Model Boat Mayhem - Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length.
Pages: [1] 2   Go Down

Author Topic: father / son project  (Read 4202 times)

mtis2000

  • Shipmate
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 8
  • Location: London UK
father / son project
« on: August 17, 2012, 02:15:17 PM »

Hi, I am new to the forum and as new in the r/c boat world. I inherited a speed boat (pretty old) made of polyester resin and fiberglass equipped with a  .61 cu inch glow-plug engine (HP .61 with a golden top and dark grey / purple coating on the rest)
no servos, receiver or batteries
I am planning to use it as the centre of a project to involve my son with other than Xbox games and facebook!
2 main steps:

the engine: make it work on a bench (myself... as I am a mechanical engineer with a bit of experience in auto mechanics)
the hull : repair and paint (my son ....)

if both go to the end, we will re-attach the engine to the boat and equip the lot with R/C system (do not know much about options there....)

I started by stripping the engine and clean it all, dismantled the carb and put it back together...

my first question is : what is the minimal equipment I need to buy to test it

fuel... i guess, is a sure purchase!!! what mix? quality? quantity?
tank (looking at the exhaust, there is a nipple sticking out so i assume it would be a "pressurised" one
starter: powering glow-plug... and rotating the shaft (there is a large brass pulley on it...
fuel line? and since there is a water jacket do I need to cool it down with water as I try it or is it only for continuous use?

and of course, anything I have not though of...

I will try to keep the topic moving with pics and work update!

thanks in advance for sharing you knowledge and so helping this project to go ahead!

Patrice

PS I am French, living among Brits for the last 18 years but with an obvious lack of tech vocabulary... apologies for funny phrases or words...
Logged

boatmadman

  • Full Mayhemer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2,721
  • Location: South Cumbria
Re: father / son project
« Reply #1 on: August 17, 2012, 02:54:24 PM »

Hi and welcome to the madhouse!

some observations, about your engine. If you have a model shop nearby, take it to them for suggestions for fuel and glow plug options. Probably 10% nitro mix is a good starting point. Dont buy too much initially, as you may have to change the mix depending on how the engine runs.

To start the motor, you will need a battery operated starter motor, with a belt link around the engine pulley.

Tank, if its a pressurised tank there will be 3 connection, 1 for filling, one to the carb and the third connects to the exhaust for pressure. The supply to the engine should have a klunk fitted inside the tank. This is just a brass wight on the end of the tube to ensure suction is maintained by keeping the tube end at the bottom of the tank.

Fuel line - silicone fuel line from model shops - make sure its the right stuff to protect against the fuel.

I think you will need the water cooling as the air flow in a boat is restricted.

Testing. Make sure when you test the engine out of the boat that it is secure. I speak from experience here, I had a .46 engine running clamped in a workmate with an aero prop on. The engine came out and took off the tip of a finger without missing a beat!

Get or make a proper test mount so that the engine is bolted down, dont rely on clamping. I only use ic in planes, but to run a marine nitro on test I think it should have a little load on it to make it work and avoid over revving. Run a connecting wire from the throttle to behind the engine so you can adjust speed. Fix the wire so it has some resistance to movement so vibrations dont work the throttle open.

Above all, be carefull, they pack a surprising amount of power for a small engine.

Having said all that, the nitro boaters on here may well add comments, or correct me.

Ian.

PS nothing wrong with your English. :-))


Logged
if at first you dont succeed.....have a beer.....

mtis2000

  • Shipmate
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 8
  • Location: London UK
Re: father / son project
« Reply #2 on: August 17, 2012, 03:38:56 PM »

thank you for your fast reply. Would you recommend an on-line supplier as model shops are scarce around my location!
are there any "beginners kit" including glow plug starter + electric belt starter ?

Logged

boatmadman

  • Full Mayhemer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2,721
  • Location: South Cumbria
Re: father / son project
« Reply #3 on: August 17, 2012, 03:45:57 PM »

hi,

My 'local' shop (40 miles away) does mail order and are extremely helpful on the phone:

http://www.lancastermodelshop.co.uk/

I have also used:

http://www.stevewebb.co.uk/

who are also very good. Other members may offer alternatives.

