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Author Topic: In the News !!!  (Read 957376 times)

Martin (Admin)

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Re: In the News !!!
« Reply #2350 on: March 26, 2024, 03:22:02 pm »


 .... no picture  {:-{
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Martin (Admin)

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Re: In the News !!!
« Reply #2351 on: March 26, 2024, 04:13:49 pm »

 
BBC:  Francis Scott Key Bridge, Baltimore, has collapsed after container ship hit main support.

         https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/world-us-canada-68667813
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Baldrick

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Re: In the News !!!
« Reply #2352 on: March 26, 2024, 04:24:22 pm »

News report is that the ship lost all power, not a terrorist incident which was originally mooted.
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TheLongBuild

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Re: In the News !!!
« Reply #2353 on: March 26, 2024, 06:31:42 pm »

Well that's the press for you, terrorist attack my $%^&, 1:30 am very little traffic and the vessel sent out Mayday message which apparently helped stop some traffic.
If you are going to to an attack you choose a busy time, boy the press are muppets.

Colin Bishop

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Re: In the News !!!
« Reply #2354 on: March 26, 2024, 07:00:42 pm »

Seems to have closed off much of the port of Baltimore until all that mangled steelwork has been removed.

Bridges have been hit in the past but usually just one span falls down and the damage is limited. This bridge seems to have behaved as if it was spring loaded and just burst apart. Demonstrates what stresses are concealed in a bridge structure.

Colin
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derekwarner

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Re: In the News !!!
« Reply #2355 on: March 26, 2024, 08:25:07 pm »

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Derek Warner

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Martin (Admin)

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Re: In the News !!!
« Reply #2356 on: March 27, 2024, 05:34:52 am »



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kinmel

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Re: In the News !!!
« Reply #2357 on: March 27, 2024, 08:53:52 am »

Last night an expert explained that the elevated section is in fact continuosly connected and supported on four bases.  I doubt the 1970's design criteria included the need to remain standing after stopping a 100,000 tonnes ship in 10metres
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Baldrick

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Re: In the News !!!
« Reply #2358 on: March 27, 2024, 09:32:33 am »




   The design of this bridge was like a set of old scales . The support pillars not only held the deck up but were a fulcrum with the decks either side balancing the load . The effect of the container ship taking one of the support pillars out was also to destroy the balance of the remaining structure .
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Circlip

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Re: In the News !!!
« Reply #2359 on: March 27, 2024, 04:13:34 pm »

Original report inferred the bridge was in collision with the boat - - - - -


  Regards  Ian
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Geoff

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Re: In the News !!!
« Reply #2360 on: March 27, 2024, 04:36:22 pm »

Its going to be expensive, in the region of $3 billion. Bridge, ship, wrongful deaths, wreckage clearance, consequential losses as port closed for god knows how long, increased costs of journey times as effectively the city has been cut in two etc. It may well prove to be the biggest loss in maritime history!


Geoff
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Martin (Admin)

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Re: In the News !!!
« Reply #2361 on: March 27, 2024, 06:46:36 pm »


Good point Geoff....  {:-{

Is the ship now grounded / wedged in position?
 
 
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kinmel

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Re: In the News !!!
« Reply #2362 on: March 27, 2024, 09:26:35 pm »

More "pinned" in position !
Forty years ago another ship hit this bridge and it survived, America will need to survey an awful lot of bridges to see if they would fare better.
https://edition.cnn.com/2024/03/27/us/key-bridge-historic-crash-invs/index.html
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Colin Bishop

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Re: In the News !!!
« Reply #2363 on: March 27, 2024, 09:46:57 pm »

This design of truss bridge does seem vulnerable to catastrophic failure. Hit one support and the whole thing comes tumbling down.

Colin
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Martin (Admin)

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Re: In the News !!!
« Reply #2364 on: March 27, 2024, 10:59:41 pm »

 
Reminds me of a documentary on the 1980 Sunshine Skyway Bridge tragedy :
https://youtu.be/3gfgJgYaMyA?si=Qt1jCINTg-eb710F
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derekwarner

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Re: In the News !!!
« Reply #2365 on: March 27, 2024, 11:18:55 pm »

Another boat-bridge incident from Hobart Tasmania, however the vessel had a home namesake of Illawarra....5 January 1975 or some 49 years ago


[Wollongong is a City in the NSW area of Illawarra]


https://www.spatialsource.com.au/scanning-the-wreck-of-the-ss-lake-illawarra/


Derek
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Derek Warner

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kinmel

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Re: In the News !!!
« Reply #2366 on: March 27, 2024, 11:39:04 pm »


The first drone survey of the damaged bridge has been released,  the biggest shock is the incredibly small size of the pads and pivots that supported the spans.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6P1x1ifFHsY
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warspite

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Re: In the News !!!
« Reply #2367 on: March 28, 2024, 08:50:08 am »

How many 500+ tonne lifting barges / ships, dredgers are on the way to clear the majority of what can be moved, so they can clear a channel to resume trade through the port.


