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Author Topic: Farewell Ark Royal  (Read 8893 times)

brianB6

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Re: Farewell Ark Royal
« Reply #25 on: November 25, 2010, 08:43:38 PM »

Agreed. Without support no armed force will last long.
Lets hope that neither UK nor Australia need carriers before 2014.
At least new ones are being built even if they get mothballed.
For the Australian ships see:-
http://www.navy.gov.au/Canberra_Class and Wikipedia Canberra class.
We just hope that Spain does not go under before the hulls are complete.
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snowwolflair

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Re: Farewell Ark Royal
« Reply #26 on: November 25, 2010, 11:46:10 PM »

Just watched the BBC coverage of the last Harriers taking off from Ark Royal.

She returned from a 12m refit a year ago, is at peak efficiency and is just being thrown away.

Crazy!  >>:-(

Colin

I guess this means they could sell her along with the harriers to India or another ex-Commonwealth navy.  the money the fetch might save two more frigates.
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pugwash

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Re: Farewell Ark Royal
« Reply #27 on: November 26, 2010, 12:15:05 AM »

And what would the Indians want with a 25 yr old carrier when they have a 40,000ton carrier being built and a 65,000ton in the
pipeline (albeit both are behind schedule)
The days of them taking our castoffs have long gone but the Trinidad and Tobago defence force may be interested.
Geoff
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RaaArtyGunner

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Re: Farewell Ark Royal
« Reply #28 on: November 26, 2010, 08:28:08 AM »


We just hope that Spain does not go under before the hulls are complete.

Brian,

Not too worry we can buy American mothballs like last time. %) %) %)
It's only for the Navy %% %% %%

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derekwarner

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Re: Farewell Ark Royal
« Reply #29 on: November 26, 2010, 10:51:05 AM »

mmmmmmmm  : OK...I stand corrected....my apologies to all.............Derek
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Derek Warner

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Barry

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Re: Farewell Ark Royal
« Reply #30 on: November 26, 2010, 11:01:42 AM »

The names Kanimbla and Manoora spring to mind. Not so much ships but floating rust by all accounts.
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Nordsee

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Re: Farewell Ark Royal
« Reply #31 on: November 26, 2010, 02:03:03 PM »

There's alot of blame and fingers being pointed at the previous as well as the current governments. neither of whom had much going for them....... lets not forget these problems actually started with a certain lady running the country....... her belief that there is no society only individuals has come to fruition, she must be very happy..... the 'loads a money' class of the 80s looking after number one have too deep a hold on this country. All politics and politicians eventually become corrupt..... they forget that they are working for the country and further their own ends.Todays 'don't care' generation are the off spring of the generation that was look after yourself first and foremost, why is their attitude any suprise? Its easy to blame governments....... it saves people having to point the finger at themself.
You should remember that that Lady organised a Task Force and sent it 7,000 miles to fight a superior sized army and Airforce, and win. All to save the lives and living qualities of British citizens. I can't see any of the current crop of "Leaders" doing the same.And as for the Labour Opposition of the day, well they would have rolled over and given the Argies anything.UK cannot do a similar action now, no fixed wing jets on a Carrier.
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triumphjon

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Re: Farewell Ark Royal
« Reply #32 on: November 26, 2010, 03:15:58 PM »

for those who may be interested there is to be a farewell service for the ark when she returns to portsmouth , as and when more details are known i shall post them here ! she is due back in portsmouth on the 3rd of december . jon
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DieselDo

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Re: Farewell Ark Royal
« Reply #33 on: November 26, 2010, 04:40:49 PM »

Nordsee,
That lady oversaw the complete decimation of the RN under John Nott.
Had the Falklands Conflict started 6 months later we could have never mounted such a campaign.
It was true that Dockyard "Mateys" were storing the fleet with the redundancy notices in their pockets.
It was just a matter of timing or that lady would have been blamed for losing the Falklands and destroying the RN.
Just like now it is happening all over again.
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Bryan Young

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Re: Farewell Ark Royal
« Reply #34 on: November 26, 2010, 06:09:09 PM »

Sorry DieselDo, but history does tend to distort a few things. All Prime Ministers act under received advice. No matter how clever, how well educated and so on, it's naive to think of any Prime Minister as an all-seeing oracle. No matter how they present themselves or how the press represents them. The base line here was surely the fact that one well connected (British) family more or less "owned" the Falklands, hadn't looked after the place or its people and basically just wanted out at some profit to themselves.
The then Governor of the Islands remonstrated with the Foreign Office but his opinions were largely ignored on the grounds that he "wasn't one of them", whereas the absentee Landlord was. It also didn't help that Salvesons had more or less said that anyone who wanted were quite welcome to go to South Georgia and help themselves to whatever they wanted. South Georgia comes under the auspices of the Governor of the Falkland Islands. And that's how it started. I know this because I got it first hand over a convivial few wets with the then Governor and his wife about a month after the liberation. So please don't blame Margaret Thatcher. Blame Lord "X" and in all probability Lord "V" who'd recently liquidated his vast holdings in Argentina.
Just as a rider..."The Argentine" as it used to be called before it coalesced into the country called "Argentina" had never "owned" the Falklands. Almost since the time of its discovery the islands had been colonised (to a minor degree) by the British (and some others) and was an important way-station on the trade route to the Antipodes.
So, Mr.Diesel, apart from not knowing your history, you are actually blaming the wrong person. BY.
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DieselDo

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Re: Farewell Ark Royal
« Reply #35 on: November 26, 2010, 09:41:57 PM »

Bryan,
Time after time we as a country disarm and reduce our armed forces.
It now seems that Korea is sabre rattling, we are over stretched as it is so we should not participate if anything happens, but with the US so paranoid about coalitions I have a feeling we will.

