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Author Topic: Mayhems Numbers and Newbie's Posts  (Read 5705 times)

Norseman

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Mayhems Numbers and Newbie's Posts
« on: May 31, 2011, 03:14:20 AM »

Hi

I've read right through the post 'what mayhem is about' and it prompted me to go look at numbers - and I'm not generally a numbers guy -so if my sums don't add up I do apologise.

Up front I'll say it's wrong to just use the forum to sell stuff, and I'll say newbies (like me) should at least try the search routine. As for twenty five posts I think that's good as long as Mayhem sees it as a way to involve people and no more than that. I've made twenty five posts that haven't really contributed a lot except I'm taking part, getting known, have chatted to other newbies (makes us both feel welcome) and I've asked some questions that looking at previous posts didn't help me get to know what I needed - your members had the experience to make suggestions. So choices -  I can take part even though I don't know much, or I can peep through the window and eventually I'll probably go away. Please look at mayhem's numbers

Mayhem shows 6.147 members in 123 pages at 50 members per page,

Below p.60 there are no contributions at all - thats about fifty percent of the membership have never made a post - I can't tell if they went away or still look in.
but before the end of p.32 (1600 members) those contributing above 6 posts have run out, and that's now roughly seventy five percent of those who joined aren't contributing or have gone away.
before end of p.17 (850 members) those contributing above 25 posts have run out - so that leaves about fourteen percent contributing as full Mayhemers.
So that means the forum keeps only about 14 percent of members willing to contribute by posting. On that basis it seems to me that Mayhem needs the newbies to ask daft questions, so you get to chat to them and they decide to stay, and in turn eventually they will really contribute.

and just for interest
before the end of p.8 (400 members) 100 posts have run out.
before the end of p.5 (250 members) 200 posts have run out.

As I said earlier my maths ain't great (especially with the magic mead long since opened). I don't mean to offer any offence to anyone in saying the above, and this is a great site. What do you think?   {:-{

Regards Norseman.
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Trooper63

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Re: Mayhems Numbers and Newbie's Posts
« Reply #1 on: May 31, 2011, 04:04:29 AM »

Hmm, I think; Why do I care?

As long as members are civil and polite to each other.

My dis-belief with the forum is the apparent and numerous posts within threads that have nothing to do with the original post.  In my community, If someone started a conversation, and during it others just started dropping in random unrelated comments, then they are rude (unless intoxicated, which is ok)

In my short time here, searching verges on being a waste of time, because there are so many unrelated comments buried that finding info is like finding a needle in a hay stack.

And whats with posts being allowed to openly bag another?   Respect seems to be missing from the forum, thats what I think.
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Peter Fitness

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Re: Mayhems Numbers and Newbie's Posts
« Reply #2 on: May 31, 2011, 05:07:07 AM »

You've done a lot of research there, Norseman, but I'm not quite sure what it proves, other than many who join the forum don't actively participate. I think that is about par for the course with many forums.

As each new member joins, they are sent a welcome message which outlines the aims and rules of Mayhem, and suggests ways of participating soon after joining. A number of newbies do just that but, as you point out, many never do. That is something completely beyond Mayhem's control, people make their own decisions as to whether they wish to post or not.

You say that in your 25 plus posts you haven't contributed a lot; I disagree, you have taken part in discussions and offered opinions, which is one of the reasons that Mayhem exists. The reason that the "25 contributory posts before listing an item for sale" rule was put in place was to stop people making use of Mayhem purely as a cheap alternative to eBay. The word "contributory" was added later so people didn't build up their count by making pointless comments.

Trooper63, you made a very good point about civility and politeness, two qualities which the moderators try hard to uphold. Occasionally we upset someone who believes that "free speech" is just that, in other words, he can say what he likes, when he likes, about whomever he likes, regardless of the language used. These people don't take kindly to moderation, however, and are often very vocal in their expressions of outrage if a moderator sanctions them. This site belongs to Martin, he set the rules and the moderating team does its best to maintain that standard. We also try to keep topics on track but, as the moderators only have a limited amount of time to devote to the forum, we don't always succeed.

