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Author Topic: HMS Pelorus 1897  (Read 11840 times)

victorian

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HMS Pelorus 1897
« on: October 08, 2007, 03:13:52 pm »

Just a quick plea before I make any (more) mistakes for any photos of HMS Pelorus or any other Pelorus class cruisers. I've trawled the very depths of Google but apart from the usual suspects (the wonderful battleships-cruisers for instance) it's all a bit thin. I've also got the official shots from the PRO but they are too far away to answer many nagging questions.

Does anyone know of an existing builder's model of these ships? Any information would be most welcome.

Thanks in anticipation.
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dreadnought72

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Re: HMS Pelorus 1897
« Reply #1 on: October 08, 2007, 03:43:16 pm »

http://www.worldwar1.co.uk/light-cruiser/hms-Pelorous.html lists the building yards which might give you a hint to locations of any builders' models. But she's a sweet looking vessel - what size is the model going to be?

Andy
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Enjoying every minute sailing W9465 Mertensia

victorian

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Re: HMS Pelorus 1897
« Reply #2 on: October 08, 2007, 05:02:28 pm »

Dreadnought

Thanks for the suggestion re: builders.

She is 1/96 using the Deans Marine hull which is very good apart from being full in the stern (They've produced a modern cruiser stern rather than the fine lines of the real ship). I've not tried to modify that since only you and I know about it.

She is a very pretty little ship and has been sailing this weekend with a mock-up superstructure. I'll add a photo later. The main problem is providing deck hatches because the superstructure is so small. That's why I'm looking for photos showing the decks.

Performance is startling with two 385 motors and 9.6v Nimh - about 150 kts scale speed!
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victorian

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Re: HMS Pelorus 1897
« Reply #3 on: May 14, 2008, 02:26:39 pm »

Here's a pic courtesy of Jeremy showing Pelorus and Mars on the water together for the first time. There's still much to be done on the detailing front.

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Edward Pinniger

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Re: HMS Pelorus 1897
« Reply #4 on: May 14, 2008, 07:27:46 pm »

Two very impressive models! Pelorus is a very elegant design, it looks rather like a scaled-up TBD.

This is my favourite era of warship design; I've scratchbuilt a couple of 1/96 static models from this era, but have not yet built a working model. One day I may save up to buy the Dean's HMS Skirmisher/Sentinel!
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Roger in France

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Re: HMS Pelorus 1897
« Reply #5 on: May 15, 2008, 07:04:23 am »

Great looking ships, thanks for the pics.

Isn't that Victorian Livery glorious?

Roger in France.
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TCC

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Re: HMS Pelorus 1897
« Reply #6 on: November 24, 2008, 02:15:18 pm »

Jeez Victorian
you have picked a tough nut to crack!

How have you got a plan for her if it's a Deans hull of 'Skirmisher'? or how have you got thus far? what are you following?

My only suggestions as to 'photos' is the usual IWM or NMM. But be prepared for a 'sharp intake of breath'! :-) Even then, I wonder if you'd actually find photos of the deck itself and not ship portraits showing the full ship?

I have a series of photos of a builders model of HMS ADVENTURE and ATTENTIVE (both 1904) they look similar, 4 funnel, hardwood shed for a bridge/charthouse, 6 sshort, squat cowl vents in between funnels, shieldless guns. It may not be the total answer for you but they are the same fittings, etc. Could be a help if you have nothing?

I'd have to scane and e-mail, OK? Let me know. It's a bit of work for us butI'll give you half an hour. :-)

[TCC goes away muttering to himself abot guys who pick ancient subjects, around before cameras were invented, who don't check what research aides are available before building... mutter, mutter, mutter... ;-) ]
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victorian

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Re: HMS Pelorus 1897
« Reply #7 on: November 27, 2008, 01:15:18 pm »

Hello TCC. I'd certainly be interested in the photos you refer to. Where are these builders models?

I can offer if you're interested photos of the builder's model of the cruiser Good Hope (crated at the IWM).

'Pelorus' is based on the Deans 'Pegasus' hull, which is very good apart from the stern profile being too rounded (which I have not corrected). I was fortunate to get a copy of the admiralty plans for 'Pegasus' although these leave a lot to be desired at the detail level. I have obtained copies of every photo of the ship and many of the sister ships from IWM and PRO, both of which are very helpful people. Also from Francis Frith, a very effecient photo collection. Not so the rapacious NMM, who wanted a fortune for material sight unseen.

