about it.

This does rather beg the question of whether it was a very good place to stop though.

My old one to one scale boat had an outboard mounted alongside the rudder and in some situations you had very little control at all unless you had a warping line ashore. You can feel very helpless backing and filling on the motor in a crowded marina as the tide carries you inexorably towards another moored boat and you can't get enough steerage to turn tightly enough.

Colin
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DavieTait

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Re: Oops...
« Reply #28 on: October 25, 2010, 05:20:04 pm »

She will have an emergency "get you home" deployable azimuthing thruster in the stern they could have used if they had had the time and depth of water , the only draw back to using it is that it drops down from the aft ballast tank and could have caused a hell of a lot more damage to the sub if she had grounded with it deployed. I know the S and T class had these thrusters so it would be a fairly safe bet that the Astute has it as well. Photo's of that section of the stern are as rare as hens teeth ( well the RN don't want anyone seeing the full details of the propulsor unit). The S and T boats also have an anchor that drops from the bottom of the forrard ballast tank which she should have so again yet another option that should have been used if they had been watching what they were doing.
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Davie Tait,
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gingyer

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Re: Oops...
« Reply #29 on: October 25, 2010, 05:31:56 pm »

Just wondering if any of you noted the timings they were giving out?
When the Admiralty spokesperson and the local people were being interveiwed they all said that the subs only
hope was that it could be refloated when the tide starts coming back in and it would not be deep enough water until 7pm with hightide after that

the boat was refloated at just after 6pm....
Possibly the tidal charts are out? hence why it was caught in a low tide it was expected to be clear of for another 1hr


Just a thought  :D :D
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Lord Bungle

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Re: Oops...
« Reply #30 on: October 25, 2010, 06:51:51 pm »

Just wondering if any of you noted the timings they were giving out?
When the Admiralty spokesperson and the local people were being interveiwed they all said that the subs only
hope was that it could be refloated when the tide starts coming back in and it would not be deep enough water until 7pm with hightide after that

the boat was refloated at just after 6pm....
Possibly the tidal charts are out? hence why it was caught in a low tide it was expected to be clear of for another 1hr


Just a thought  :D :D

someone forgot to set the clocks properly then
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wbeedie

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Re: Oops...
« Reply #31 on: October 25, 2010, 11:03:40 pm »

No the top of the tide was Seven o clock but once enough water  to float her was an hour earlier and also higher at night than the morning tide so not really a prob with timings for refloating her
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Wasyl

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Re: Oops...
« Reply #32 on: November 04, 2010, 09:21:57 am »

On the news this morning,it was stated that the rescue Tug sent to help the Astute,ripped off one of its fins??? when it collided with the sub,.....who,s in the "subfin soup" now, {-)

Wullie
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Circlip

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Re: Oops...
« Reply #33 on: November 04, 2010, 12:09:39 pm »

Our news south of the border said a "Damaged plane" Probably be reported in the Scottish edition of the Sun when one of the crews gob gets away with itself.

  Regards  Ian.
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The long Build

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Re: Oops...
« Reply #34 on: November 04, 2010, 01:25:17 pm »

Should not have got stuck then should they !!  %%
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Wasyl

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Re: Oops...
« Reply #35 on: November 04, 2010, 02:54:50 pm »

Our news south of the border said a "Damaged plane" Probably be reported in the Scottish edition of the Sun when one of the crews gob gets away with itself.

  Regards  Ian.
.."Planes"...are they no them things that fly in the sky,...like an elephants eye,that was looking at me, {-)

Wullie
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sailorboy61

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Re: Oops...
« Reply #36 on: November 04, 2010, 03:16:49 pm »

quote (BBC) 'Aside from attack capabilities, it is able to sit in waters off the coast undetected, delivering the UK's special forces where needed or even listening to mobile phone conversations'.

More like making mobile calls and sending the special out to the chippy for fish supper. Its almost understandable when an old merchantman does this from time to time...... but lets remember these guys are supposed to be the dogs b******s!

There are no excuses....they shouldn't have been there!!!