With regard to the "Search" facility; I agree it can be somewhat frustrating at times but, by using the "advanced" search, it is usually possible to find what you are looking for. Martin pays for the site largely out of his own pocket, with help from some sponsors, and to introduce a much more comprehensive search capability would probably cost much more.

Peter Fitness,
Moderator.
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philk

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Re: Mayhems Numbers and Newbie's Posts
« Reply #3 on: May 31, 2011, 07:32:32 AM »

as they say

you can lead a horse to water but cannot make it drink

 :D
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Norseman

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Re: Mayhems Numbers and Newbie's Posts
« Reply #4 on: May 31, 2011, 08:46:05 AM »

As I said it was the full postings of 'what mayhem is all about' that prompted me to go look at numbers; but I admit the numbers don't reflect the site hits or whose making them - I had no way to look at that. Now everyone reads a post with their own bias (especially long and meandering posts) and my bias has to be the newbies. Nevertheless I could agree with people about sellers and some newbies being a bit lazy - so I made the effort to openly cede those points. But ........... I read the topic and thought many newbies (unsure of themselves / abilities, etc) would 'overall' feel the post a little 'anti newbie'. Now I'm sure I've expressed that poorly but I hope you will find the spirit of what I'm saying about encouraging participation by those tentative members out there because some people will find it quite daunting.

Trooper 63 made some good points about posts in general, and I thought it interesting that his initial reaction was 'why do I care?'. Well, in the 84% of lost or silent membership there must be a wealth of knowledge and info that doesn't make it onto the site for us to se and enjoy - and I have enjoyed reading a lot here. I quite like reading some meanderings as long as people do come back to the issue at hand. As for the search engine - ok it's a little frustrating - but it has also been responsible for my reading many posts that I wouldn't otherwise have done.

So do you think it important/unimportant to increase contributions to the site?

Regards Norseman
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pugwash

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Re: Mayhems Numbers and Newbie's Posts
« Reply #5 on: May 31, 2011, 09:14:22 AM »

Norseman who knows why someone registers - looks around for half an hour and then never comes back again.
Others come back and view but never post.  I know when I joined I asked  couple of questions but only posted
about 20 times in the first 18 months. Then I realised I could answer some of the questions, especially if they
were about warships.  Each to their own.  Some obviously dont have much of an interest in ship modelling
but just come on because they are bored or curious but can't see the pics so they register.
It is probably the same at 99% of websites round the world.
As long as the forum is active and the membership are happy why worry about the stats.
As for newcomers, I never felt n anti attitude when I joined - most people were very helpful,  just the odd ones
were a bit grumpy.  Its not surprising really you see the same questions come up about once a month
and occasionally you get someone on a bad day who comments about looking through the forum before
asking yet another version of the same question.
To add a  morbid note, though there are 6000+ members I bet quite a few have crossed the bar or a ill and no
longer make models and if they are new members nobody would notice.
The forum seems to thrive though we sometimes have our argumentative days, it usually settles down
and we get back to the hobby of making boats

Geoff
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Colin Bishop

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Re: Mayhems Numbers and Newbie's Posts
« Reply #6 on: May 31, 2011, 09:31:36 AM »

Non participating minorities are a fact of life. Just look at the number of people who attend football matches or follow it in the papers compared with those who actually play! Geoff is right, most people just have a curious look or maybe dabble a bit and lose interest. It's only a very small proportion who actually keep things turning over on a regular basis. Again, as with all Forums, there are people who come to 'take' without gving anything back in return. With regard to newbies there are some who are, shall we say, a bit lazy in preferring to get somebody else to answer questions that could be easily answered themselves if they could be bothered to take the time to do so. A question such as 'How do I build a model boat?' is likely to attract less response than someone who comes on and says 'I've been building such and such and am stuck on this particular issue'.

And of course there are a few people who think Forums are a public service and get annoyed when they don't get an immediate answer to their query.