There is also Giant shark and Hobbyking - google them, but they lack the personal touch, ok if you know what you want.

Ian
Logged
if at first you dont succeed.....have a beer.....

Stormbringer

  • Full Mayhemer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 437
  • Location: S.Queensferry Scotland
Re: father / son project
« Reply #4 on: August 17, 2012, 07:24:09 PM »

welcome aboard  :-))
Logged

gwa84the2nd

  • Full Mayhemer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 134
  • Location: east riding of yourkshire hull
Re: father / son project
« Reply #5 on: August 17, 2012, 07:52:00 PM »

hi and welcome to mayhem your engine is a good one could you upload picks please i do like my nitro stuff lol as sead 10 persend is a good start for fuel for a glow plug an os 8 sould be a good plug for that motor and fuel mix re test benching the engine make a mounting plate to boltthe engine dawn to somthing make sure that the exoust is well fitted and the flyweel is secured tighlty to the crank you will need a water suply throw the engine usualy a buet of water abouve the engine with some fuel pipe ataching the water nipple on the cooling coller then sunk into the buket then you just suck on the tub to creat a syphon tie a loos not in the tupe about jalf way dawn then just ajust the not till you get a steady flow but not jeting 3 feet out the other nipple to much cooling can damege the engine   

you will be able o run the engine unloaded to about hlf throtle dnt rev its nust off

to start it you will need agow starter glow plug spanner and some small screwdirvers you can get a cheep starting kit on ebay

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/RC-Nitro-Starter-Kit-Glow-Starter-Charger-350cc-Bottle-/330508071124?pt=UK_ToysGames_RadioControlled_JN&hash=item4cf3d0f0d4

you will also need a starter motor like this and a 12 volt batery to run it of

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/JP-POWERtorque-MODEL-NITRO-GASOLINE-STARTER-FOR-AEROPLANE-BOAT-CAR-/330777129298?pt=UK_ToysGames_RadioControlled_JN&hash=item4d03da7152

foyour fuel tank and most other consumables for your engin fuel line ext then just engines is the best ive used to date you will need a starting belt from prestwich models you can get the starter from there as well
http://www.justengines.co.uk/

http://www.prestwich.ndirect.co.uk/engine_equipment.htm



hope that helps for naw ill put another post up regarding running up the engine in a whi just need a pick to conferm the engine and settings  :-))

naw for starting
Logged

dodgy geezer

  • Full Mayhemer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3,920
  • Location: London
Re: father / son project
« Reply #6 on: August 17, 2012, 09:45:17 PM »

Starting off with a 10cc racing boat is a bit ambitious. Not impossible, but certainly ambitious! I would suggest that you could do with being quite close to either a model shop or a club, in order to get things checked out. As was said above, these motors can pack a fair bit of power, and the boat will probably travel fast.

Where are you thinking of running it? There are limited venues for I/C powered craft. I suggest that you find a place to run it, then go there and chat to a few of the people who are sailing similar boats to the one you have. I would be surprised if you didn't get offers of support. At the least, you should find someone who can show you the sort of kit which is needed, and who will probably offer to help trim the boat when it has its first outing... 
Logged

A66

  • Full Mayhemer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 50
  • Location: Bedfordshire
Re: father / son project
« Reply #7 on: August 17, 2012, 10:00:35 PM »

Hi, not sure where you are located but if you could find your way to Stevenage M B C we would be only to willing to help,we run I/C boats most Sunday mornings. we are based at Fairlands Valley Lesiure Park from 9.00 AM till 12.00.
Cheers Steve.
Logged

mtis2000

  • Shipmate
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 8
  • Location: London UK
Re: father / son project
« Reply #8 on: August 18, 2012, 07:18:33 AM »

