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Author Topic: Restoration of an old yacht, possibly 36R of pond yacht pedigree..?  (Read 14712 times)

roycv

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Re: Restoration of an old yacht, possibly 36R of pond yacht pedigree..?
« Reply #25 on: August 28, 2012, 09:32:36 AM »

Hi A/M, I think I can find some pictures somewhere.  I stopped because I did something stupid!  I did not know it at the time but there we are.

The yacht is a "pond yacht" but had a rather iffy set of deck planks drawn on with a pencil.  Also the planks were tapered at each end, so there were the same number of planks across the deck.  I at the time thought this a bit strange so decided to clean up the deck by scraping down and doing them again.  The deck is a single piece of wood, not ply.

In the process I read some more info on full size yachts and found that Victorian Gentleman's yachts did indeed have tapered deck planks.  I was so peed off with myself that I stopped work!  I suppose that is the way we learn!

I should also say the the boat came to me with some swaps for radio control equipment and the previous owner had decided to waterproof the inside of the boat with roofing black paint / tar, which will not come off!
The hull planks were very well done and screwed on but started to shrink, I prised off the deck in one piece and revealed some very thin planking due to being rubbed down.  I strengthened this and started water treatment to get the planks to absorb water and swell again and this seemed to work.  Just wish I had left the deck alone!

The project is still in my head and will get done but at the moment I am working on a Zwarte Zee (original plank on frame) rescued from a loft 2 months ago.  A customs launch and a small schooner. I am also doing the admin for our annual exhibition.
So apart from the above I go ballroom dancing 2 / 3 times a week, play bridge and am a club secretary and like to cook, as you can surmise I am retired!

regards Roy
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Artistmike

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Re: Restoration of an old yacht, possibly 36R of pond yacht pedigree..?
« Reply #26 on: August 28, 2012, 10:21:51 AM »

Well Roy, we all do things like that, that's for sure !  It's one of the reasons that the progress on my pond yacht restoration is fairly slow. It's the only one I have, so I'm scared of messing anything up and instead of working to the old adage of ' measure twice and cut once ' I have modified that to 'measure fifty times and cut once' and still it's easy to mess up !   {:-{

Half the fun though is overcoming the problems and when you finish, the pain tends to go away ...... One alternative to water in restoring shrunken planks is lots of linseed oil or a linseed oil bath even, and it tends to make a more permanent job of it....           Is the external hull varnished or painted, because you could actually put a coat of resin on externally to waterproof it, .... just thinking out loud really. ....

The deck on mine is solid and of one piece too, a piece of 3/16th pine, which luckily is in nice condition and the deck lines have been nicely engraved. Might it be worth making a new deck for yours ? Actually I think it's worth having a few jobs on the go, it's often when you walk away from a problem and let your subconscious simmer on it, that it will pop up an answer further down the line....

Yes I'm retired too, though I still paint just for the pleasure of it but it's so difficult to find the time now to do everything I want !  :((
 ...





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Artistmike

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Re: Restoration of an old yacht, possibly 36R of pond yacht pedigree..?
« Reply #27 on: September 06, 2012, 02:48:51 PM »

At this stage I've installed the Radio Control system, at the moment it's following normal two channel procedure but should I decide later I need a further trim for the jib it will be easy to install one up the fore end.

I had a spare Hitec Sail Winch HS-725BB from a IOM boat so that's what I'm starting with and a standard Hitec servo for the rudder but with a long double servo arm, to give me more throw, that will work the rudder using cordage through two Nylet Sheet Leads onto the Braine Quadrant. I'm using similar sheet leads for the jib and main sheets too.  I've used Nylet pulley blocks internally fore and aft too for the winch run, I'm trying to make sure that when the deck is replaced, it has to come off as few times as possible so things internally are being built nice and strongly !  I have access through the hatch but I'm hoping that will just be for battery charging and checking the receiver. The deck will be removable as nothing is fool-proof but as I say, hopefully not too often !  :-)

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mrpenguin

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Re: Restoration of an old yacht, possibly 36R of pond yacht pedigree..?
« Reply #28 on: September 06, 2012, 11:47:58 PM »

@ArtistMike:
As you have it set up, if you needed to rethread the winch you have to remove the deck - this would be a big job I would think?
Also if you get a tangle , the winch may damage the boat at one of the anchor points.