Colin
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Nige52

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Re: Mayhems Numbers and Newbie's Posts
« Reply #7 on: May 31, 2011, 09:53:23 AM »

I ask lots of questions on here, for 2 reasons mainly.

1. The search function is less than adequate (IMHO)
2. Even though I own and sail many boats, I'm not an avid builder, so I ask technical questions. But I also answer specific questions if I have knowledge of the problem enquired about.

I believe a forum is just that, it's a discussion board where questions and answers are posted. Regarding the same questions coming up repeatedly, the stock answer off some is, do a search. Well if we all did that and the search function was good enough, there would be very few 'New' posts would there?  :-)

As for the statistics, I would have thought the only person really interested would be Martin and maybe the mods? I run forums myself and they are exactly the same as this one statistics wise, the majority of registered members hardly post anything, if at all, but who's really that concerned? I'm not  ok2

ATB
Nige

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Roadrunner

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Re: Mayhems Numbers and Newbie's Posts
« Reply #8 on: May 31, 2011, 09:53:41 AM »

Ah but out of the 6000+ members how many of them are alternate accounts for members still active? I'd say at least 25% of that total figure. ever notice how you get some 'idiot' turn up and start making posts to wind up the masses?

At the end of the day your not forced to post, some could be put off by the wait time for admin to accept your account so never return even once active, others simply just wish to have an account to post should they ever need to, but will just use the forum as reference or to watch the 'mayhem' and have a laugh at us!
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hopeitfloats

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Re: Mayhems Numbers and Newbie's Posts
« Reply #9 on: May 31, 2011, 10:05:51 AM »

i dont contribute a lot to the model making side of the forums mainly because my skill levels at the moment are beginner to average but i do enjoy reading the threads and have taken on board a lot of hints and tips from them without neccessarily commenting on it. when i have asked questions most members are very helpful. you will always get the odd smart comment  but you take the bad with the good.  maybe some of the no posters are doing the same ie. reading but not posting.
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jimmy2310

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Re: Mayhems Numbers and Newbie's Posts
« Reply #10 on: May 31, 2011, 10:36:06 AM »

I'm like "hopeitfloats" I spend most of my time on here reading the posts to learn from the more experienced modellers, reading the tips and hints and the photos help me a lot because I'm only a learner at modelling and I make the odd comment when I feel confident enough to contribute.

Jimmy.
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Norseman

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Re: Mayhems Numbers and Newbie's Posts
« Reply #11 on: May 31, 2011, 11:13:02 AM »

Hi

just to pull another brick from under my own post - you guys probably do a lot of PM's that don't figure in the post stats I looked at - so there's unseen activity going on too.

Norseman
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wibplus

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Re: Mayhems Numbers and Newbie's Posts
« Reply #12 on: May 31, 2011, 04:07:02 PM »

as they say

you can lead a horse to water but cannot make it drink

 :D

Or, as Laurel & Hardy said............. "you can take a horse to water........................but a pencil must be lead."  %%   %%   {-)   {-)   {-)
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Norseman

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Re: Mayhems Numbers and Newbie's Posts
« Reply #13 on: May 31, 2011, 04:52:28 PM »

if we are still talking about not posting then I prefer Rab C Nesbitts ' I'll sail this ship alone' -  Ha I really wish I could have posted that in character  :}

Norseman
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dave301bounty

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Re: Mayhems Numbers and Newbie's Posts
« Reply #14 on: May 31, 2011, 08:34:37 PM »

These two previous posts ,,they are priceless bits of comedy .well done .
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bikemec

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Re: Mayhems Numbers and Newbie's Posts
« Reply #15 on: May 31, 2011, 09:19:32 PM »

I know my post count isn't high, but I only get to check in one every few days

most times where I know the answer to a question someone else has got there first

I enjoy reading the posts and have learn't a lot. And now sumer is here I'll get on here less as it's my busy time at work probably no modeling until october
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philk

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Re: Mayhems Numbers and Newbie's Posts
« Reply #16 on: May 31, 2011, 10:24:47 PM »

if we are still talking about not posting then I prefer Rab C Nesbitts ' I'll sail this ship alone' -  Ha I really wish I could have posted that in character  :}

