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Author Topic: Copper fairleads?  (Read 1988 times)

rmaddock

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Copper fairleads?
« on: January 28, 2012, 06:41:58 PM »

I'm now at the stage of thinking about the sheet controls in the Nobby.
Now, call me daft, but I will be using a closed loop system from the winches...no problems there.
However, from there, the sheets need to be "steered" through the hull to exit in various places.  My question is, can I use copper tube to do this?  I've got plenty of old brake pipe as well as the technology to flare the ends and put nice bends in it.
Does this work? Do they tend to bind?  Are there minimum working radiuses (radiae?)
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boatmadman

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Re: Copper fairleads?
« Reply #1 on: January 28, 2012, 08:25:31 PM »

I have done just that on a few sailing boats, as long as you keep away from tight bends you will be fine. Brake pipe might be a bit big though, I have used small diameter copper tube aimed at scale steam use.

I dont know if you have thought of running rigging yet, but fishing line works well.

Ian
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Brooks

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Re: Copper fairleads?
« Reply #2 on: January 28, 2012, 08:38:35 PM »

I've seen copper, though I've not used it myself. For my 2' hull Aldebaran, I used teflon tubing fairleads to guide the line thru the deck; McMaster-Carr sells it over in the US.

I use polyester carpet thread for running rigging - It's worked w/o breakage on my Pamir square rigger (3' hull) and all the rest of my rc sailboats. I can't break it by a straight pull between my hands. Cotton wrapped polyester is easier to knot; the pure polyester is stiff enough you have to CA the knots, or use fishing line style knots (which are designed for slippery material).

If you use fishline, get the non-stretchy version (Spectra is one name of the fiber, various brandnames for the line eg. Spiderwire, don't know them for the UK). Regular monofilament fishline is made to stretch (to absorb the shock of the fish's strike); I don't like it for rigging because it's stiff and stretchy, neither quality desirable, in my experience. The stiffness makes it fall off spools, the stretchiness makes it refuse to hold sails in their desired position.
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malcolmfrary

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Re: Copper fairleads?
« Reply #3 on: January 29, 2012, 09:34:12 AM »

Small bore copper tube bent into a "U" shape will work just fine.  As said before, nice gentle curves, partly to keep a smooth run, partly to avoid kinks.  I used a broom handle as a former.  Braided salmon backing (I think thats what it was called) has little stretch, slides easily, goes round corners and comes in a fetching shade of brown.  Thin venetian blind cord works as well.  You will need to make a fine flexible needle to thread the line through - if its really flexible, it wont push round any corners.  Mine was thin fuse wire, stiff enough to push, bendy enough to go round the curve, thin enough to make a loop to hold the line and still pull through.
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roycv

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Re: Copper fairleads?
« Reply #4 on: January 29, 2012, 10:15:18 AM »

Hi I agree with Malcolm I have been doing this for years now.  I have run monofilament line through plastic tubes in a tensioned closed loop to operate the tiller on  the rudder.  I thought it might cut through but has not so far!. The filament line is almost invisible and is fixed to a small pin under the tiller and works well.

If you treat the bends in the tubing like portions of a pulley that seems to work.

I use plastic tubing as well, bent under boiling water from a kettle and when in shape, straight under cold tap water to set it's shape.
I have some very fine piano wire, bent at the end to form a loop and feed the cord through as Malcolm has said.
regards Roy
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tigertiger

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Re: Copper fairleads?
« Reply #5 on: January 29, 2012, 04:52:56 PM »

As the Nobby is scale sail, I would use braided Dacron. Monofiliment fishing line works well but looks out of place, IMHO.

Many sail suppliers, including sailsetc.com stock Dacron for this purpose. It does not stretch. I would use 25kg breaking strain for the running rigging. I also use 50kg or stronger for the standing rigging.

Dacron also runs nicely through fairleads, blocks and deadeyes, and ties off well.

I have used the teflon fairleads which work well, however they are not the correct color (white) and they don't look right. I use them for ease as they work well and are easy to fit however.

Dacron can also be coloured with boot polish and holds the colour brown OKish, but it fades to pink after a season or two.
Dacron takes black well for standing rigging and this does not fade anywhere near as much. A lighter coat of black on running rigging will show up grey, the colour of sun bleached rope.


As for minimum working radius. Really no, as long as the diameter of the pipe allows the rigging to run through freely. Really as long as the line will go through the angle without kinking due to stiffness. The biggest disadvantage with running over edges is wear. The problems with too long a pipe are threading/feeding the rigging through, and space below deck.

My two cents.
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rmaddock

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Re: Copper fairleads?
« Reply #6 on: January 29, 2012, 05:07:25 PM »

Splendid! Thanks everyone  :-))

I intend to have the closed loops below the foredeck running around pulleys.  The sheets will be taken off these and then directed through the decking using pipe of some sort.  The real boat has oak fairleads on the deck and I'm going to try to bring my copper fairleads up underneath one of these.  With a bit of false sheet running aft from the same place, I'm hoping to make the exits as close to invisible as possible. You can see one here between the dead-eyes....I might have to make them a little oversized to get the desired effect.



All the advice on line types is gratefully received, thank you again.
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boatmadman

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Re: Copper fairleads?
« Reply #7 on: January 30, 2012, 05:47:07 PM »

I was struggling to remember the name of the stuff I used, TigerTiger got it - braided dacron - never had a problem with it.
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