Thanks a million for all you insight and as new questions (like where to go with the finished product!!!) pop out I do appreciate the answers I am receiving.
Pictures to follow ASAP
Logged

mtis2000

  • Shipmate
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 8
  • Location: London UK
Re: father / son project
« Reply #9 on: August 19, 2012, 09:56:59 AM »

still no pictures, but I went to hobby store in Camden and got a lot of advice from them. Came back home with 35 worth of bits and pieces including 16% nitro fuel (their advice after they had a look on the engine). I built a bench by reversing the original mounting plates and fixing them on a solid wood worktop off-cut , charged my new glow starter overnight and filled a small tank with the magic mix!
First thing i did this morning was to roll a string around the pulley and give a spin.... and.... it worked after 4 or 5 spin the little "illigitimate" shrieked in my garden and filled me with satisfaction....
to be continued!
Logged

dodgy geezer

  • Full Mayhemer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3,920
  • Location: London
Re: father / son project
« Reply #10 on: August 19, 2012, 12:06:32 PM »


First thing i did this morning was to roll a string around the pulley and give a spin....


You will find (if you're not using a starter motor) that the best cord to use by far is a stout leather thong. They used to be sold as leather bootlaces in the 1960s - I don't know if they can be found nowadays....
Logged

Beach2

  • Shipmate
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1
Re: father / son project
« Reply #11 on: August 19, 2012, 03:23:52 PM »

Hello i am pretty new to the forum as well but i have had a very similar experience. i two bought a rather old model boat which has an ic glow plug engine. as you can see from the pictures it is pretty much ready to go now and all i am waiting for is the arrival of the remote and receiver unit. the receiver goes in the white box you can see along with a battery. and then connects on to the bottom of the Aerial. what you may also want to check is if it is water cooled in my boat the when the propeller spines that pushes the water up around the copper tubing and out the side of the boat. also a good thing to do as mentioned before is to take it to the local pond, i got allot of great help there one kind man even volunteered to bring the necessary stuff to get the motor running. i hope this helps you to see where it all goes. feel free to ask any questions


PS i have run out of time but will post pictures soon
Logged

scoop

  • Full Mayhemer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 305
  • Location: Northamptonshire
Re: father / son project
« Reply #12 on: August 19, 2012, 04:14:40 PM »

Thanks a million for all you insight and as new questions (like where to go with the finished product!!!) pop out I do appreciate the answers I am receiving.
Pictures to follow ASAP
You could always pop along to one of our BMPRS race meets with it  :-)) go to www.bmprs.co.uk for details

Regards
Scoop
Logged
BMPRS Secretary/Pro www.bmprs.co.uk
PS. There ain't no going back

Netleyned

  • Full Mayhemer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 8,986
  • Location: Meridian Line, Mouth of the Humber
    • cleethorpes mba
Re: father / son project
« Reply #13 on: August 19, 2012, 04:30:56 PM »

You will find (if you're not using a starter motor) that the best cord to use by far is a stout leather thong. They used to be sold as leather bootlaces in the 1960s - I don't know if they can be found nowadays....


Mostly on girls of the night  %%

Ned
Logged
Smooth seas never made skilful sailors
Up Spirits  Stand fast the Holy Ghost.
http://www.cleethorpesmba.co.uk/

A66

  • Full Mayhemer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 50
  • Location: Bedfordshire
Re: father / son project
« Reply #14 on: August 19, 2012, 09:24:49 PM »

Hi all, Leather Thong or bootlace can sometimes be found on bead suppliers, my wife draged me round our local suppler on the market they had a real of it @ 1.50 or so per meter, Starts my HP 40 a treat.
Steve
Logged

dodgy geezer

  • Full Mayhemer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3,920
  • Location: London
Re: father / son project
« Reply #16 on: August 20, 2012, 07:20:12 AM »

Yup - that looks like the stuff. Things like nylon cord work fine when the motor is clean, but as soon as it starts to get a bit of oil over it, the leather is the only thing that will grip properly... O0
Logged

mtis2000

  • Shipmate
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 8
  • Location: London UK
Re: father / son project
« Reply #17 on: August 20, 2012, 09:15:42 AM »

as promised...



