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Author Topic: HMS Astute (again)  (Read 1429 times)

Bryan Young

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HMS Astute (again)
« on: December 12, 2010, 04:23:21 pm »

Not too long ago we all had a pretty lively discussion re the "Astute" running aground. Some responses indicated that the "charts" were out of date (not corrected "up to date"). I think I poo-poohed that notion, maintaining that such a new, "high-tech" and expensive vessel would have electronic charts that would be automatically upgraded (corrected). I said that in the knowledge that knowing the latest RFAs have this facility (and they're normally the last ships to be given the latest stuff) I just couldn't imagine that "Astute" wouldn't be so equipped. I was wrong. I read today (Sunday 12 Dec) that she was operating with folios of paper charts that need to be corrected manually, as and when the latest "corrections" arrive via the GPO postal system. She will not get the elesctronic "stuff" until her first major upgrade, whenever that may be! My mind boggles at this. For a vessel that has cost in excess of 1billion, that needs every navigational device available (surface and sub-surface), this omission is unforgiveable. BY.
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Notes from a simple seaman

Capt Podge

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Re: HMS Astute (again)
« Reply #1 on: December 12, 2010, 05:37:44 pm »

Hi Bryan,

Just out of curiosity - does the NAVO do his own corrections or are they entrusted to 1 or more ratings - it's just a thought.
I know the "baby" R/Os' used to get lumbered with ALRSs' and they could be months behind !

Regards,

Ray.
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Bryan Young

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Re: HMS Astute (again)
« Reply #2 on: December 12, 2010, 06:41:40 pm »

During "my time" as a Nav, who was usually a 2/O, he was responsible for the upkeep of all Navigational publications. Some of these such as "Light Lists" were farmed out to (say) the3/O. In the days of pen and ink this was a massive task. But in the "commercail" world the poor 2/O wouldn't have to endure the torture of being "investigated" by the Portland "Auditors", when every dot and comma was perused. I really can't over-emphasise how onerous this job of maintaining perhaps 5,000 charts was. The USN had a better idea, and that was to appoint a "Navigators Yeoman" who would spend his days "maintaining the paperwork". Good...up to a point. Although it was a really lousy job it did actually teach you an awful lot about the nooks and crannies of the world. Similarly, the advent of electronic charts makes the job easier, but at the expense of the Navs knowledge of geography...and that knowledge is hard earned, but vital. Swings and roundabouts I suppose. The monthly (?) issue of the "Admiralty Notices To Mariners" was usually (and still is) about 50 pages thick of small print (no adverts).
I see you're from my neck of the woods...care to send me an e-mail via my address that's under the "profile button"...we may have some stuff in common. Regards, Bryan Young.
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Notes from a simple seaman

Capt Podge

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Re: HMS Astute (again)
« Reply #3 on: December 12, 2010, 06:56:59 pm »

Hi Bryan,

e-mail sent, should be with you shortly.

Ray.
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pugwash

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Re: HMS Astute (again)
« Reply #4 on: December 12, 2010, 07:14:05 pm »

Every surface ship I served on had a navigators yeoman - usually an RP1 (as radar ops were considered to to be far more intelligent than a gunner)
Even though it was a boring job it was considered a cushy number as they didnt have to do normal watches and a good one was usually well up to date
with his corrections.  I think Bryan, the  term originated in the RN and was copied by the USN. I don't know what the set up was in subs, but it beggers
belief that she was not fitted with e-charts whilst "in build"
Geoff
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DavieTait

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Re: HMS Astute (again)
« Reply #5 on: December 12, 2010, 07:28:12 pm »

There are several off the shelf PC based chart software solutions available ,you just plug a GPS into the PC and all the charts are in the PC memory ( all you'd need to do would be use the subs inertial navigation system without the depth ) , it is possible to update them with an update disc as far as I know as well. Fishing boats have been using electronic charts since the late 1980's ( we had a Koden CVP3500 colour plotter on the boat that used the small "floppy" discs that the Amstrad computers used back then , it was basic but worked , the current PC based ones are using charts that meet all of the demands of the MCA and let you go to sea without having paper charts aboard ). There are even combined chart plotter/depth sounder software that lets you see the sea floor in full 3d ( the charts include a wealth of data taken from a large amount of boats sonars that is stored in the memory )

PS Astute had to return to port again with cooling problems on her steam plant , small problem apparently and she will be back at sea next week

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-11977871





Modify this Olex software to show the subs depth and you have a great tool for the sub captain !!
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Davie Tait,
Scotland

DavieTait

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Re: HMS Astute (again)
« Reply #6 on: December 12, 2010, 08:36:25 pm »

^^ the plotter we had was a Decca CVP 3500 , we had a Koden sounder so got mixed up as it is 22 years ago now lol
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Davie Tait,
Scotland

Bryan Young

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Re: HMS Astute (again)
« Reply #7 on: December 13, 2010, 03:14:52 pm »

It would appear that our "Capt.Podge" is a phony!
Here was me expecting somebody "serious" and he turns out to be a member of TMBC that I'd been talking to in person only a few hours earlier! Aaargh, the shame of it. Never mind, I'll bide my time. Hurts me to say it, but "nice one" ex-buddy! BY.
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Notes from a simple seaman

BarryM

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Re: HMS Astute (again)
« Reply #8 on: December 13, 2010, 04:12:24 pm »

Bryan,

Did you think you had wound in another one?  You'll never sell that Nefertiti's pyramid golden cat-flap you picked up last time in Suez.  O0  %)

Cheers,

Barry M
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