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Author Topic: Bob's H.M.S. Polyphemus  (Read 209718 times)

PICKETBOAT

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Re: H.M.S. Polyphemus (1881), not quite a submarine
« Reply #475 on: February 24, 2015, 12:04:00 pm »

Try making one of these, it might help. I can't make models without one.


Find a piece of thick ply, MDF or other such board approx 9 inches by 6 inches and at least 1/2 inch thick but nearer to 3/4 is better, Use a square and ruler to make sure it's square with crisp edges. Making it bigger is not an advantage if fact it makes it more difficult to use. Man made board is usually dead flat and heavier so this is best.


Buy or borrow a full sheet of 60 grade abrasive sheet (not sandpaper as it's rubbish and only lasts about a minute). Try Halfords or your local car re finishing/repair shop.


Use contact adhesive to stick this securely to one side of the piece of board, so it over hangs the edge slightly. When it's dry trim it off. It will blunt your scissors!


Find a piece of old rubber (an old hot water bottle would do) and punch out four discs about 1 inch diameter. Glue these to the other side of the board, one in each corner and drive a small tack through the centre to secure them really well. This will stop the thing wandering about when you use it. 


You can now level the bases of small fittings and remove material (quickly) from things like your ABS domes by rubbing them in circles on the sanding board, remembering to rotate them after a couple of rubs or you will very quickly remove more material from one side than another no matter how hard you try.


Make several boards the same with different grades of abrasive. The fine abrasive tends to clog a bit as it is intended for wet and dry use. I find the 60 grade excellent for all round use and usually the surface you are sanding on this thing is the base of the fitting and will be the bit you glue down.


Having the edges of the board dead square and with the abrasive right up to the edge is essential as you can sand small components using the board edge as a guide.


Sometimes the simplest tools are the most effective.     

PICKETBOAT

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Re: H.M.S. Polyphemus (1881), not quite a submarine
« Reply #476 on: February 24, 2015, 02:21:26 pm »




Note.

Sorry a miss type. It should have read 80 grade abrasive paper not 60 which is a bit to course.

Bob K

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Re: H.M.S. Polyphemus (1881), not quite a submarine
« Reply #477 on: February 24, 2015, 03:47:59 pm »

Excellent idea Picketboat.  I have made up a small block with coarse grit paper.  Still a lot of hard thick material to remove in shaving elliptical domes down to dished domes.  Slow going, around 4mm material thickness top & around flange.

However, then  . . .

I could kick myself.  After hours trying to file down these ABS domes this week, and wishing I had a bench grinder, I was putting away some tools to make room for building more fittings.  I had forgotten about the little Rotacraft drill that I had only recently used to grind out hollows for the deck hawse pipe entries.  My little grey cells failed to deduce I do have a Grinder. 
First turret top reshaped in a matter of minutes.  Finished with files then the grit paper block.
Doh !

The grit paper block was also ideal for finishing the ends of the clear acrylic turret tubes.

Photos soon.

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HMS Skirmisher (1905), HMS Amazon (1906), HMS K9 (1915), Type 212A (2002), HMS Polyphemus (1881), Descartes (1897), Iggle Piggle boat (CBBC), HMS Royal Marine (1943), HMS Marshall Soult, HMS Agincourt (1912)

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Re: H.M.S. Polyphemus (1881), Turrets
« Reply #478 on: February 24, 2015, 09:57:06 pm »

HMS Polyphemus (1881) Turrets

Thanks to Picketboat’s suggestion, plus my ‘discovering’ my Rotacraft has grinding bits, the turrets and superstructure features are now going well.  The six clear Nordenfelt turrets were first, temporarily protected with printer label paper to avoid scratches. 
Slots cut for the barrels. The domes will be raised slightly as all round view for the gunners.  Doors plus other detail to be added.

   Rear turrets.

I will complete the turrets but put them aside as I need to make up the many flying deck support pillars and drill holes for stanchions whilst I have access.

The circular superstructure features also have domed roofs, although more elliptical which meant grinding the top flat.  I may have to cut the centres out and re-model as they are still too rounded.  The forward conning position is figure eight shaped with an oval domed top.  Cut, stretch, fill and re-model. At least the dome will provide the lower curve under the bridge platform.  There are a lot of platforms and gear to go on top of the superstructures.  .