The only deck photos are in the book "Across a continent", plus a few on the excellent battleships-cruisers website. Details are on my web site if you're interested.

Pelorus is slowly growing detail (Boats are now onboard). Here's a photo from Holcot in August.



Thanks for the interest.

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ian kennedy

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Re: HMS Pelorus 1897
« Reply #8 on: November 27, 2008, 03:06:16 pm »

Hi Victorian,

Nice looking piccies of the pelorus and majestic class, Is your Maj based on a deans kit?

I did one many years back as HMS Prince George and still have it although it is in the middle of a refit she is 12+ years old now and needed some TLC.

I am currently building a Cressy class armoured cruiser and HMS Inflexible both scratch built and at 1/96th scale, Now to neg a bit.....i don't suppose you have any pics of Hogue,Aboukir or Cressy in your little collection?

Keep up the good work

Ian
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victorian

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Re: HMS Pelorus 1897
« Reply #9 on: November 27, 2008, 04:35:45 pm »

The battleship is indeed a Deans kit though the superstructure is scratch built to represent 'Mars' in 1897 (Mast through the bridge rather than behind it). Is your 'Prince George' in Victorian colours? It would be nice to see a fleet of them on the water. Ultimately my idea is to recreate this scene at Killary harbour on Sunday 8th October 1899:



I've not studied 'Cressy' but I do have about 300 close in shots of the quite similar Niobe (first ship in the Canadian navy, 1910) courtesy of a Canadian contributor to these pages. I'm sure he wouldn't mind me passing them on to you. Niobe is my next project, using a modified 'Kent' hull. If you let me have your postal address I'll send a CD. How are you building the hull?

Also the pics of 'Good Hope' might be relevant. Here's a sample:

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ian kennedy

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Re: HMS Pelorus 1897
« Reply #10 on: November 27, 2008, 05:19:53 pm »

Hello Victorian,

Prince George is a heavily modified deans kit, in The black white and buff scheme.

She has the same bridge config as Mars and i had to re build the complete upper works as my glass moulding from deans was very twisted and poor quality.

I did quite well sailing the model in two MPBA national finals comming 3rd the first year 1990 Maidstone and winning in 1991 at Hull.

The Cressy is a home produced GRP hull made off a POF plug, and has all plating,ports, casements and ash shutes etc moulded into the hull.  She will be in the Buff !! correct for the period.

It would be great to get a complete spithead fleet review line of Maj's together we need to find others and make a fleet review up sometime...ehh?

Currently i have in my fleet some finished some not, P.George, Agamemnon, Inflexible, Mohawk, Polyphemus,New Ironsides(USN), Neosho(USN), Novgorod(IRN)

I have also started building some strange stuff of late so can't say too much yet....not until i get the hulls finished.

Thanks for the CD offer i will PM you with my address.

Regards
Ian
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victorian

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Re: HMS Pelorus 1897
« Reply #11 on: November 27, 2008, 05:25:55 pm »

What scale is the Polyphemus and how do you keep the water out? Any pics available?
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ian kennedy

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Re: HMS Pelorus 1897
« Reply #12 on: November 27, 2008, 05:34:03 pm »

Polyphemus is 1/60th scale, built off a hull from John Hollis's original model

The complete deck is removable to the fore castle break, and the hull is sealed with a perspex plate bolted down with 50x brass 8ba socket cap screws.

She has retrectable working twin bow rudders, flood tanks in the beam bulges to trim her down like the prototype and i'm working on making the bow and 4x beam torp tubes work firing comp air powered torps.

I believe that deans sell this moulding now although i have not seen it available anywhere? I got mine from John as i used to trade plans and info with him often.

Cheers
Ian
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ian kennedy

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Re: HMS Pelorus 1897
« Reply #13 on: November 27, 2008, 05:49:16 pm »

Sorry,

I can't get my camera to work at the moment , gravity, camera and concrete garage floors don't mix well.

