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Author Topic: Jerry's - Steam Launch - Wear  (Read 100578 times)

gregk9

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Re: Jerry's - Steam Launch - Wear
« Reply #25 on: December 20, 2011, 06:33:21 pm »

started on the next two planks. First I made a widget to mark the 3mm overlap on the edges of the garboard planks where they need to be chamfered so the next planks can lie flat on them for gluing.



It is just a couple of snap off blades from a craft knife superglued to a block of scrap with a 3mm guide fence glued on. Then I ran it down the planks thus.




Next I pinned a batten to the formers at the position of the top of the next planks and ran a mini plane along to complete the chamfer.




Now, in order for the planks to lie flush at the stem and transom, the ford and aft end of the garboards have to have a little bit cut out of them like this.




A matching piece is then cut out of the inner edges of the next planks. These joints are referred to as "geralds". I had never heard of the term but while checking Ian's (Llanberis) plans for the hog I spotted it in the description notes. I forgot the name so I just looked up clinker boat building on wikipedia and it agrees. The plans show no geralds at the transom but the transom is cut so the planks keep their lap. Blow that for a load of soldiers, too complicated so I'm geralding both ends and they can't touch me for it! Next, I offered up the plank blank on one side, shuffled it about a bit, until I could mark the top edge of the garboard with a pencil from underneath. I then drew a line 3mm above that to get roughly the shape of the bottom edge of the next plank. I cut it out on the scroll saw. Then I marked the station positions on the plank and transfered the widths of the plank at each station with dividers, joined up the dots again and cut out the top edge. A goodly time spent refining until perfik then penciled around and made the other plank as a mirror image matching the grains. When all a perfect fit I glued on one.



then the other. when glue gone off cleaned off excess and cut out the next three pairs of plank blanks. Phew, 3 days!! This is going to take a while.


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gregk9

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Re: Jerry's - Steam Launch - Wear
« Reply #26 on: December 23, 2011, 06:07:17 pm »

I've got 4 planks on each side. Gosh it's a slow process taking so far 5 hours to get each pair on. Only 16 to go. But today I had a rest. The whistle and gas filler adaptor arrived so I fitted the whistle and then beatled off to B&Q and bought a couple of cans of Go System gas, 30/70% propane/butane mix, did a bit of xmas shopping, then dashed home and flashed the boiler up. It took about 6 mins to lift the safety at 35psi. I ran the engine for one tank of gas (1 1/2hours). Regulator, feedpump,and everything all worked great. The workshop smells great. The only problem was the  oil catcher/condenser tank drain squirted out water. The exhaust steam valve must be too restricting causing a rise in pressure in the tank which is enough to overcome the head on the drain pipe. I will fit a valve on the drain as well as the exhaust. I must remember not to run the engine with both of them shut or I might pop the tank!!
Here at last some pics. Enjoy.










A merry Christmas and a happy new year to you all. A last minute request to santa, some gloves. That regulator gets very hot!!!
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ooyah/2

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Re: Jerry's - Steam Launch - Wear
« Reply #27 on: December 23, 2011, 08:57:59 pm »

Hi Jerry,
 Very nice little steam plant, I do much prefer the painted engine and very innovative boiler feed pump, how does it perform against boiler pressure ?
I 'm not sure why people lag the oil separator as it works on the principle of the steam condensing and the oil floating on top of the condensed steam.
It's such a long time since I made one that I can't remember what the internal piping should be, does the exhaust pipe going up the lum (sorry chimney ) go down to the bottom of the tank which theoretically should allow steam only to go up the chimney.
I would think that if you put a shut down valve on the other one and you inadvertently  closed both you would stall the engine. 
Love the pipe lagging , looks very realistic.

Happy Christmas.

