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Author Topic: Trumpeter Kilo 1/144  (Read 22356 times)

Subculture

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Re: Trumpeter Kilo 1/144
« Reply #50 on: December 14, 2011, 09:56:01 am »

Steel gears will rust up, or do they mean stainless steel?

Kavan pumps use lapped brass gears, but their pump is a bit on the large size for some models.

coolbumble

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Re: Trumpeter Kilo 1/144
« Reply #51 on: December 15, 2011, 11:22:03 pm »

Hi
Thanks for that checked with them and they confirmed they were steel and would rust !!! Kindly returned my payment !

Once again Many Thanks
Ian  :-))
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Re: Trumpeter Kilo 1/144
« Reply #52 on: December 16, 2011, 10:53:59 am »

Probably be okay for pumping fuel, but not water.

coolbumble

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Re: Trumpeter Kilo 1/144
« Reply #53 on: December 16, 2011, 11:05:48 am »

Yes they said they did it for smoke but advertised it also for water. They intend to do a correct mod for water later !!!

I :-))an
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Re: Trumpeter Kilo 1/144
« Reply #54 on: December 16, 2011, 12:50:25 pm »

Well ask them to make the gears in brass, then it will be a superb little pump. If they can also supply them with a 12 volt motor, then they will have a great range of pumps for water pump ballast systems.

coolbumble

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Re: Trumpeter Kilo 1/144
« Reply #55 on: December 16, 2011, 04:53:39 pm »

I have advised them of that .

A few pics of my pinch valve I have just completed to go inside the 44mm diameter wtc.

Made from a 5 gram servo and modified servo arm (disc) the valve is attached to the servo and the assembly glued to a back plate enabling it to be placed vertical in the wtc.
 
Ian  :-))







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coolbumble

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Re: Trumpeter Kilo 1/144
« Reply #56 on: January 02, 2012, 11:50:45 pm »

Well another year gone and my trumpeter KILO  project looking a little sad. After trying the system out its not very successful with to much "gagetry" and inside pressure for a small WTC So I have decided to abandon that particular route and go for my other option . Have ordered a few parts that I need and will post the results later.
 Out of interest You note I ordered a water pump with replacement metal gears from China but they agreed to cancelled as the metal  gears would go rusty. They returned my money promptly via Paypal . However Friday it arrived recorded delivery !! emailed them offered to return it but the got back to me immediately saying please do not bother to costly for you keep it as a present !! NOW thats service !!!Now in a box never know might be useful one day as a smoke pump.


HAPPY NEW YEAR EVERYONE and thanks for all the advice :-))
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redboat219

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Re: Trumpeter Kilo 1/144
« Reply #57 on: January 03, 2012, 05:05:47 am »

If you're concerned about pressure inside the WTC why not use  a vented tank. This way you can use the gear pump you have. Couple it with an ESC with reverse to vent/ blow the tank. 
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Davy1

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Re: Trumpeter Kilo 1/144
« Reply #58 on: January 03, 2012, 01:44:00 pm »

A shame about you having to backtrack on a diving system.

It occurs to me that you have almost everything (pinch valve,pumps etc) for a pressure tank system.

That would give you no  pressure rise in your WTC. The only downside is that the pressure tank needs about an extra third of volume for the compressed air space.

Could be worth thinking about.

And yes, a Happy New Year to all the Readers!

David
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Re: Trumpeter Kilo 1/144
« Reply #59 on: January 03, 2012, 02:16:18 pm »

What problems was the pressure causing- was air leaking past the shaft seals?

Davy1

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Re: Trumpeter Kilo 1/144
« Reply #60 on: January 03, 2012, 03:05:17 pm »

Happy New Year, Andy!

David
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coolbumble

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Re: Trumpeter Kilo 1/144
« Reply #61 on: January 03, 2012, 06:07:52 pm »

Thank you all for your interest and suggestions much appreciated
It was just with all the gagetry to get this "working" voltage drop for pump, reversing switch, pinch valve, ESC,  etc etc in a 44mm width WTC using a balloon and a reversing system for the water a little to much and without a separate cylinder for the balloon I had a few floods also one needed more than dexterity with the receiver making sure with such a powerful pump the pinch valve was open or shut as with such a small valve I could only get sufficient movement on the arm by using the Auxiliary mode on my receiver to work it Also with all the weight and ballast needed to keep it upright it was to low in the water I  thought. I did have it working in the "sink" and videoed it to post it here but found the site would not accept the video!!
 Any way decided I needed a smaller pump and less electronics more room less weight and a separate cylinder for the water so that is the way I am going No I didn't have any leaks from the push rod or prop seals but pushed the wtc apart at the joins !! I know it could be bolted together but more weight more fiddling so time to stop I thought. I am now going to use a small air pump and  RACBS with a balloon in a separate cylinder which has holes around it so when the balloon is inflated it pushes the water out and deflated back in Hopefully simpler and was my first option,  just hope I've enough air PHEW
Ian  :-))
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Re: Trumpeter Kilo 1/144
« Reply #62 on: January 03, 2012, 09:04:14 pm »

Ron Perrott uses a very elegant method of holding end caps on for a pressurised cylinder- the saddles that hold the cylinder double up as end stops for the caps- as these are glued into the bottom of the hull, it prevents the endcaps from popping off when the boat takes on ballast.

You can get some bags which are very strong, and shouldn't burst unless you go mad. They're the foil lined type used for sports drinks like Lucozade. I also have some bags that were sent to me by another board member which held baby food and are of similar construction. These are smaller- 120ml capacity.