Norseman


is that because you have his haircut

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Bryan Young

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Re: Mayhems Numbers and Newbie's Posts
« Reply #17 on: May 31, 2011, 11:03:21 PM »

When I joined this forum a few years ago I joined with the belief that it was all about Model Boats / Ships and so on.
As both a retired seafarer and a ship modeller I thought that the combination of my two areas of "expertise" could possibly be of benefit to those who may well be very good modellers, but perhaps lacked the practical knowledge gained by actually being bounced around on "the real things".
This attitude of mine met with a somewhat mixed reception. I agree that I probably came on a bit strong in my earlier postings...but I was soon put in my place about that! Even though it was all well intentioned. At that stage I really had no notion that so many members of this forum were more interested in "other things" (as opposed to modelling). This sort of (non-modelling) aspect would appear to be pretty prevalent now.
For myself. I'd prefer the forum to get back to its roots and chuck out a lot of the dross that's being posted.
So many "modellers" who are posting don't even know what scale they are building at. But they buy RTR boats and still get into trouble. I despair sometimes. It's all very well "just getting a boat on the water"...but please try to learn at least a little about the boat you have. And restrict postings to problems you can't solve for yourself instead of just wanting a "quick fix".   BY.
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Notes from a simple seaman

CF-FZG

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Re: Mayhems Numbers and Newbie's Posts
« Reply #18 on: May 31, 2011, 11:13:14 PM »

Some interesting replies as to why many people register but don't post much or at all. 
A good point mentioned was that you can't see the piccies unles you register - that explains quite a few then :-)) 
Others will register and spend a lot of time browsing/reading what interests them but not post unless they feel they have something to contribute, (and if they've received a 'not particularly welcoming response' to their opinions they will tend to keep their mouths shut in the future), and that's a sad reflection on how 'noobies' can be treated on forums <*<

In general, (on model aircraft forums, as I've only been on here since March), I've found posters tend towards 4 groups -

1. Those who post for the sake of it - usually very high post counts but not a lot of sense being said %)
2. Those who post to pass on info/techniques - usually through build threads or information threads :-))
3. Those who spend more time asking and looking than posting - usually beginners and people researching particular subjects :-))
4. Those who disappear quite quickly - usually new members who get 'the hump' with the way they've been treated for asking simple questions, (a sad reflection on the forum) <*<

As an aside, I've just looked at my own stats on some other forums, the most interesting is one I've paid for lifetime membership - a member for over 7 years but only 44 posts {:-{  most members fall into #2 or #3 above.  Yet a UK based forum that has (too many IMO) off topic areas - tends towards #1 on my list.  There used to be a lot of #2 and #3, but quite a lot of those have migrated to the 'pay site' I mentioned, mainly to talk about scale models than general niff-naff and trivia that seems to be taking over.

Where do I see myself - probably between #2 and #3, on here, as a beginner to boating, defo more #3 ok2


Mark.
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CF-FZG

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Re: Mayhems Numbers and Newbie's Posts
« Reply #19 on: May 31, 2011, 11:19:02 PM »

When I joined this forum a few years ago I joined with the belief that it was all about Model Boats / Ships and so on.
As both a retired seafarer and a ship modeller I thought that the combination of my two areas of "expertise" could possibly be of benefit to those who may well be very good modellers, but perhaps lacked the practical knowledge gained by actually being bounced around on "the real things".
This attitude of mine met with a somewhat mixed reception. I agree that I probably came on a bit strong in my earlier postings...but I was soon put in my place about that! Even though it was all well intentioned. At that stage I really had no notion that so many members of this forum were more interested in "other things" (as opposed to modelling). This sort of (non-modelling) aspect would appear to be pretty prevalent now.
For myself. I'd prefer the forum to get back to its roots and chuck out a lot of the dross that's being posted.