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ballastanksian

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Re: H.M.S. Polyphemus (1881), not quite a submarine
« Reply #479 on: February 24, 2015, 10:09:08 pm »

I am so pleased that you found a way to do the job through help from the forum and your tool collection! They look the business.

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PICKETBOAT

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Re: H.M.S. Polyphemus (1881), not quite a submarine
« Reply #480 on: February 25, 2015, 08:16:33 am »

Bob


I'm glad my suggestion  was of some help.


I'm enjoying the build of this very interesting and much overlooked vessel. I look forward to seeing the finished "Thunder Child" on the water.


Good modelling

Bob K

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Re: H.M.S. Polyphemus (1881), Pillars & Frames
« Reply #481 on: March 02, 2015, 02:48:46 pm »

HMS Polyphemus (1881), Pillars & Frames

To me detailing is the most enjoyable, although sometimes frustrating, part of any build.  I am in awe of some of the scale ships I see, but happy if I can do my best whilst hopefully improving.

Pillars
28 flying deck support pillars made up with boss and plate each end.  I had intended to make the flying decks removable, but there is too much detail between upper and lower decks, and even across decks, which meant this was not practical.  So, the external Piezo bilge alarm had to be relocated from under the flying deck to inside, under the funnel.

With all flying decks glued in place the pillars could now be fitted.  This would also allow the float off raft structures and inter deck walkways to be fitted more solidly.

    Support pillars

Life Raft handling frames
With the arrival of the two Shapeways life rafts I could start on the launching frameworks. 
These each have a boat supporting frame operated by helm-type wheels via gears to tilt the frame down towards either beam.  Alternatively the boats could be released in situ to float off if required.
The amount of Plastruct extrusions consumed has been considerable.
No, I am not going to make working versions !

First I made up the four vertical framework assemblies, slotting the main tubes for the horizontal jacking bars.  Next I constructed the two boat support frames, which slot into the bars.
Currently making up the hand-windlass assemblies between the deck sections, gear & shaft drives, not quite finished yet.

    Life raft frames

As I would be using tarpaulins I did not require interior detail on the boats.  Cheaper to 3D model.
The other 4 boats are from Quaycraft.  More on the boats next time.

Planning well ahead, the potential vulnerabilities of much hull-overhanging detail will make lake side handling extremely delicate.  It may need a special launching frame / straps to protect detail, life boats, prop shafts and bow rudders.  All part of the challenge.  O0

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HMS Skirmisher (1905), HMS Amazon (1906), HMS K9 (1915), Type 212A (2002), HMS Polyphemus (1881), Descartes (1897), Iggle Piggle boat (CBBC), HMS Royal Marine (1943), HMS Marshall Soult, HMS Agincourt (1912)

PICKETBOAT

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Re: H.M.S. Polyphemus (1881), not quite a submarine
« Reply #482 on: March 02, 2015, 04:36:15 pm »


Bob

May I suggest a light weight but strong well designed transportation box for the finished model as any damage will occur when you are getting it in or out of the house or car.
After all the build effort you may as well protect the finished model,
Looking good by the way. :-)) 

Bob K

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Re: H.M.S. Polyphemus (1881), transport case
« Reply #483 on: March 02, 2015, 07:54:34 pm »

That's an idea. I normally use the stand with a bit of Velcro on the back seat.  Interesting. Would have to be a secure tray up to waterline level, shaped for keel to 'slot in and secure', with neoprene bumpers below that level. I would have to be able to get the lifting straps under.
Maybe then a lightweight box cover with strong latches.

PS:  shaft & gear driven life raft winch completed.


Chart House next I think.
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raflaunches

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Re: H.M.S. Polyphemus (1881), not quite a submarine
« Reply #484 on: March 02, 2015, 08:11:27 pm »

Hi Bob


I'm building a box to carry my Majestic class into for the same reason- too much to break off in transit- and the other beneficial feature is that you can use it as a stand on a table to raise up, my dad did this with his HMS X1 at Warwick.
I've just got to make sure its strong enough to support the weight of the empty hull but still has approx 11lbs of lead weight built in! :D
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PICKETBOAT

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Re: H.M.S. Polyphemus (1881), not quite a submarine
« Reply #485 on: March 02, 2015, 08:51:52 pm »