You could always ballast it down and operate it as a dynamic diver, not as slick, but still a lot of fun to operate.

coolbumble

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Re: Trumpeter Kilo 1/144
« Reply #63 on: January 03, 2012, 09:40:33 pm »

Hi
I actually did that for one end and brass 1/8 pins at the base in the end caps fitting into brass sleeves in the hull but possibly putting saddles all round top and bottom in the middle and each end would do the trick thanks for the info . And the bags
Ian  :-))
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coolbumble

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Re: Trumpeter Kilo 1/144
« Reply #64 on: January 06, 2012, 10:12:06 pm »

Hi

All probably basic stuff
Well I'm going ahead with the balloon idea Inflating / deflating a balloon in a separate compartment which will be surrounded with holes to let the water in and squeeze it out to submerge and surface !! obviously I have to have a tube going through it to connect the two other compartments  1. for the receiver leads and power and 2. for the air to work the RCABS 
Just playing with it to get ideas etc testing balloons and seeing how well they inflate with the inner connecting tube placed inside a few pics of this. No holes in the outer yet just testing I found a round balloon was better than a "sausage" one
The tube going through the top of the compartment being the best way as it should empty first automatically as the boat rises out of the water !!  The compartment will be placed in the middle  of the WTC

Ian  :-)) 









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Sub driver

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Re: Trumpeter Kilo 1/144
« Reply #65 on: January 06, 2012, 10:30:26 pm »

Why bother with the baloon ?. Just remove the air out of the fixed wall ballast tank with the compressor / pump and store it in the pump compartment as it will be under pressure then vent back into the ballast tank to surface, no need for the balloon.  Most of my boats work this way simples.   Regards sub
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Re: Trumpeter Kilo 1/144
« Reply #66 on: January 06, 2012, 11:04:18 pm »

Further to the above. You will then only need one hole at the bottom of the ballast tank to allow the water in and out and one inlet at the top of the bulkhead on the ballast tank to allow the air in and out from the pump and compartment. The surfacing is done via a schrader valve , which is a cut down rubber removed car tyre valve operated from the servo arm that is on the other side of the throw from the micro switch that operates the pump. No pinch valves or other stuff taking space up.the valve goes into the inlet tube via a t piece connector. Will show you photos if needed. The beauty of this system especially for a small boat is that you only ever run the pump one way to submerge as surfacing is free, also helps battery longevity and no reversing switches and other crap  but do fit a failsafe.  Regards sub.
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coolbumble

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Re: Trumpeter Kilo 1/144
« Reply #67 on: January 06, 2012, 11:15:24 pm »

Hi
Many many thanks for that I was thinking about where the holes should be Would appreciate any pictures diagrams you have I have made the schrader type of valve for my Revell V11c and even have a spare made so I am OK with that and have micro switches
Thank you
Ian
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Re: Trumpeter Kilo 1/144
« Reply #68 on: January 07, 2012, 12:59:41 pm »

Quote
Just remove the air out of the fixed wall ballast tank with the compressor / pump and store it in the pump compartment

You'll need some means of water level detection for that though won't you, else the compressor could start sucking in water and soaking the dry space.

redboat219

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Re: Trumpeter Kilo 1/144
« Reply #69 on: January 07, 2012, 03:13:39 pm »

You'll need some means of water level detection for that though won't you, else the compressor could start sucking in water and soaking the dry space.

Well how about installing a float valve. As the water level in the ballast tank rises it closes the intake off preventing water from getting into the dry space.

A simpler way would be to still use the balloon-   Reverse  RCABS.

The balloon in it's base state is already inflated. The compressor/airpump pulls air out of the balloon and stores it in the dry space. Use a servo operated schrader valve to reinflate the balloon. 
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Re: Trumpeter Kilo 1/144
« Reply #70 on: January 07, 2012, 04:39:43 pm »

Andy. In an ideal world yes, but we are very limited for space here, all my subs have such a circuit that I built to prevent hydrolocking the comp and flooding the pressue hull. But I think that on this build the wtc is probably just about level with the water and the sub will only need a small amount of ballast to achieve neg bouyancy so the ballast tank should be no where near full.     Redboat I still would not use the balloon for the following reasons a) it will perish and leave a very nasty  sticky mess in the central ballast tank and will be a right job removing said mess and b)  you will need to input air into the balloon initially and you are relying on that air to keep surfaced. This way the air that is naturally in the tank is just recycled.   Regards sub.
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Re: Trumpeter Kilo 1/144
« Reply #71 on: January 07, 2012, 05:21:00 pm »

The folk using the RCABS system tend to use blood pressure monitor cuff inserts as opposed to a balloon.

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Re: Trumpeter Kilo 1/144
« Reply #72 on: January 07, 2012, 05:55:09 pm »

You dont need it,  why put something in the tank that is not required ??.  The ones that do use it tend to have the cuff / balloon/ rubber bag in the water and not in the fixed wall ballast tank ie dave welches design. it is just a waste of time all you are doing is placing air into a bag inside a sealed space its pointless. You might as well just put it into the space and save money and time . Just my opinion .......ps just make sure the micro switch is    agood one and rated about 10 amps to be on thd safe side so it doesnt overheat and weld the contacts together...been there done that  lol...regards sub.
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Re: Trumpeter Kilo 1/144
« Reply #73 on: January 07, 2012, 06:13:58 pm »

I prefer hard tanks to bag, but it does act as a barrier and prevents moist air entering the dry space, so your electronics don't have to work in a humid fog, and also should you be unlucky, and the pump sticks on for some reason, it won't flood the boat.

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Re: Trumpeter Kilo 1/144
« Reply #74 on: January 07, 2012, 07:22:06 pm »

Coolbumble pm sent.
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