George
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gregk9

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Re: Jerry's - Steam Launch - Wear
« Reply #28 on: December 23, 2011, 11:00:10 pm »

Cheers George.The feed pump is a hand pump with handle removed and fulcrum attached to the ram at one end and a short crank on the servo.  I can adjust the pump stroke at the crank.  The servo I converted to a motor by removing the limit pin from the gears and ditching the circuit inside.  I then soldered new wires onto the motor.  The idea is to switch it on when I let the boat go and have the delivery fractionally less than water consumption so I don't hydraulic the engine. Ideally I will have a level sensor and control it automatically but that's for later. Don't want to walk before I run.
      The separator is made from two 28mm stop ends soldered to a 28mm straight connector. Engine exhaust goes in at the top and is aimed down. Another pipe with the valve comes out of the top and into the flue. The drain pipe goes from the bottom of the tank to the top and then overside. The theory is that the steam stays as steam ( hence the lagging) and the oil stays as oil and is left behind in the tank. At the end of a run I recover the launch run the engine with the valve shut which then blows the oil and any condensate out of the tank and into a receptacle. If all the steam condensed in the tank it would fill up and eventually would all go up the flue with it's oil which we are trying to stop going into the lake and/or all over the boat. The problem at the moment is that condensate is immediately venting from the drain.
         I've got a 3 blade 2.75"x4.1" prop which should slow the motor down and reduce steam consumption. Until I can run it on load I can't really set the pump stroke. The pipe lagging is two layers ad white string. When I'd done it that's what it looked like, two layers of string. So I painted it with runny poly filler, until I got a build up, then shaped it and finally painted it with smooth white masonry paint. I've got 50 gallons in my cupboard to do the house next year. George I'm writing this on my iPhone and it's just told me you've posted but I know if I go and look I'll lose wot I rit. So I'll post anyway and hope we don't cross lines too badly.
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derekwarner

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Re: Jerry's - Steam Launch - Wear
« Reply #29 on: December 24, 2011, 12:32:17 am »

Jerry/George......Sandy Campbell [ACS Engineering] built my bolier & de-oiler & we had a number of discussions re the de-olier design

I wanted to be able to blow down my lubricator condensate [from Winfried Niggle...with the viewable quartz body] into the de-oiler

In the end Sandy recommended a 1/8" OD copper tube inlet for the discharge steam from the engine & a 5/32" OD copper tube inlet for the lubricator fluid

The reasoning for the 1/8" OD copper tube was to maintain the highest possible engine discharge steam temperature until it reached the de-oiler & the tangential inlet would create a turbulance to drop the oil from suspension - Sandy also agreed that lagging would assist in maintaining steam as steam & hence up the chimney which also assisted with gas discharge flow

The 5/32" sizing was for convenience as we were to rely on residual boiler pressure to displace the steam condensate in the lubricator

I also opted for a 1/4" x 32 screwed/plugged de-oiler top tapping to remove waste oily/water .......

Jerry.....could the water have been the initial slug of condensate prior to the engine reaching an operational temperature?........Derek
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gregk9

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Re: Jerry's - Steam Launch - Wear
« Reply #30 on: December 24, 2011, 03:47:07 pm »

Hi George in Oz. that's more or less what I did only instead of sucking my oil/condensate out with a syringe I have a third pipe from the bottom of the tank to the top. If I close the valve to the funnel the exhaust steam blows the content out into a receptacle. My valve is too restrictive so today I shifted it to the drain line and replaced it with a piece of flexible tubing. Now when I want to drain the tank I just open the drain and away it goes. Will try it out soonest.  Have a good one down under.  Jerry.
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Re: Jerry's - Steam Launch - Wear
« Reply #31 on: December 30, 2011, 05:06:37 pm »

Jerry,
You must have been getting confused what with i.phone, i.pods etal they are just too much for me as well.
I am from Sconnie Botland not OZ. you must have been standing on your head at the time.