 But here are a few pics of some of my other efforts, namely Novgorod circular battleship 1/96th scale and USS Neosho U.S civil war sternwheel monitor 1/72nd scale

Ian
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ian kennedy

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Re: HMS Pelorus 1897
« Reply #14 on: November 27, 2008, 11:27:12 pm »

Hi Victorian,

 sorry about the quality, it's the best i can squeeze from my damaged Camera.

Ian
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victorian

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Re: HMS Pelorus 1897
« Reply #15 on: November 28, 2008, 01:06:07 pm »

Thanks for those marvellous pictures Ian.

Polythemus is really fascinating and it would be great to see some more shots sometime. Deans have a 1/60 hull that has been for sale at their open days but I'd really like to do it in 1/96, hence the submarine questions.

I have your PM and will organise a disk ASAP.

David
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RickF

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Re: HMS Pelorus 1897
« Reply #16 on: November 28, 2008, 11:28:46 pm »

I've been tempted by the Mouldeans Polyphemus too, but deterred by the statement on their website that "The only known plans for this ship are held buy the N.M.M."

Rick
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ian kennedy

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Re: HMS Pelorus 1897
« Reply #17 on: November 28, 2008, 11:55:14 pm »

Yep, they are available at a huge price,

I bought the profile, G/A, deck plan and rigging plan............148  7 years ago!!! ouch

The sad thing is i lent them to a chap (unknown at the time questionable integrity) and never saw them again....a%*e hole!!

If i had them you could have borrowed them, as i feel we model makers should stick together and help each other out, especially at NMM plan prices.

Cheers
Ian
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rob

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Re: HMS Pelorus 1897
« Reply #18 on: November 29, 2008, 08:25:07 am »

I have been lucky enough to have been loaned the NMM drawings of Polyphemus this last month.

A very kind gesture from a fellow mayhemer who wouldnt even accept postage costs........... i put a donation in a Poppy tin.
Rob
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victorian

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Re: HMS Pelorus 1897
« Reply #19 on: March 20, 2009, 11:50:22 am »

Pelorus has boats now.



Despite obtaining copies of all known PRO, IWM, Frith and other photos of "Pelorus", I've not been able to make out much of the smaller detail.  Until now, that is. A real breakthrough came in the form of some most excellent photos sent to me by Roberto Paredes in Chile. Roberto's pictures show the fabulous Chilean Naval Museum in Valparaiso which contains many original builder's models of late 19th century warships, including the lovely crusier "Esmerelda". Esmerelda was the first protected cruiser (and perhaps the first 'Elswick cruiser'?) and her model reveals details of the superstructure that I have not been able to find elsewhere.

Here's a sample:



1/48th scale original 1883 Armstrong builders model of Chilean protected cruiser "Esmerelda" in Chilean Naval Museum, Valparaiso, courtesy of Roberto Paredes.
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TCC

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Re: HMS Pelorus 1897
« Reply #20 on: March 22, 2009, 02:32:22 pm »

Do those hoops round the funnels have a similar role to the RN "pulleys and rope"? i.e to enable access the top?

Just read an old thread about rigging where you ask 'where did the inboard end of rope go after it went through the blocks?'. As was said in that thread, it was tied to a block.. one of them had a metal ring at the side of the block and it went to that.

Also concerning boat davits: did you know you have as many lifelines as there are thwarts across the boat? If you think about it, it makes perfect sense.

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farrow

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Re: HMS Pelorus 1897
« Reply #21 on: March 23, 2009, 09:57:06 pm »

The hoops are for rigging staging to wash down and paint the funnels, common on most vessels. The end of the tackle secures to the beckett?eye at the bottom of a block or as was taught and called the 'bottom' of a block, that what I was taught at Greenhithe Merchant Navy College too many years ago to remember.
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farrow

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Re: HMS Pelorus 1897
« Reply #22 on: March 23, 2009, 10:00:04 pm »

Sorry I forgot to say superb models, I do like that period of time, the vessels do look really graceful and interesting. By the way does anyone know if the Devastation plans are available anywhere.
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Colin Bishop

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Re: HMS Pelorus 1897
« Reply #23 on: March 23, 2009, 10:18:15 pm »

They must be Dave, I took these pictures at the Society of Model Shipwrights last year.

Colin

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RichyB

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Re: HMS Pelorus 1897
« Reply #24 on: October 18, 2011, 10:31:54 am »













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