Logged

mtis2000

  • Shipmate
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 8
  • Location: London UK
Re: father / son project
« Reply #18 on: August 20, 2012, 09:25:37 AM »

next problem:

engine runs idle with needle turned 1 turn anticlockwise from closed, and as expected, stalls when throttled up. If I open the needle more, the carb leaks fuel pretty badly... Is there anything to do (assuming the brass cylinder is somehow worn out)
are carbs individually replaceable? standard? I assume the part are no longer produced for this precise engine!
Logged

dodgy geezer

  • Full Mayhemer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3,920
  • Location: London
Re: father / son project
« Reply #19 on: August 20, 2012, 10:21:48 AM »

Usually the carb parts are sealed with O rings - are these all OK?
Logged

Martin [Admin]

  • Administrator
  • Full Mayhemer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 19,103
  • Location: Peterborough, UK
    • Model Boat Mayhem
Re: father / son project
« Reply #20 on: August 20, 2012, 11:12:06 AM »


Also, it will need back pressure from a tuner pipe / silencer / muffler before the engine runs properly.
Make sure you are running lots of cooling water through the water jacket when running to prevent heat build up.  :-))

There's some old info here: 
  http://www.modelboatmayhem.co.uk/Common/Glow%20engines/1C%20engines.htm
Logged
"This is my firm opinion, but what do I know?!"    -   Mayhem FaceBook Group!

mtis2000

  • Shipmate
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 8
  • Location: London UK
Re: father / son project
« Reply #21 on: August 20, 2012, 02:26:09 PM »


Also, it will need back pressure from a tuner pipe / silencer / muffler before the engine runs properly.
Make sure you are running lots of cooling water through the water jacket when running to prevent heat build up.  :-))

There's some old info here: 
  http://www.modelboatmayhem.co.uk/Common/Glow%20engines/1C%20engines.htm

I had a good read of all the technical stuff even before i register on the forum... fantastic info... as for the pressure nipple on the tuner pipe, I connected it...
for the water jacket, it will be more tricky unless gravity is good enough (one bucket on the table...)

thank you for your kind support...

 :-)
Logged

Martin [Admin]

  • Administrator
  • Full Mayhemer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 19,103
  • Location: Peterborough, UK
    • Model Boat Mayhem
Re: father / son project
« Reply #22 on: August 20, 2012, 02:55:34 PM »


for the water jacket, it will be more tricky unless gravity is good enough (one bucket on the table...)


Yes that fine. You don't even need much of a drop / flow as long as it's a steady flow.   :-))
Logged
"This is my firm opinion, but what do I know?!"    -   Mayhem FaceBook Group!

gwa84the2nd

  • Full Mayhemer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 134
  • Location: east riding of yourkshire hull
Re: father / son project
« Reply #23 on: August 20, 2012, 06:06:37 PM »

with the carb if is leeking badly you can get new carbs from the link i gave you to just engines you will have to mesure the diamiter of the carb fting wher it slides into the crank case

http://www.justengines.co.uk/acatalog/RC_Carbs.html

if you cant fined the right size fitting they are verry helpfull they took one of there jen 2 carbs and machined it dawn a mm to fit my engine for not much monny  :-))

your carb setting should start at around 2 to 3 ternes out on the main needle as for the idle i will check and get back to youbut it looks like a afftermarket carb on ther is ther enything written on the carb body
Logged

Bill D203

  • Full Mayhemer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1,974
  • not long now!!
  • Location: Sunny Stevenage
Re: father / son project
« Reply #24 on: August 20, 2012, 08:15:56 PM »

One other thing to look for basic i know but is the fuel in the tank above the carb level??? If it is this maybe why you get a leak of fuel . The way to cure this is to cut off the fuel supply when the engine is stoped.
Logged
Roll On Mayday. Im off for a pint.   How Much!!!   WHEN do you need it!     No dear!    Yes dear??   Wot Now???  soon to be EX Chairman SMBC
Pages: [1] 2   Go Up