Topic: Boiler feed pump for TVR1A (Read 14629 times)

pettyofficernick · « **on:** September 01, 2012, 09:28:38 pm »

Hi there, can anyone recommend a supplier of a boiler feed pump (engine driven) for my TVR1A. I don't particularly want to go down the servo mounted pump route.
Regards,
Nick.

derekwarner · « **Reply #1 on:** September 01, 2012, 11:14:50 pm »

This is a very vexing question Nick

Small Parts & Bearings ....& a worm & wheel to suit is approx AUD$200.00

The Kramer WEB site & a TVR1A-RTR is 790 Swiss franks
The Kramer WEB site and a KS90 pump frame to suit an ANTON Cristal engine is 495 Swiss franks

I am in the same predicament with my SAITO 9CC horizontal engine ....that RENGER free standing single cylinder steam driven water pump @ 450 EURO is looking good in comparison
The sound of the RENGER servo driven pump is a little off putting

Other members in Mayhem have shown & produced engine driven pumps...however machining facilities are needed ........Derek

pettyofficernick · « **Reply #2 on:** September 01, 2012, 11:36:12 pm »

Thanks Derek, all a bit pricey for me at the moment, moths flying out of the wallet etc. I was looking at the Hemmens website but his pump doesn't seem to be listed I have seen others on here using them. I am also thinking of adapting an axle driven pump from a 3.5" gauge loco, Found one for 28 quid, which seems like a reasonable price.
Many thanks,
Nick

ooyah/2 · « **Reply #3 on:** September 02, 2012, 12:02:36 am »

Nick,

P.m. sent.
George.

derekwarner · « **Reply #4 on:** September 02, 2012, 02:31:24 am »

So Nick says.......

"am also thinking of adapting an axle driven pump from a 3.5" gauge loco, Found one for 28 quid, which seems like a reasonable price"

We all would be interested in understanding a litte more on this Nick.....

Derek

pettyofficernick · « **Reply #5 on:** September 02, 2012, 08:35:47 am »

Good morning, I found these on Maidstone engineering's website, one is an axle driven pump and one is crosshead driven, both look like they could be adapted with a little fettling.

http://shop.maidstone-engineering.co.uk/?mod=product&cat_id=3&product_id=99

http://shop.maidstone-engineering.co.uk/?mod=product&cat_id=3&product_id=101

pettyofficernick · « **Reply #6 on:** September 02, 2012, 08:58:10 am »

Quote from: ooyah/2 on September 02, 2012, 12:02:36 am

Nick,

P.m. sent.
George.

Reply sent......

KNO3 · « **Reply #7 on:** September 23, 2012, 10:47:30 am »

Quote from: pettyofficernick on September 02, 2012, 08:35:47 am

Good morning, I found these on Maidstone engineering's website, one is an axle driven pump and one is crosshead driven, both look like they could be adapted with a little fettling.
http://shop.maidstone-engineering.co.uk/?mod=product&cat_id=3&product_id=99

http://shop.maidstone-engineering.co.uk/?mod=product&cat_id=3&product_id=101

The ram on those pumps looks huge... too large imho for a direct driven pump for a marine engine like the Graham.

Bernhard · « **Reply #8 on:** September 25, 2012, 07:31:27 am »

http://www.bengs-modellbau.de/zubehoerteile/dampfanlagenzubehoer/

http://www.bengs-modellbau.de/zubehoerteile/dampfanlagenzubehoer/speisewasserpumpemitexzenter.php

one time he have them ready made to.....

http://www.hielscher-dampfmodelle.de/cms/index.php?page=shop.browse&category_id=48&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=38

pettyofficernick · « **Reply #9 on:** October 25, 2012, 11:45:35 pm »

Hi all, I now have a feed pump, made for me by George (ooyah2) and what a cracking bit of kit it is and very nicely made. It fitted on to my bedplate with no problems at at all, so here's a few photos of the fitting process.

First off, slide the little spacer on to the crankshaft, this is to stop the eccentric fouling on the bearing housing, followed by the eccentric. Slide the sheave over the eccentric and position the pump and its support on the baseplate and mark through for drilling 7 BA clearance. I removed the engine so as not to get swarf over everything.

You will also need to cut a slot in the baseplate to clear the eccentric. Next job, I fitted the pump assembly in place with 2 x 1/2" 7BA nuts and bolts.

All that needs to be done now is to refit the engine. Job done, all turns over smoothly, and I will steam her up over the weekend to do a full test and take a short video of it in operation. George has hinted that he may be able to help should anyone want one for their TVR, a PM to George will, I am sure produce results.

steam up · « **Reply #10 on:** October 26, 2012, 05:11:35 pm »

Nice pump ,could you please indicate the bore and stroke of the water pump?

pettyofficernick · « **Reply #11 on:** October 26, 2012, 05:20:05 pm »

Hi all, the bore of the pump is 3/16 x 3/8 stroke and it shifts a fair bit of water, If you look at Jerry's thread ( Steam Launch Wear ) you will be able to see a video of one in action, I am just finishing off the plumbing on mine but I have to stop now as I am going out for large gin and tonics tonight, so I will finish up and post more photos and a video when I have recovered.
Regards,
Nick.

steam up · « **Reply #12 on:** October 26, 2012, 11:25:05 pm »

Thanks for the feedback

pettyofficernick · « **Reply #13 on:** October 27, 2012, 11:54:35 pm »

Evening all, Pump now up and running, please excuse the untidy pipe work, It will all be re done when I build it into the boat. I am most pleased with it, it is a capable little pump and empties a 500ml bottle in about 5 minutes with the bypass open, and the water is hot enough to make a brew, ( I will put that to the test ) due to the very efficient feed water heater made for me by Jerry at Clevedon Steam for a very reasonable price. It is one of his oil seperators with a coil if pipe inside.I had it all running for about an hour in all, having to open the bypass now and again to prevent overfilling the boiler, some experimentation needed there to establish the right balance between clack and bypass. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uXE0a38D1Iw&feature=youtu.be

derekwarner · « **Reply #14 on:** October 28, 2012, 12:52:52 am »

Very impressive Nick......

