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Author Topic: robbe seawolf v.2.  (Read 7906 times)

wadsworthj

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robbe seawolf v.2.
« on: February 15, 2012, 01:57:16 pm »

Hi There.
            Having just purchased my very first sub, the above mentioned.
Mainly on price, and entry level, could anyone please advise me, on
the upgrades available, firstly, a leveller, secondly, a static dive system.
and should i prioritise them, which first and which second.
may thanks in advance.

Cheers    John.
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Subculture

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Re: robbe seawolf v.2.
« Reply #1 on: February 15, 2012, 02:21:22 pm »

'Hollowhornbear' has one of these, so I'm sure he'll offer some additional advice.

The best levellers are made by Microgyros- http://www.microgyros.com

Whilst your at it, get an ESC from him too, as they feature a built in throttle failsafe, which isn't a luxury!

There are lots of thread on Robbe Seawolf mods on rcboot.de and rcgroups.com forums. I've seen Seawolfs modified to an x-tail configuration, submersible and even a Disney Nautilus lookalike, so they're highly tweakable.

Piranha Modellbau do a range of mechanical upgrades for the Seawolf, including a metal bayonet ring, tech rack and static dive system based on a peristaltic pump and syringe. If you want to fit the ring and rack, you should really get them before starting construction, as retrofitting is not easy. The best mod is the bayonet seal; it provides a precise way to seal your hull almost guaranteeing a watertight boat. The Piranha tech rack is cnc cut from aluminium, and is somewhat overkill. You could make something up yourself from plastic and some metal threaded rod, for a lot less, but it's your call. The standard tech rack is adequate, but needs some modification to accommodate a ballast system. The ballast system is nothing unique, and there are other suppliers you can get such a system from, for the instance the system used in the TT Neptune could be readily adapted, and the parts are quite reasonable.

http://www.modelluboot.eu/

The basic kit works very well as standard. I would not fit the additional hydroplanes on the sail- no submarine I've ever seen has planes on the sail and the bow! One or the other. Also would leave off the automatic front plane control, as it's toy like.

Static diving is nice, but far from essential. The Seawolf has large control surfaces which suit a dynamic diver well. Ballast the boat to decks awash so that only the sail is above the water, and it should slip under with little effort.
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wadsworthj

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Re: robbe seawolf v.2.
« Reply #2 on: February 15, 2012, 02:41:51 pm »

Hi Subculture.
                  Serious thanks for the info, its all grist to the mill,
I tried the site you spoke of but unfortunatly, i only spesk enough deutch to get my face slapped!!
but it enough to be going on for now.
Cheers   John.W.
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Subculture

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Re: robbe seawolf v.2.
« Reply #3 on: February 15, 2012, 03:27:51 pm »

I don't speak German either, so I use the Google translator. Generally enough to get by, here's the price list-

http://translate.google.co.uk/translate?hl=en&sl=de&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.modelluboot.eu%2F

So the bayonet seal is 68 euro and the techrack is 59 euro and the peristaltic pump is 59 euro. You could use a geared pump instead and they can be found for a lot less, but you need to use a pinch valve for that kind of pump if it's working against pressure, as they don't self seal.
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Davy1

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Re: robbe seawolf v.2.
« Reply #4 on: February 15, 2012, 04:05:51 pm »

Hi John,

Welcome to model subs.

Some general advice, do try and get a broad range of advice from a number of people on here and elsewhere before parting with your hard earned cash. The internet is a great resource but you often don't know  the background and expertise of the people you deal with.

So I would advise some time and caution before "flashing the plastic." Bits for subs are often very expensive because it is a specialist, niche area.

Good fun though and you've started in the right way!

David
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Subculture

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Re: robbe seawolf v.2.
« Reply #5 on: February 15, 2012, 06:44:04 pm »

Here's a picture of a modified Seawolf, you have to look closely to spot the lineage, though.



Wish I still had a picture of the nautilus conversion.
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wadsworthj

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Re: robbe seawolf v.2.
« Reply #6 on: February 15, 2012, 07:13:06 pm »

Hi Subculture and davy 1.
Many thanks for your input, very helpfull.
Exellent yellow seawolf, you have stollen a march on me, mine is going to be yellow too, for
medical purposes you understand!!!!!!!
I will be taking this very slowly, as you say it can mount up into a fortune.
and as a poor pensioner, down to his last R.R.
i need to watch the dosh.

Cheers    John. O0
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Davy1

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Re: robbe seawolf v.2.
« Reply #7 on: February 15, 2012, 08:21:24 pm »

I thought that might be the case - so slow easy stages maybe best. I hasten to add that I have never built anything like a Seawolf (I seem to only do scratch built.) but starting with a dynamic diver is a good idea certainly. (They come up again automatically!) I have seen Seawolfs in action and they fair zoom as dynamic divers.

I think that I would suggest building it pretty much "out of the box" to get the hang of it. You don't always need an autoleveller (I often sail without one.)