Interesting Bryan, I had a similar reception on a model aircraft forum with my background of 30+ years in aviation maintenance/production.  I agree with you about restricting the 'off topic' areas :-))


Mark.
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Peter Fitness

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Re: Mayhems Numbers and Newbie's Posts
« Reply #20 on: June 01, 2011, 12:21:38 AM »

Personally, I see nothing wrong with having some so-called "off topic" boards on the Forum. There are 3 such boards on Mayhem, "Chit Chat", "Other Hobbies and Interests", and "Humour" two of which give members a chance to exchange views on subjects other than boats, and the other an opportunity to have a laugh. If anyone feels that these boards are inappropriate for a Forum such as Model Boat Mayhem, then the best solution is quite simple...don't read them %).

I have done some maths of my own and found that the 3 "off topic" boards I mentioned have, between them, attracted 61,487 posts in 3,731 topics, out of a total (at the time of writing) of 293,838 posts in 18,836 topics. This equates to about 21% of the total posts in 19.8% of the total topics. Given that the board on which this very discussion is taking place, "Chit Chat" has, on its own, 51,490 posts in 2,964 topics, I don't think that's too bad.

In my time on the forum (nearly 4 years) I have not seen many instances of newbies being ridiculed for their inquiries, and usually any such ridicule or disparaging remark about a newbie attracts a reprimand from a moderator. Such behaviour is to be deplored, and is actively discouraged by the moderating team. Also, members seeing any such behaviour should use the "Report to Moderator" button.

Peter.
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RaaArtyGunner

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Re: Mayhems Numbers and Newbie's Posts
« Reply #21 on: June 01, 2011, 01:20:47 AM »

Basically the statistics are not representative of the forum.
Is it the perennial question that some are not confident at public speaking, which essentially is what taking part in the forum is.
Also because we have some very able and knowledgeable contributers/commentators (masterclass) in the various threads, these may seem very daunting to the newbies, like who wants to hear what a newbie thinks or has to say.
Every member needs to be encouraged to 'have their 2 bob's worth' as we are all able to learn no matter how 'expert/experienced' we are.
Then there is the question of Computer literacy/ability and not being able to post images and the ability to type etc.
For instance I recall the problems I had trying to upload images and how I was helped by forum members to downsize images etc for posting.
So I don't see it all being restricted to only 'boats' as improvements in computer skills assits postings and assits the forum.
And last but not least the tendency, which has now greatly diminished to criticise spelling errors etc.
What is interesting is those 'regular' posters who have stopped posting, and why.
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pugwash

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Re: Mayhems Numbers and Newbie's Posts
« Reply #22 on: June 01, 2011, 07:50:52 AM »

There is one thing that would make me help a newcomer to the forum - If someone comes in with a post like " could anybody help please
Blah Blah thank you" I would be quite happy to spend a bit of time in trying to give them an answer, BUT when you get " I want, I need
etc etc"  with no hint of politeness I will more often than not ignore the post. It may be oldfashioned but I like good manners and have
brought my children up that way so why shouldn't I expect the same from somebody who wants help.
If I have spent perhaps an hour researching something for a newby (which was probably online and he could have got for himself - if he
wasnt too busy, had the ability or wasnt too lazy) is it too much to expect a thankyou!!

Geoff
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DickyD

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Re: Mayhems Numbers and Newbie's Posts
« Reply #23 on: June 01, 2011, 08:09:33 AM »

Ah but out of the 6000+ members how many of them are alternate accounts for members still active? I'd say at least 25% of that total figure. ever notice how you get some 'idiot' turn up and start making posts to wind up the masses?

 ok2 ok2 O0 O0 O0 O0
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Re: Mayhems Numbers and Newbie's Posts
« Reply #24 on: June 01, 2011, 08:43:13 AM »

Ah but out of the 6000+ members how many of them are alternate accounts for members still active? I'd say at least 25% of that total figure. ever notice how you get some 'idiot' turn up and start making posts to wind up the masses?


Ah you mean the people who have not got the GUTS to post under there own name, then claim it was there dog , Granddad , son who did it when found out.

Peter
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