They could use LA, its a shorter route to the states, just means more frequent railfreight across country in the mid term.
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Geoff

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Re: In the News !!!
« Reply #2368 on: March 28, 2024, 11:38:36 am »

The pads and pivots are rollers to allow for the natural expansion and contraction of the bridge girder. All big bridges are built this way as otherwise it puts unacceptable sideways pressure on the support pillars and struts.


The bridge itself seems to be in very good condition in terms of painting etc. Just a terrible accident.


Geoff
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kinmel

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Re: In the News !!!
« Reply #2369 on: March 28, 2024, 11:46:39 am »

1,100 US Army engineers are en-route to Baltimore, they are responsible for maintaining navigation on the major rivers and waterways.
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JerryTodd

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Baltimore's Francis Scott Key Bridge
« Reply #2370 on: March 28, 2024, 07:17:38 pm »

I worked on the water in and out of Baltimore since I was 16.  Watched them build that bridge while I was in Junior High school, and would hang out at Fort McHenry after school.  I've been over and under it more often than I can count, the last time under it was in October 2023.  The boat is my friend Mark's, who's a tug boat captain in Baltimore harbor; one of the tugs that assisted the Dali off her berth in fact, though he was ashore, off-duty at the time.  He's on the scene in his tug now as I type this.

Another pic is passing under the bridge while leaving Baltimore on Gazela Primeiro in 1978.  (I don't know who's picture it is, I was on the boat at the time)  The bridge opened in March 1977.

There's been talk about ship-strike protection around the base of the piers as long as I can remember.  After it was bumped by a ship in 1980 (?) and especially after the Sunshine bridge collapse in Tampa Bay that same year;  yet, no protection was ever added to it, or to the double span of the Chesapeake Bay bridges further south which another potential disaster.  There have only been 4 dolphins since it was built, and the Dali didn't touch the one before the pier she hit.  The scuttlebutt on the subject came up again when the Ever Forward grounded in Chesapeake.
There will probably be some sort of procedure implemented to have tugs stay with ships - with a line on - till they clear the (new) bridge, coming and going, and/or a speed limit while approaching the bridge (she got up to 8.7 knots based on tracking data).Tugs typically meet incoming ships outside or at the bridge and escort them in, but seldom follow them out when leaving.

I'm really glad my friend was off-duty when it happened, because I've already seen the Dunning-Kruger crowd try to lay blame on the tugs "leaving early."

Martin (Admin)

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Re: In the News !!!
« Reply #2371 on: March 28, 2024, 10:13:15 pm »


Great info, photos Jerry, thanks for posting!   :-))
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Martin (Admin)

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Re: In the News !!!
« Reply #2372 on: March 28, 2024, 10:15:17 pm »


Question: I can understand the main engine failing, but why would the lights go out?
                  Isn't it usual that modern ships to supply electrical power from auxiliary engines, for just this reason? 


 
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derekwarner

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Re: In the News !!!
« Reply #2373 on: March 28, 2024, 11:08:57 pm »

Martin...the vessels Black Box will confirm the actuals, however the following would appear as norms


Vessels of this Class have ..
One main propulsion engine - relatively low speed........~~~~~150 RPM max
Two or three diesel generators....medium speed.........~~~~~~2500 RPM
One emergency diesel generator....medium/high speed....~~~~3500 RPM
Two electro/hydraulic steering supply systems
----------------


The vessel traversing open ocean, the main [propulsion] engine is supported by one only diesel generator providing engine & engine room control + auxiliaries and household electrical requirements....... one only electro/hydraulic system is employed at these times


Prior to entering, maneuvering or departing a berth or Port, it is usual that a second diesel generator is bought online, and balanced as a backup support with the first diesel generator. It is also a norm, for the second electro/hydraulic system to also be bought online

The emergency generator supplies control power for the main engine, and also sets of emergency lighting strategically placed around the vessel, however different circuits to the vessel general lighting... I understand it is not uncommon for the emergency generator to be run & functionality tested every Sunday morning when at sea. The actual sequence for the run & test of the emergency generator are requirement under the vessels insurance   

The changeover between light [low sulphur fuel for Port areas] to heavy Bunker Sea fuel is also a standard procedure to occur when the vessel is clear and out of the nominated inland or approach waterways 


The sequence of loss of main engine propulsion, created by the loss of one diesel generator?, apparent electrical blackout and re-establishment of electrical power and the large plume blackened exhaust gases will be confirmed when that Black Box data is revealed


Derek


PS......naturally running a second gen set, running the second electro/hydraulic system and delaying the changeover to Bunker sea fuel are all costs to the shipping Company


 
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Derek Warner

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Martin (Admin)

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Re: In the News !!!
« Reply #2374 on: March 29, 2024, 12:24:04 am »


Thanks Derek, very interesting!

 Many very important questions to be addressed!
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