There is an alternative method of doing a continuous winch loop below decks so you do not have to remove the deck to access winch ends.
The setup is identical to what you have except it is built on a strength member eg a piece of aluminium box section or such
The idea is that you build the entire winch loop setup as a separate module that then installs into the boat thru the hatch.
 
This idea works best if the hatch is more toward the stern as the module will be about 300-400mm long for a 1 metre boat.

There is an example built like this here (although this is a minature with limit switches, but should convey the general idea):
http://www.modelboats.co.uk/news/article/miniature-sail-winch/537/

HTH
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Artistmike

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Re: Restoration of an old yacht, possibly 36R of pond yacht pedigree..?
« Reply #29 on: September 07, 2012, 07:35:38 AM »

hi  HTH

Yes, one of the reasons I've been slow getting to this stage is that I have in fact been attempting to toy with a removable set-up but the flipping access I have into the hull with the deck on, is just far too small to be practical unfortunately and I really don't want to enlarge that and alter the deck, any more than I have to. .... The deck will be removable, as in screwed down as per the original design, but I'm trying to make the installation as simple and fool-proof as possible, so that the need for access is not a common occurrence.

The set-up I'm doing shouldn't tangle, it's tried and tested in my IOMs and when the plastic tubing from the deck for the sheets is installed, there's no contact between lines, fingers crossed !  :-)  Of course I've built in the normal weak point in the way of some elastic which tensions the system but it also acts a fail-safe. I'm pretty confident that, in the event of anything going amiss, that will snap long before the hull gets damaged as that's made of half inch thick solid pine, ... you'd need a sledgehammer to make any impression on that ! 
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triumphjon

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Re: Restoration of an old yacht, possibly 36R of pond yacht pedigree..?
« Reply #30 on: September 07, 2012, 07:59:13 AM »

ive been watvhing your restoration with interest , i too took on an old pond yacht last year and converted to modern rc , ive not yet ventured into drum winches ( ive bougt a new hitec one thats sitting in its box )  for my build ive used the arm servos , but ive made a second hatch into the hull above my two sail servos , which is normally screwed closed unless its for maintenance . could you not have another acsess into the hull disgiused as a cabin etc ? jon
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Artistmike

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Re: Restoration of an old yacht, possibly 36R of pond yacht pedigree..?
« Reply #31 on: September 07, 2012, 08:21:49 AM »

ive been watvhing your restoration with interest , i too took on an old pond yacht last year and converted to modern rc , ive not yet ventured into drum winches ( ive bougt a new hitec one thats sitting in its box )  for my build ive used the arm servos , but ive made a second hatch into the hull above my two sail servos , which is normally screwed closed unless its for maintenance . could you not have another acsess into the hull disgiused as a cabin etc ? jon

I want to do as little as possible to the existing hull and deck externally really Jon, so that I keep it all looking as original as possible when it's sailing.  ....I did think a lot about making those sorts of alterations and even at one stage making a totally new deck for it with the sort of arrangement you mention but in the end came down on the side of keeping it as close as possible to how it would have looked when it was on the water about a hundred years ago when it was sailing.

I use arm servos on my smaller yachts too but with a main boom of this length, over twenty-one inches, and a big mainsail on top of it,  %%  a drum winch is a lot more practical.  :-)
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roycv

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Re: Restoration of an old yacht, possibly 36R of pond yacht pedigree..?
« Reply #32 on: September 07, 2012, 09:21:41 AM »

Hi AM following the thread with interest.  I have used the system referred to by MrP based on a dowel rod with a pulley at the end, I have to admit I have not had to remove it since installation but it is the inevitability of breakage and repair that conditions us.  As against the glue it all in place it is not worth repairing ideas from  China.