One of the problems that arises from the online lubricator that you have is that there is no control over the amount of oil that the engine uses.
The engine is inclined to gulp large quantities  of oil which isn't required, why they gulp oil I don't know , but they do.
In all of the engines that I have built I make the lubricator with a needle valve which allows the merest whisper of oil into the engine and saves quite a bit of oil and prevents the discharge after a run.   P.M.  sent.
George.  
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gregk9

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Re: Jerry's - Steam Launch - Wear
« Reply #32 on: December 30, 2011, 08:22:28 pm »

hi again George, just answered your email. Have been busy over the hols but not got much done on the launch. I've only got 6 pairs of planks on which is half way. Can't seem to do more than two planks a day. Did however complete the steam plant. Have run it 4 times now. A tank of gas lasts 1hr 15min. Throttling back the engine to what I guess will be on load revs the pressure rises in the boiler until just before the safety lifts, when I switch on the feed pump. The cold water reduces the boiler pressure and takes me back to where I started. Ideally the safety lifting when on the lake will tell me to switch on the pump. I just got to find out, in practice, how long to run it. I think I'd be happier with a sensor and a switching circuit of some sort. I'll get the hang of it eventually.
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Re: Jerry's - Steam Launch - Wear
« Reply #33 on: December 30, 2011, 08:50:35 pm »

Jerry,
Why don't you make another oil trap but run the boiler feed thro" a coil fitted inside the oil trap to pre/heat the water before going into the boiler.
It will save fuel, if my explanation isn't clear let me know and I will forward a sketch to you.
George 
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gregk9

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Re: Jerry's - Steam Launch - Wear
« Reply #34 on: December 30, 2011, 10:55:31 pm »

hi George, I see where your coming from on that one. When I ordered the boiler I asked Mike if he could supply it with an economiser coil in the chimbly. I didn't want a "superheater/drier" as the engine maker said his engine needed wet steam so I thought more better put economiser. Mike said more better keep simple so I didn't bother. IMO heat up flue is waste so why not use it to heat feedwater. As to using the oil trap to heat feed, ok, but if it causes steam to condense then it would need to be much bigger to hold what I pump into the boiler. There is another factor to consider- the exhaust steam goes up the funnel with considerable force. It is possible that this acts as an eductor, drawing extra air through the firetubes. The burner does seem more energetic when the engine is running. Anybody got any thoughts on this? I always understood steam locos used this principle to make the furnace draw better. FYI after a full run, when I drain the oil trap, I estimate it to be nearly full of hot water with a tiny amount of oil on the top. The oil quantity would appear to be similar to the amount of water drained from the oiler, namely about two drops.
      I'm not satisfied with my pipework, I can do better. I freehand bent everything and it is sloppy and inconsistent. When the Launch is completed I will do it again and incorporate what I have learned in the process. Then I can experiment with various devices. I need hard data to make a considered decision. My main concern is monitoring/maintaining boiler level. Can anyone tell me what happens if I overfill the boiler?
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Re: Jerry's - Steam Launch - Wear
« Reply #35 on: December 31, 2011, 12:20:33 am »

Can anyone tell me what happens if I overfill the boiler?

Jerry ,
You will get a very hot shower of boiling water when the safety valve blows  as the boiler primes.

George.
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derekwarner

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Re: Jerry's - Steam Launch - Wear
« Reply #36 on: December 31, 2011, 02:04:29 am »

Jerry........a few points from one far more learned than I.... O0.

1. exhausting model engine steam [in model boilers] up the chimney does act a venturi which is good & bad
2. the good is that it does increase the velocity of the combustion gases [in the chimney] & draws extra air for greater combustion  :-))
3. the not so good is that a consequence of this is the hot gases spend a reduced time heating the fire tubes  >>:-(
4. filling a boiler with an excess of water is not good  <*< ....apart from the points offered by George....the potential also exist to pump slugs of steam with high water levels into the engine
5. water is literally un-compressible  <:( ...& can damage engines......infact many oscillators on startup when primed with watery steam displace this water by forcing the cylinder plates off the standard & causing external leakage.......you probably will have seen many examples of this in images........