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Wasyl

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Re: Oops...
« Reply #37 on: November 04, 2010, 03:44:26 pm »

You might be right on the Fish supper,as there,s a crackin Fish & chip shop in Kyle of lochalsh,

Wullie
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pugwash

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Re: Oops...
« Reply #38 on: November 04, 2010, 04:04:03 pm »

Yes I must second that Wullie - as good as any fish and chips shop I have been to recently.
Geoff
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wbeedie

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Re: Oops...
« Reply #39 on: November 04, 2010, 06:05:48 pm »

You not breen for a while the last couple of times I was there Wullie and Geoff it wasnt as good now Mallaig has a cracker and so does Broadford
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pugwash

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Re: Oops...
« Reply #40 on: November 04, 2010, 06:24:00 pm »

We didnt get up this year because of my hip operation we usually stay in Lower Breaknish and have tried  (is it Creelers)
then its on to the UIg ferry for South Uist for my weeks brown trout fishing whilst SWMBO goes bird-watching and doing
geology type things. Really missed it this year.
Geoff
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Wasyl

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Re: Oops...
« Reply #41 on: November 04, 2010, 06:51:14 pm »

The last time i was up that way was 2005,..how time flies,..we stayed at Wullie,s Bunk house,"no relation," he,s just ower the bridge at Dornie, heading Kyle then off to the right, heading to Camusluine,..11 mile in,fantastic place was 7.50 a head in 2005,or you could rent a self contained cottage with all mod cons + TV+Sat,..for 40 for 2  for 3 days, and you got 10 leccy thrown in,and 6 fresh eggs,+ free mountain bikes and route map for the best tracks,I,ve no doubt he,s still there,his names ,Wullie Nicholson,..a real Gent,..i.ve got his Tel number somewhere,so if your ever needing somewhere to stay,thats where to go,..he,also got a barn full of kit, for the kids,

Wullie
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wbeedie

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Re: Oops...
« Reply #42 on: November 04, 2010, 06:53:31 pm »

Aye Geoff it used to be called Creelers , cant remember  what its new name is now ,,, you would have seen the sub from lower Breakish near enough ,, should of told the docs to postpone the hip op , some good rivers on this island as well for fishing Varrigil out side Portree on the South side ,Kinloch in Dunvegan , Skeabost and a few wee lochs up in the hills for Brownies, give me a shout when up this way next and I will take you to a few spots

 AYe Wullie , I know the place you are on about  some good hills down Kintail way and a good wee pub,
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Shipmate60

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Re: Oops...
« Reply #43 on: November 04, 2010, 08:20:30 pm »

The Chippie in Kyle is good but so are the seagulls, don't expect to eat them on the seats opposite.
They are huge and very aggressive.
No not the locals, they are great.
Had to have a lift back from "Tingle Creek" more than once!!!

Bob
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Wasyl

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Re: Oops...
« Reply #44 on: November 04, 2010, 08:53:16 pm »

"but so are the seagulls, don't expect to eat them on the seats opposite."So thats what you southerners get up to when you come up to Gods country,..well If that,s your delicacy,keep coming,just be sure to take out the Greater Black Backs,...mind you they taste a bit fishy,...so I,ve been told,an there,s not much meat on them, {-) {-)

Wullie
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pugwash

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Re: Oops...
« Reply #45 on: November 04, 2010, 10:41:38 pm »

Wbeedie I might just take you up on that if I can fit it in - we have never had more than a night on Skye just use it
to stay whilst waiting for the ferry but I know some of the fishing is great and would like to stay a bit longer sometime.
Geoff
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Wasyl

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Re: Oops...
« Reply #46 on: November 04, 2010, 11:27:51 pm »

Can I come???.. O0 I,m a good cook,.as long as you like Indian curries,..there,s only 2 of us ...oh and a cross beardie/border,that will lick you to death,

Wullie
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Shipmate60

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Re: Oops...
« Reply #47 on: November 04, 2010, 11:32:42 pm »

Wullie,
I used to spend 3 months at a time running out of BUTEC.
So I know the pubs well.

Bob
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