I am also starting to make notes on how my various models operate as the memory cannot always be relied on.
regards Roy
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Artistmike

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Re: Restoration of an old yacht, possibly 36R of pond yacht pedigree..?
« Reply #33 on: September 07, 2012, 10:25:35 AM »

I am also starting to make notes on how my various models operate as the memory cannot always be relied on.
regards Roy

Isn't that the truth !   O0  ... I'm doing the same for mine, partially as I know the fallibility of memory and also, when I do eventually leave this mortal coil, I shall pass them on to a family member who has in interest in modelling so he can carry on using them and it will save him having to try to decipher all my wiring as it's all somewhat idiosyncratic.  {-) ...
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JayDee

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Re: Restoration of an old yacht, possibly 36R of pond yacht pedigree..?
« Reply #34 on: September 07, 2012, 11:07:46 AM »


Hello Mike,

Leave your Winch where it is and fit this onto the top of it.
You will not need all those pulleys and tensioners, nor will you need to ever take the deck off !!.

I have had this system on my schooner, Bluenose for over 20 years , never, ever had any problems with it.
It will let you hold the main boom amidships, sheet out all the sheet, then gently pull the boom out fully, without ANY snagging !!.

Been there, Done that !!.

John.

www.john-dowd.co.uk
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JayDee

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Re: Restoration of an old yacht, possibly 36R of pond yacht pedigree..?
« Reply #35 on: September 07, 2012, 12:18:56 PM »

Hello Mike,

When the winch drum turns inside the box, the line unwinds off the drum, IF, the line is being pulled by the sails, the line comes out of the box as you would expect it too.
But, when there is no pulling from the sails, the line stays inside the box, but it does not get tangled up, or get snagged under or over the edges of the winch drum.

It just lies there waiting to be pulled out by the sails !!.
And it works EVERY time !!.

The box is big enough to contain all of the line, which forms nice orderly loops which don't get tangled up!.
Try it on the bench, you will love it !!!.

John.  :-))  :-))  :-))
www.john-dowd.co.uk
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Artistmike

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Re: Restoration of an old yacht, possibly 36R of pond yacht pedigree..?
« Reply #36 on: September 07, 2012, 12:23:33 PM »

John,

It's another thing I'd considered but decided against mainly because, unlike the system I've put in, I've absolutely no experience of putting a winch in like that, at least this way I know that hopefully it will work as I've used it for a long time with my one meters and marblehead !  :-)  Having said that, further down the line I may experiment with the concept to see how I get on with it as it obviously works well in yours and it's nice to try new things.

My main problem is that the existing hole in the deck is just three inches in total, which must include access for batteries, receiver etc. so I really don't have a lot of room to work with, to say the least. As it is I will just have enough room to make adjustments to the winch and change batteries when necessary and the rudder servo will just have to take it's chances ! At least I can take the deck of if necessary though so I do have a bit of fall back situation.
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Re: Restoration of an old yacht, possibly 36R of pond yacht pedigree..?
« Reply #37 on: September 07, 2012, 12:27:56 PM »



Hello Mike,

I wish you Luck !!

John.  :-)
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Artistmike

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Re: Restoration of an old yacht, possibly 36R of pond yacht pedigree..?
« Reply #38 on: September 07, 2012, 02:53:57 PM »

Thanks John, I'll need it and I may well give you a shout if I get stuck..  :-)
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Artistmike

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Re: Restoration of an old yacht, possibly 36R of pond yacht pedigree..?
« Reply #39 on: September 16, 2012, 10:44:39 AM »

This week I've been fiddling about trying to work out what fittings I'll need and making or buying the same as well as making and varnishing temporary bowsprit, booms, hatch cover and aft piece.

As this yacht came as hull and mast only, I'm really winging it when it comes to designing parts. I'm basing the sails and rig on William Daniel's Babette so I'm using those dimensions to make the booms. I'm absolutely sure this had a bowsprit now but again, the length is just a guess and may well need re-designing when it's had it's first sail as may the booms themselves. Still you have to start somewhere.  {:-{

Next job I have to put the sheet leads through the deck and work out the final placing of the shroud racks etc. before the painting begins..  :-)

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Artistmike

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Re: Restoration of an old yacht, possibly 36R of pond yacht pedigree..?
« Reply #40 on: September 16, 2012, 11:05:30 AM »

Oh and I tidied up the inside a bit, and have got hold of a receiver, charging harness and switch so I now need to get the battery pack that I'm going to use and get that fitted in, then the inside will be just about ready ....