Derek
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gregk9

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Re: Jerry's - Steam Launch - Wear
« Reply #37 on: December 31, 2011, 08:23:42 pm »

So nothing serious then!!  When I first start the engine the first bit is water and after a second or so away it goes no probs. Now the whistle is a different story. That covers me in water cos I haven't rigged a lanyard yet.

Anyway had a bit of a setback this AM when I removed the clamps. A broken plank at No 1 station. Had to make a former same shape as correct shape of plank and glue it again and clamped up with former. I'd end for ended the plank cos it looked like the grain was better in that way but no good so I will have to use the outside former every time. Once it's all assembled the strength will return.

Am not looking forward to scraping this lot clean before I put the timbers in.


She is starting to take shape though. There is light at the end of the tunnel.




It was a train.
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gregk9

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Re: Jerry's - Steam Launch - Wear
« Reply #38 on: January 01, 2012, 03:06:47 pm »

14 planks- 71clamps. I see them in my sleep!


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gregk9

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Re: Jerry's - Steam Launch - Wear
« Reply #39 on: January 06, 2012, 09:52:01 pm »

Only got the sheerstrakes to go now. If I'm honest I haven't enjoyed planking up. It's a long, tedious and frustrating process. It would be nice to get a development of each plank from a computer but in practice that wouldn't work as it's impossible to get each plank in exactly the right place. Errors build up and have to be compensated as I go along. At first I slavishly forced the planks to the frames which showed up errors in the frame shapes resulting in a slight dip in the flow of the planks. I decided to let the planks tell me what was right and remove or shim as required resulting in a much more flowing shape.There are mistakes on the plans. As previously mentioned the hog was not shown on the transverse cross section. Now I see that the plan shows the sheerstrakes rising to flush with top surface of the deck, however the plan view does not show a join between deck and planks at the breaks in the deck rail. In reality the deck should overlap the sheerstrake and the join should be covered by the rubbing strakes. I have also had trouble with the nature of the mahogany itself. It's a short grain timber and the direction of the grain changes over as little a distance as 6 inches. so it has been difficult to work. I have tried to mirror port and stbd and to keep changing the grain directions at the same time as trying to match wood colour which also seems to change as I progress. I have broken quite a few planks as I went along but they formed natural scarfs so I just superglued them together again backed up with a bit of masking tape which I built into the model and removed when planks set. Planks no 11 and the sheer strake are of such a curvature that my wood stock is not wide enough to make the planks full length so planks no 11 are made in 2 pieces scarfed at station no 5 and the sheer strake will be scarfed at no 6. A close look at the real launch shows the same technique used. The other interesting feature of the boat and where it differs from wide-a-wake and african queen is that the sheer strake starts off the same width as all the others at the stem but steadily increases as it moves aft until at the transom it is 4 times wider than the other planks. It is quite striking and I have not seen this before. Anyway here are some pics.



A very small pic of thereal thing. There's a better one on the british steam boat register website.









And finally I changed my oiler to a smaller version more in keeping with the size of the plant. It's also adjustable and knobs is like clamps, the more the better. Now I got somewhere to hang me bucket. Now, where can I put the fire extinguisher?? Will have a consult with my local fire preventy orifice.