As to the Falklands specifically,
During the last previous labour Govt to M. Thatcher the Argentinians made overtures towards the Falkland Isles.
The response was to send a  Guided Missile Destroyer overcomplimented with Marines to make a "show of force".
What did M. Thatcher do, decommission HMS Endurance and make plans to decimate the RN.
What signs did this send out to possible invaders.

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Bryan Young

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Re: Farewell Ark Royal
« Reply #36 on: November 26, 2010, 10:19:14 PM »

Bryan,
Time after time we as a country disarm and reduce our armed forces.
It now seems that Korea is sabre rattling, we are over stretched as it is so we should not participate if anything happens, but with the US so paranoid about coalitions I have a feeling we will.

As to the Falklands specifically,
During the last previous labour Govt to M. Thatcher the Argentinians made overtures towards the Falkland Isles.
The response was to send a  Guided Missile Destroyer overcomplimented with Marines to make a "show of force".
What did M. Thatcher do, decommission HMS Endurance and make plans to decimate the RN.
What signs did this send out to possible invaders.


    Hi again. Moving on to 2010, in more than one respect I have to agree with you. However, my previous response was to your blaming one person....unfairly. John Nott really was a square peg in a round hole, but as Minister of Defence the PM whoever it may have been, had to listen and take advice from him and his "Department".
    I'm not to sure who listens to who this time around. Suck it see I suppose. BY.
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Colin Bishop

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Re: Farewell Ark Royal
« Reply #37 on: November 26, 2010, 10:39:04 PM »

I think the problem this time round is that the services are all trying to fight their own corner due to financial rather than strategic considerations and the PM is not necessarily getting truly unbiased advice. The priority at the moment is Afganistan but in my view this is ultimately a lost cause and in the bigger perspective a side show, just like Iraq was between the wars.

The truth is that genuinely serious military situations can arise with frightening speed from unexpected quarters but because the risk is unquantified politicians prefer to ignore it. This has always been the case and is the case now. Literally throwing away our most potent naval asset is very, very unwise.

Colin
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brianB6

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Re: Farewell Ark Royal
« Reply #38 on: November 26, 2010, 10:48:58 PM »

Maybe the current Korean 'war' will save her.
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RaaArtyGunner

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Re: Farewell Ark Royal
« Reply #39 on: November 27, 2010, 12:31:51 AM »

Maybe the current Korean 'war' will save her.

Probably not.  <:(

Don't forget that the Korean war occurred very shortly after WWII when we all had decent sized Armed forces albeight winding down.
In comparison today we all have zilch.  >>:-( >>:-(

Even allowing for technology, "supposedly Australia punches above its weight"  Our Armed Forces are weak, everyone is relying on everyone else, such as NATO, UN, coalitions, but it doesn't work.

Pollies still think they can negotiate rather than commit to having decent adequate Armed Forces. <:( <:( <*< <*<


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Circlip

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Re: Farewell Ark Royal
« Reply #40 on: November 27, 2010, 11:52:50 AM »

Don't forget, we can always rely on our Nuclear Submarines, - - - - that's providing the sand hasn't moved recently  {-)

  Regards  Ian.
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dreadnought72

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Re: Farewell Ark Royal
« Reply #41 on: November 28, 2010, 05:42:13 PM »

And while on this subject - does anyone want 10000 tonnes of scrap steel?

Going rate is a couple of million.  :o

Andy
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Enjoying every minute sailing W9465 Mertensia

triumphjon

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Re: Farewell Ark Royal
« Reply #42 on: November 28, 2010, 06:01:25 PM »

not enough room in my shed for that much ! although reading our local paper last week the price is good for iron , unfortunatly it will drop around christmas due to low demand !
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triumphjon

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Re: Farewell Ark Royal
« Reply #43 on: November 30, 2010, 08:48:39 PM »

TO ALL THOSE WHO WOULD LIKE TO SEE THE SHIP FOR POSSIBLY THE LAST TIME she is due back into portsmouth on friday the 3rd of december at approximatly 1000hrs !
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offshore1987

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Re: Farewell Ark Royal
« Reply #44 on: November 30, 2010, 10:53:16 PM »

They are tryin to sell the other one in the dock yard for 2 million lol, if i was rich id buy it and turn it into a airsoft site :P whats dream  :embarrassed:
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dreadnought72

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Re: Farewell Ark Royal
« Reply #45 on: December 01, 2010, 01:36:42 PM »

Not airsoft: I think the Invincible would make a perfect floating museum for remembering the Falklands Conflict.

...but then, what do I know?

Andy
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adam_goodin

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Re: Farewell Ark Royal
« Reply #46 on: December 03, 2010, 10:08:03 AM »

...so, who watched Ark Royal come home for the final time this morning?

 A very emotional moment for many people I imagine, but She looked great coming in through that mist with her Crew all out on Deck.

Farewell to a magnificent Old girl.
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Colin Bishop

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Re: Farewell Ark Royal
« Reply #47 on: December 03, 2010, 10:21:05 AM »

Betrayed by an incompetent Government!  >:-o
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Circlip

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Re: Farewell Ark Royal
« Reply #48 on: December 03, 2010, 11:19:19 AM »

Yep, the two "B's" have a lot to answer for :-))

  Regards   Ian.
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triumphjon

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Re: Farewell Ark Royal
« Reply #49 on: December 03, 2010, 03:59:41 PM »

it was an eiree sight seeing her appear through the morning fog , but worth the wait in the cold for ! forgot to pick up my camera so ive only got some pics on the phone which my partner will try to download later (its her phone really as i broke mine returning from the lake )  jon
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