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Artistmike

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Re: Restoration of an old yacht, possibly 36R of pond yacht pedigree..?
« Reply #41 on: October 06, 2012, 03:36:34 PM »

For Wayne, a quick photo of how the rudder lines emerge from the deck through fairleads....  :-)

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goBulawayo

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Re: Restoration of an old yacht, possibly 36R of pond yacht pedigree..?
« Reply #42 on: October 06, 2012, 04:01:19 PM »

Thanks Artistmike, Was looking at some of your other pics, was your gooseneck with the yacht or have you bought it recently? My kripsie plans show a homemade plastic fitting for the gooseneck support  but I prefer the idea of a metal fitting

Wayne
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Artistmike

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Re: Restoration of an old yacht, possibly 36R of pond yacht pedigree..?
« Reply #43 on: October 06, 2012, 04:07:46 PM »

I am buying a few bits and pieces from these chaps http://www.nylet.co.uk/  but you'll also find things like the goosenecks here on Cornwall Model Boats.. http://www.cornwallmodelboats.co.uk/acatalog/aeronaut_yacht_fittings.html down the page a bit ...
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Artistmike

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Re: Restoration of an old yacht, possibly 36R of pond yacht pedigree..?
« Reply #44 on: June 27, 2018, 01:02:06 PM »

I've not been very well for a while but thankfully today was actually able to get back to the water at Ilfracombe and give this one it's first sail since I did the restoration. I'm glad to say that all went well,  even better than I could have hoped  to be honest and it sailed beautifully.... Well worth the wait....


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roycv

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Re: Restoration of an old yacht, possibly 36R of pond yacht pedigree..?
« Reply #45 on: June 27, 2018, 01:30:52 PM »

Hi artistmike, well done she looks good.  Glad to hear you are OK now, I was reading the thread posts and suddenly realised I was on there as well.  The point I made about memory is obviously true!
kind regards Roy
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Artistmike

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Re: Restoration of an old yacht, possibly 36R of pond yacht pedigree..?
« Reply #46 on: June 27, 2018, 03:46:17 PM »

Thanks, yes a good bit better now, at least good enough to get down the lake and that's the main thing....  :}   I know what you mean about memory, I've far too many boats, chargers and batteries and if I didn't make notes about what goes where I'd be in a right old mess...

Still, it was lovely to get out and have a sail again, good for the soul this hobby.....
As she looks out of the water.....
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roycv

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Re: Restoration of an old yacht, possibly 36R of pond yacht pedigree..?
« Reply #47 on: June 27, 2018, 05:24:36 PM »

Hi nice piccys.  Is the mast mounted on the deck?  Was the bowsprit your idea?regards Roy
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Artistmike

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Re: Restoration of an old yacht, possibly 36R of pond yacht pedigree..?
« Reply #48 on: June 27, 2018, 05:58:46 PM »

Hi nice piccys.  Is the mast mounted on the deck?  Was the bowsprit your idea?regards Roy
No, the mast goes through the deck to the original brass mast mount in the bottom of the hull of the boat...

The current provisional bowsprit I made in order to try various positions for the jib, it's difficult to tell from the original deck what exactly the situation was and as the mast is fixed, I needed a way or trying out various positions for the jib tack, fore and aft, to balance these sails.

Having had a sail today it was fairly obvious that the tack needs moving even a bit more outboard from the position of the furthest position that I have at the moment,  so a bowsprit is definitely needed to get the best out of the boat, so I shall now have to make something more permanent and in keeping.
It's going to be for purely pleasure sailing so I'm not trying to conform to any rules and if it sails happier with a bowsprit than without, that's ok with me....  :-)
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roycv

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Re: Restoration of an old yacht, possibly 36R of pond yacht pedigree..?
« Reply #49 on: June 27, 2018, 08:14:43 PM »

Hi, I always try and get the mast on the keel as it makes rigging so much easier and stiffens the mast as well.  I also try and get it to sit in a tube, not always easy but it can be easier to stop water ingress.

My first effort like this was with a wood mast which got wet and it took 3 weeks to get the mast out of the tube,  I now use interlocking tubes with the inner one around the mast base.
I am just adding a bowsprit to a yacht and for the same reasons of balancing the rig.
Happy days,
Roy
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