....will you be drawing your boiler feed water from the pond/river/lake?....[Jerry C has mentioned that he sails in clean water], or an onboard supply?
Will certainly be viewing your next posts on the progress

......Derek

pettyofficernick · « **Reply #15 on:** October 28, 2012, 09:01:12 am »

Good Morning Derek, Yes, I will be drawing water from the lake, it is clean, fresh water, taken from the water main., I will, eventually fit a gauze strainer over the water intake when the plant is mounted in the hull.

Jerry C · « **Reply #16 on:** October 28, 2012, 09:35:54 am »

Good morning Nick, looking good matey. Our plant and pumps are similar but there are also slight differences. My boiler horizontal, yours vertical. My source of feedwater heating, waste from flue yours, from de-oiler. I will be very interested to see, when operating with propeller in water, if bypass v/v needs to be open and amount of condensate. I have always wondered if my economiser coil (5 turns) in any way restricts the amount of steam I can produce. On load, on the lake, my consumption and feed are all things considered the same. Standard wisdom is that a vertical is less efficient than a horizontal boiler. Some threads have suggested that a little restriction in the flue keeps heat in longer. It doesn't rest easy with me but have no evidence to the contrary. I have also always had a niggle that my boiler should make more steam but have done nothing to verify this feeling. In short, mine gives me 35 minute runs (gas limit). The feed pump is an exact match for consumption and and the accessories all do what they should. The engine makes little mess the oil (sae 30) staying in the general area. I'm confident yours will be the same. Prepare for some serious fun!!
Jerry.

pettyofficernick · « **Reply #17 on:** October 28, 2012, 09:47:16 am »

Hi Jerry, I am already having serious fun just playing about with it! Got water everywhere last night as I had a couple of leaks to sort out. I was going to follow your idea of putting an economizer coil in the flue, but the way the chimney attaches to the boiler is different on the vertical boiler and I would have had to have the inlet and outlets actually on the chimney rather than on the boiler, so I opted for a coil in the separator. It is very efficient, I suppose it is a bit like a Windermere steam kettle. I will see if it makes a nice cuppa later. Next job now is to get it built into the hull and tidy up the pipe work, shouldn't be too long now that the weather has turned. I can then do some proper trials on the water.
Regards,
Nick.

KNO3 · « **Reply #18 on:** October 28, 2012, 10:00:03 am »

Hi, that's a very nice pump Ooyah made for you and it fits the engine nicely. However, did you specify such a large pumping volume? It looks to me like it can pump way more water than the boiler can turn into steam and the engine use, which means it could waste some power.
Interested to read you thoughts on this.

By the way, the feedwater heater in the separator is a very good idea. I was thinking to arrange for the same in a steam plant with vertical boiler I have. A flue heater would work too, but it would mean laving long pipes going up and down and also the risk of the feed water boiling if the coil gets too large.

pettyofficernick · « **Reply #19 on:** October 28, 2012, 10:07:05 am »

I think that once the engine is under a proper load, ie when it is pushing a boat around the lake steam consumption should match supply, only time will tell, it will be a month or two before it finally takes to the water. Jerry has had good results with his pump, which is the same as mine, Have you looked at his thread entitled 'Steam Launch Wear?
Regards,
Nick.

Jerry C · « **Reply #20 on:** October 28, 2012, 10:11:00 am »

KNO3, hi. Now there's a thought, a conventional boiler/flash steam combo. Interesting!?
Jerry.

ooyah/2 · « **Reply #21 on:** October 28, 2012, 10:36:18 am »

Nick,
The reason that your are pumping such a volume of water is as Jerry has said when in the water and under load the revs are reduced and his pump which is identical to yours keeps pace with his TVR engine and boiler, when you eventually get it into the water the by pass valve will help you to adjust the volume if required.
On the bench tests with the engine running free the revs are much higher so more water.

George.

KNO3 · « **Reply #22 on:** October 28, 2012, 12:40:49 pm »

I'm curious about how it will perform in a boat. The reason I asked if the pump isn't too big is because on those steam engines I saw, which were factory fitted with a pump, it was usually of much smaller diameter.

ooyah/2 · « **Reply #23 on:** October 28, 2012, 04:59:00 pm »

There is no doubt that this pump works in a boat, see Jerry C's thread on S.L.WEIR. and has no adverse effect on the performance of the TVR engine as you can see on his video.

I can't comment on other engines as you don't state who the maker is or the bore and stroke of the pumps fitted.

If this pump had a smaller bore and stroke it wouldn't keep up with the boilers need on Jerry's boat and I would rather have a pump that pumped more than required and use the bypass to adjust.

George.

pettyofficernick · « **Reply #24 on:** November 13, 2012, 09:52:05 pm »

Here's a couple of photos of the two variations of the pump that George makes.

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Author Topic: Boiler feed pump for TVR1A (Read 14629 times)