Bob


You might be able to have the model lift in and out of the box from the side (see picture). The side of my boxes locks back in place and foam blocks on both sides gently clamp the hull.
 Shaped blocks of foam locate bow and stern. If the box is well designed and glued and screwed it can be made of really quite lightweight materials. You don't want a box that needs three people to lift without the model in it!
Keep those pictures coming
  K. :-))

ballastanksian

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Re: H.M.S. Polyphemus (1881), not quite a submarine
« Reply #486 on: March 02, 2015, 09:18:57 pm »

Excellent work Bob and Picket boat! Is that a German destroyer? Lovely work indeed. The boat lisfting mechanism looks to have influenced the designers of car hoists! They are superb models in their own right.
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Bob K

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Re: H.M.S. Polyphemus (1881), not quite a submarine
« Reply #487 on: March 02, 2015, 09:56:08 pm »

Lovely model of the V105 'Picketboat' !  Nice case too.  I was leaning towards a version of the case for the original Singer Sewing Machines, with lift off top, but looking online for ideas too. The Life Raft mechanism is as strange as the ship, unique I believe, so having been sent detail plans for it I could not resist building it complete.  Sometimes one gets carried away on stuff like this.
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HMS Skirmisher (1905), HMS Amazon (1906), HMS K9 (1915), Type 212A (2002), HMS Polyphemus (1881), Descartes (1897), Iggle Piggle boat (CBBC), HMS Royal Marine (1943), HMS Marshall Soult, HMS Agincourt (1912)

ballastanksian

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Re: H.M.S. Polyphemus (1881), not quite a submarine
« Reply #488 on: March 02, 2015, 10:58:51 pm »

It's your hobby Bob so you can do as much or as little as you like. But it is a vessel that needs some extra attention to detail.
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Bob K

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Re: H.M.S. Polyphemus (1881), Chart house
« Reply #489 on: March 05, 2015, 11:20:17 am »

HMS Polyphemus (1881), Chart House

Fun exercise in 1 mm ply and 0.5 mm walnut.  The wooden Chart House is just over an inch high, but with twelve windows made life interesting, especially having to make the desks and plan chest as they would be visible through the glazed windows. 
A couple of period admiralty charts reduced using Publisher were printed 13 x 9.  Dividers and a coffee mug.

  Roof platform omitted

No putting it off, a large number of stanchion holes to be drilled.

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Re: H.M.S. Polyphemus (1881), not quite a submarine
« Reply #490 on: March 05, 2015, 07:46:49 pm »

You are doing fab Bob. I like the details in the deck house. Good luck with the stanchions and their holes.
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raflaunches

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Re: H.M.S. Polyphemus (1881), not quite a submarine
« Reply #491 on: March 05, 2015, 08:59:56 pm »

Excellent work Bob, looks fantastic- can't wait to see her again in the future when she's complete. :-))
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Re: H.M.S. Polyphemus (1881), Licence decisions
« Reply #492 on: March 13, 2015, 07:35:28 pm »

HMS Polyphemus (1881), Licence decisions

  Licence decisions
I had to renew my Modeller Licence as there are some minor practicalities I may have to cheat a little on, as unlike the original ship on my version the decks need to lift off.  Keeping ‘cheats’ to a minimum is the goal of this stage.

The centre third of the main deck stanchions were fitted to the hull sides.  I had already fitted half-round tubes to hull and deck edges to make it look right, but the actual stanchions will be fitted slightly inboard on the main deck edge.  (see photos Reply #482).



The aftermost davit pairs were also fitted to the hull sides. In this case I am biting the bullet to make up soldered brass support tubes with brackets, fitted with #0 s/tap screws and epoxy. 
The propeller protection fender booms luckily can be mounted on the deck edges, with wire and epoxy reinforcement. 
To separate the main deck from the f’o’c’s’le deck I have to mount the interconnecting companionways with clear acrylic supports behind as they could not be glued at the top.

The only other split-line snags are the disposal shutes from the flying decks to hull sides, which will have to terminate at the split line.

Hopefully all this will not be too noticeable in the end result.

Superstructures and turrets progressing well.
I now have all the ships boats, and a supply of 0.5mm drills.

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Re: H.M.S. Polyphemus (1881), Stanchions
« Reply #493 on: March 25, 2015, 09:33:09 am »

HMS Polyphemus (1881), Stanchions

Rear davit supports and prop protection fenders in.  Can’t put it off any longer, stanchions next.