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Re: Jerry's - Steam Launch - Wear
« Reply #40 on: January 07, 2012, 08:43:22 pm »

Looking good Jem. Have to ask if anyone has built a miniature mandrel bender on the forum. I followed the build of one in engineering in miniature a few years ago. Mustard. What's the canopy to be built of?
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gregk9

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Re: Jerry's - Steam Launch - Wear
« Reply #41 on: January 07, 2012, 09:42:34 pm »

It's a light wooden frame with a thin ply sheet. I intend to cover it with calico and paint it cream as in a yacht deck of the period. I don't think I'll be able to bend mahogany around the front. If not I'll use ash and stain it.
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Reg Hinnant

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Re: Jerry's - Steam Launch - Wear
« Reply #42 on: January 09, 2012, 05:27:05 pm »

 :-))
Hi Jerry,
I just found your build & am enjoying it immensely. I can sympathize with the planking because no matter what style of planking you are doing itís the planks that make the fair line & as we all find out, not the frames.
I will be very interested in finding out your solutions to the condenser/piping engineering. I have a TVR1ABB also but to be run from an old Cheddar Horz boiler.
Thanks for posting everything!
Reg
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gregk9

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Re: Jerry's - Steam Launch - Wear
« Reply #43 on: January 09, 2012, 06:23:14 pm »

Muchas gracias Reg. I managed to get one sheerstrake on today.  I had to  re-mark all the sheerstrake positions and extend the top of the transom to get everything right. Tomorrow should go a bit smoother. Famous last words. On the steam plant side I have decided to remake the separator slightly bigger in volume but will stick with the pipeing arrangement, ie. , 1) exhaust steam in near the top with bend inside tank directing exhaust steam down and round. 2) clean steam out into flue. 3) drain from bottom of tank out through top via discharge valve.  Have found that with last bit of steam merely opening the valve empties the tank no problem.  I see you from south Texas  give my love to the Houston Ship canal , not!!
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gregk9

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Re: Jerry's - Steam Launch - Wear
« Reply #44 on: January 12, 2012, 06:45:36 pm »

Finally got all the planks on. Not much work today but made a start on filling and sanding down getting ready for finishing. Cut the tiller slot in the transom while I gave thought to how I was going to chamfer the stem.I ruled out the router and the dremel as not got the right tools. I finally came to the conclusion that I would have to do it by hand. First job, sharpen chisels. I figured if I attached the brass stemband, I could use the edge as a toolrest/guide and only need to worry about the bit at the plank ends. It worked well and job completed easily.
I have decided to complete as much work as possible below the gunwhales while the hull is still attached to the building board, it being much easier when everything is clamped to the bench. I will construct the rudder, fabricate gudgeons and pintles, attach the brass keelband and seal the hull/grain with several coats of shellac rubbed down with wire wool before removing hull from board. I will varnish when inner work is completed prior to fitting out.
The beauty of using shellac is I can get 10 coats on in a day and can then get a superb finish with only three coats of spinnaker marine varnish. The colour comes out as superb. I did an Enterprise sailing dinghy in this way for my kids and the varnish lasted 3 hard seasons before needing re-coating.

showing the temporary stemband.



shows how the sheerstrake differs from wide a wake.



shows the generous tumblehome at the stern. I think you can see the geralding of the plank ends. Incidentally, the plank ends will be covered with a rubbing band around the perimeter of the transom.



and finally an overhead of the completed planking prior to cleaning off.
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Re: Jerry's - Steam Launch - Wear
« Reply #45 on: January 13, 2012, 09:39:11 pm »

Jerry,
You sure are cracking on with the hull, wish I knew what Sheerstrakes, Tumblehomes e.t.c were, but then I'm only an old Clydeside hammer and chisel man with no sense of humour.
Well done so far , look forward to seeing the hull proper way up with the steam plant installed.
George.
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Patternmaker

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Re: Jerry's - Steam Launch - Wear
« Reply #46 on: January 14, 2012, 08:19:10 am »

Very nice job Jerry, good to see it in mahogany.

Mick
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gregk9

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Re: Jerry's - Steam Launch - Wear
« Reply #47 on: January 14, 2012, 06:11:49 pm »

I had a really good day today. 1st job mark out, drill and countersink stem and keel band. It's made up of 4 pieces 1/4x 0.032 brass strip.