The other thing is  a friendly bit of water and hopefully a friendly model boat club attached - so you can again get the hang of a sub in frequent, easy stages. I suspect that you are not new to model boats, in any case, which will help a lot.

A friendly bit of water is not too big and preferably wadeable. Good visibility is nice but can't always be guaranteed. The ponds I know at Barrow, Edinburgh and Norwich are "standard" model boat ponds and are just fine. Accessible swimming pools are nice but a bit of a rarity.

So I would really would just build it and have a go. A strange observation when many subs are present is that the dynamic divers amongst us seem to be having more fun!

David
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Subculture

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Re: robbe seawolf v.2.
« Reply #8 on: February 15, 2012, 09:28:28 pm »

They don't always come up automatically, hollowhornbear will testify to that. They'll stay down like any other boat if they spring a leak, or the throttle sticks on and you haven't got a failsafe fitted. But they do have one or two less things to go wrong.

I ran a sub for some years sans leveller (chiefly because they were really difficult to get at the time). Nowadays they're everywhere and not that expensive, and they really do make a difference to the stability of your boat.

The yellow boat is owned by a French modeller, so I think you're safe provided you remain on this side of the channel!

As said earlier- the basic kit works well enough. A club member had one a few years back, initially he had it ballasted out to a high waterline, and needed full speed just to get it under. I suggested adding a bit more lead to get it to decks awash, and it was a lot nicer to sail. Another modeller used to ballast his Seawolf so that just the top of the sail was above the surface. With such low residual buoyancy the boat behaved just like a static diver, and was able to creep around the pond very slowly. He told me that people used to ask what ballast system inside.

I did some work on a friends U47 last year, which internally is very similar to the Seawolf, just bigger. The boat was suffering from leaks, mainly due to poor construction by the previous owner. I originally intended to modify the hull seal from axial compression to radial. That idea went out the window when I saw that I would have to cut the equipment tray off which was bonded in with about shed load of epoxy. In a nutshell I recommend that if you want to incorporate mods, do it from the start, or build the boat stock and sell it on, and start over with a fresh kit.

One area benefits from light modification, namely the threaded spigot on the front of the tray- this is often beefed up with a metal plate, usually brass and hard soldered to the spigot. the plate is then bolted through the equipment tray. I did this on the afore mentioned U47- the original spigot had broken off which is a common problem with these boats.

Bear in mind that the equipment/tech rack has been carefully designed to give maximum strength, and if you make any modifications to it by trimming things away, e.g. to incorporate a ballast system, you can easily compromise its strength. This can cause problems with the integrity of the main hull seal, as the latter relies on the strength of the tray to maintain axial compression.

The original design incorporated bulky lead acid cyclone packs. Over twenty years ago when this kit first appeared, that was the standard for model boats. These days we have much higher capacity battery technology which is far less space hungry. This frees up room for a ballast system, but the standard layout on the Seawolf is not ideally configured for a static diver. The servos are forward of where a ballast tank would sit, which can make linkage routing a little awkward. The Piranha rack addressed these shortcomings by moving the servos aft, and you can see how at these links-

http://kamps.name/10.html

http://www.modelluboot.eu/SeawolfNico.htm

That builder has installed a piston tank based on a large syringe, and a brushless motor.
Nice set-up, but perhaps a bit over engineered. As long as you can cut a circle, you could easily copy this yourself for just a few pounds in materials. The discs can be made from plastic sheet instead of aluminium. Threaded rod and aluminium tubing can be sourced from B&Q etc.

Here's someone who looks like they've done just that- http://www.rcboot.de/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3177&sid=e3069bc3bddc1a49b440a326b59fb05a
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wadsworthj

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Re: robbe seawolf v.2.
« Reply #9 on: February 16, 2012, 06:52:02 am »

Hi Subculture.
                   That was incoming, that i did not see coming!!
But it opens one eyes to the complexability of the subject, and i can just  about see the wood for the trees!!
Many thanks it is very interesting reading, and i am learning by the minute.
One thing leaps out at me, and that is, that a very simples way ofcheating, is too
ballast it just lower than decks awash, and get sweeter handling, and boast that you have the worlds most expensive and complicated static dive
system ever fitted.
If they ask to see it, tell them that they can certainly see it ,BUT that you will have to kill them afterwards!!!
Seriously. you have taken a lot of time to explain it all, and i am greatfull, thanks.
I can pick the bonesout of it now.
Cheers John.
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hollowhornbear

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Re: robbe seawolf v.2.
« Reply #10 on: February 19, 2012, 09:53:47 am »

hi Wadsworthj,
as Andy says i have one, definately fit a levller and also a fail safe or a speed controller with on. they don't always pop back up. if you need any help just holler on here or via PM.
do away with the auto control of the front planes, just set them slighty down, decks awash and down she'll go. have made my front planes operational.
hope this helps can take picks if you want.
HHB
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wadsworthj

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Re: robbe seawolf v.2.
« Reply #11 on: February 19, 2012, 12:39:19 pm »