  Stanchions
I had forgotten how much I ‘enjoy’ making over 200 tiny holes with drills I can hardly see.  So far I have only broken three. That’s a step forwards, but at least they are 0,5 dia - bigger than last time. 
Lots of curved edges and domed surfaces to contend with. 
Used John R Haynes JRH 566 16mm, plus 0.5 soft brass wire.

Hole size was determined by diagonal of etched brass spigot, allowing for a light push fit with micro pliers. A drop of superglue on spigots to secure. 

My preferred modus operandi is to slide the stanchions onto the wires, fit and glue four, then the next four, finally solder the whole section.  Better accuracy and control, even if I will have to paint them in situ like before. Jigs not practical due to curves and slightly irregular spacing due to bollards and other deck fittings.

Kudos for Carrs 188 Solder Paint, just a touch with a tinned iron.  No plastic melting, and solder limits itself to the ‘painted’ joint.  Makes rail soldering a doddle.



With most of the stanchions and rails in place I can now top off the superstructures.  The three main islands, chart house platform, all needing single hole stanchions (which I just noticed).  Ordered, and arrived promptly.







Lots still to do.  Pant the railings, complete the superstructures, davits, ships boats, cranes and chains, companionways, turrets, mast and rigging etc.

I am aiming to complete in time for the Victorian Fleet Review at Mayhem.  It has been a long project, so nearly abandoned after the inadvertent submergence more than a year ago.


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Re: H.M.S. Polyphemus (1881), not quite a submarine
« Reply #494 on: March 25, 2015, 11:49:01 am »

Looks gorgeous Bob! :-))
Can't wait until Mayhem weekend to see her, and you of course! :D
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Re: H.M.S. Polyphemus (1881), not quite a submarine
« Reply #495 on: March 25, 2015, 11:50:41 am »

She's really beginning to come alive now. Pity I won't be at Mayhem to see her (I'll be in the Loire valley with the family). No doubt I'll catch up with her eventually.
ij
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Re: H.M.S. Polyphemus (1881), not quite a submarine
« Reply #496 on: March 25, 2015, 12:04:27 pm »

Hullo Bob.......not sure if I am loosing it  %)..... but........

Reply #19 on 29th May 2012...we see the STDB prop of the actual vessel in dock as right handed
Reply #494 on 25th March 2015 ....we see the STDB prop on the model as left handed

I realise there are 475 posting in between that I have not re-read.........but was there a change? :o.........Derek
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Bob K

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Re: H.M.S. Polyphemus (1881), not quite a submarine
« Reply #497 on: March 25, 2015, 01:13:54 pm »

Wow !  You are observant Derek !!!   I compared the photo in Chatham Dockyard with my latest photo.  I guess after the rebuild I went into autopilot and fitted the props 'top edges turn inwards, as seen from the rear' as usual.
Bagpuss Hat needed. 
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HMS Skirmisher (1905), HMS Amazon (1906), HMS K9 (1915), Type 212A (2002), HMS Polyphemus (1881), Descartes (1897), Iggle Piggle boat (CBBC), HMS Royal Marine (1943), HMS Marshall Soult, HMS Agincourt (1912)

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Re: H.M.S. Polyphemus (1881), not quite a submarine
« Reply #498 on: March 25, 2015, 02:55:29 pm »

It's all coming back to me now as I try to remove the props.  After the sinking, by the time I was able flush out and start removing the waterlogged innards, the prop nuts were immovable even after WD40, as were the steel grub screws on the inboard collets.  The shafts are cleaned and lubed, so will have to stay as is unless I can figure a way to hold the installed shaft in a vice.

As it runs OK I may have to leave alone at this time.
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Re: H.M.S. Polyphemus (1881), not quite a submarine
« Reply #499 on: March 25, 2015, 09:41:39 pm »

Leave it as is Bob. I have awful images of something slipping and your detailing work being wrecked by the 'Molegrips of doom'.

Better to work and be slightly wrong than be accurate but dented.

Poly is coming along a treat. I nearly bought a pot of solder poaste when I was last in Squires but was unsure of what it was for exactly. I didn't ask Mr Squire, and so thought it might be for soldering copper tape as used in Dolls house electrics. That ad solder paste sound like materials made in heaven.

Keep up the god work.
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