Next I started on my 1st ever lathe job. I only had an old valve spindle from a scrap valve on a product tanker I sailed on. I've been using it as a drift for nearly 30 years. It's almost certainly a bit more exotic than brass but it worked easily. I should say that I spent 2 hours last night looking on youtube for instructions on how to do it. It's just a dummy outer stern gland. The slightly thicker bit on the boat end will be let into the keel and an oval brass plate with a small hole top and bottom for 2 small lag bolts will be put over it and soldered to the little step. This is just to replicate original and tidies up that area. I shall do similar to the inside on the other end of the shaft. I know it's not much, but it is to my measurements and I've still got both eyes and a full complement of digits. In fact there was no blood spilt at all!! I'm chuffed to bits.



Finished off by fabricating rudder pintles and transom gudgeons from 1/4" brass banding wrapped round a bit of brass pipe, formed on a bit of scrap steel and soldered. The gudgeons are just brass pipe silver soldered to the hollowed out heads of a pair of 6 BA screws. I will clean them up on Monday as I'm taking my PARAT up to the lake tomorrow. It promises to be a beautiful day tomorrow but a bit nippy.




Thankyou for your comment Patternmaker. I think your build was superb. If mine turns out half as good as yours I'll be happy cos it's nearly half as big.
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Re: Jerry's - Steam Launch - Wear
« Reply #48 on: January 14, 2012, 06:24:20 pm »

Very, very nice. And now you're two days post-planking, making the hull wasn't too awful, was it!  %%

(Bet you, you'll do it again one day!)

Andy
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Re: Jerry's - Steam Launch - Wear
« Reply #49 on: January 17, 2012, 06:21:35 pm »

Thankyou Andy. It's like heavy weather in the southern ocean. It's good when it stops!!

OK, last 2 days on rudder, fittings and removing hull from frames. Because of the strange grain in this mahogany stock, I decided to laminate everything in the rudder, rather than cut it out in 5 pieces as on the plan. So the blade is made of 8 pieces, the cheeks 2 pieces each and the fore and aft bit on the bottom is 4 pieces also. I drilled 1/16" holes through each set and pushed through some 1/16" veneer pins.
 
 
 When everything all present and correct I removed the pins, applied the glue, fitted a section together and replaced the pins before clamping up. All this to stop everything sliding about under the clamps. When all gone off, removed clamps and pins. Next I tidied everything up at the sanding station prior to joining up all the pieces into a rudder. So first glued up the 3 pieces for the blade, then fitted the pintles. I drilled 2 no 1/16" holes through pintle bands and blade then pushed 2 pins through top and bottom pintle assemblies. Next I removed  2 channels on the inner faces of each cheek to clear the pintle bands then glued on the cheeks. When all gone off I filled the little holes and then sanded the foil section on the blade, tidied everything up and then drilled the hole for the 4BA threaded rod tiller arm.



Finally drilled the 2 holes in the transom for the gudgeons. I filled the oversize holes in the gudgeons with hotmelt glue and when cooled drilled 2mm holes through each to make the bushes for the pintles to rotate in.

So thats all the work on the outside of the hull completed so I removed the hull from the formers by unscrewing the after former (#9) from the plastic blocks then reaching up under the hull with a stubby posidrive screw driver and uscrewed the top plastic block from the hog. then with a bit of pressure towards ford and a little wriggling the former came free. Repeated this process up to #1 which comes off the building way with the boat. #1 was the only one difficult to get out of the hull. The hull is quite fragile in this state and needs carfull handling to avoid damage. It is surprisingly light, weighing in at 1lb 14oz, including the excess glue foam inside.



Where the hell do I start clearing this little lot?? Any tricks anyone?

Anyway It was knocking off time but I couldn't resist this.




It's possible I may have to resite the gas tank as it's maybe getting a bit cramped around the forward fold down table. We'll see.


Logged
Best wishes.

Steve. G.
Treasurer & Membership Secretary:  Chasewater Model Boat Club
http://chasewatermbc.blogspot.com/
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