Hi There.
            Many thanks for your input.i will certainly invest in an esc with f/s, any suggestions ?
I run a  " radiolink 6ch 2.4 fhss.tx would any rx bind to it, or would it have to be a radiolin rx.
lastly, where would be the best place to purchase these items,
Please dont say "My Hobby Stores", they are off my xmas card list.
thanks for your time.
Cheers   John. 8)
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Patrick Henry

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Re: robbe seawolf v.2.
« Reply #12 on: February 19, 2012, 01:25:19 pm »

Did you say a 2.4gHz radio? That won't work underwater, I'm sorry to tell you...27mHz or 40mHz is the way to go for subs. I use a Robbe F-14 tx with either Robbe/Futaba rx's or Corona rx's in my subs, but any good six channel outfit will serve you well.

Everyone has their own favourite stores, I use Sussex Model Centre in Worthing or Westbourne Models in Bournemouth. For Corona rx's, I get them from HobbyKing online.


Rich
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Patrick Henry

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Re: robbe seawolf v.2.
« Reply #13 on: February 19, 2012, 01:41:59 pm »

Here's my old Seawolf, by the way...converted into a Cold War concept boat named "Mother Russia".








Rich
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Subculture

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Re: robbe seawolf v.2.
« Reply #14 on: February 19, 2012, 01:55:42 pm »

The microgyros site I posted earlier do an excellent ESC with built in failsafe. You can program it for different trigger time too, so small glitches don't cause it to cut in.
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wadsworthj

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Re: robbe seawolf v.2.
« Reply #15 on: February 19, 2012, 03:20:23 pm »

To Subculture and U33.uncle tom cobbly an all!!
Cheers and thanks for the info, and pics, it is whetting my appetite for when the seawolf actually arrives.
Thats when (my hobby stores), can actually be bothered to post it, dont you just hate it when a firm takes your money, then tells you
that they might be arssed, to post it within seven working days, and then leave you in the dark!
Anyone else had this problem, "dont all reply at once".
Exellent pics of the conversion, ill add them to my files.
Now to hunt down a cheap 27mhz rx.
Cheers  john.   ;D
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Subculture

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Re: robbe seawolf v.2.
« Reply #16 on: February 19, 2012, 03:50:06 pm »

Sounds like poor service. I'd go elsewhere in future.

You'll have a tough time finding a 27mhz set with more than 2 channels these days, and you'll need at least three for a seawolf. Go for 40mhz. Something like a Hitec Laser 4 or 6, or a Futaba Skysport are good straightforward sets. There are quite few secondhand bargains kicking about too, especially as a lot of people (sailing targets) are switching over to 2.4ghz, although it's helpful if you know what you're buying.
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wadsworthj

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Re: robbe seawolf v.2.
« Reply #17 on: February 19, 2012, 05:20:29 pm »

Hi Subculture.
                  Beat you to it!!!!!
Just purchased a 4 ch graupner micro magic set complete,
with xtals, new!! for £30.oo. inc P/P.
I do not hang around.     i will wait until i actually have in my sticky little hands before looking for a esc mit failsafe.
Cheers    John.    :})
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Re: robbe seawolf v.2.
« Reply #18 on: February 19, 2012, 06:12:30 pm »

Price is good. No experience with those, I expect it originates from China, despite the German badge engineering.
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wadsworthj

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Re: robbe seawolf v.2.
« Reply #19 on: February 19, 2012, 07:06:00 pm »

Hi subculture.
                   Mate, everything is made in china.
i even had to look at my bum, the other morning, after coming out of the shower,
to make sure that nothing was stamped on it!!!!!!!!!!!Cheers  John.      :o
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Andrew K. C.

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Re: robbe seawolf v.2.
« Reply #20 on: April 18, 2012, 08:17:31 am »

Hello,
Recent I also purchased the Robbe Seawolf, I have a 12V lead seal battery available on hand, can I use the 12V for this model instead of 6V? Is it too powerful? If using the 12V battery, what AMP ESC need to be use, 20AMP, 25AMP or even higher 40AMP?

Is the ESC AMP depend on the motor I use or depend on the battery voltage, how to choose the right AMP ESC, can anybody give me this informations as I am not an engineer or technician, so I know nothing about this.

Also, I plan to make this seawolf in static dive, is it OK to use the 12V waterpump??  I worry about the pump is too strong and drain too fast.

Thanks for anyone can give me the advise.

Andrew
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Re: robbe seawolf v.2.
« Reply #21 on: April 18, 2012, 04:21:04 pm »

Can't give any advice on the motor. It'll certainly move a lot quicker!

For a speed controller I recommend one of these-

http://microgyros.com/speed-control-setup.html

They allow 25A continuous with a very wide voltage range, plenty for a Seawolf, and they have a built in failsafe. Ask him about levellers whilst you're at it, they work very nicely on these models.

For static dive information, have a search on here and RCgroups, lots of people have converted these boats to static divers.
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