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Author Topic: Irishcarguy's Constant Velocity Joint  (Read 4827 times)

Norseman

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Irishcarguy's Constant Velocity Joint
« on: January 16, 2013, 01:54:19 am »

Now I love 'a man who can' and Mick (Irishcarguy) is certainly one of those who can 'engineer'. Having been less that satisfied with what he had found on offer he went away and arrived at a solution (not that he has yet finished with all possible improvements yet). Once out of hospital I am sure he will reply and explain all, but basically he has taken a constant velocity joint from model car racing and adapted it to usage in a boat. You need to machine the correct shaft diameter and thread when converting but you'd expect that. Mick very kindly made me one for a Tosher I have in mind. I couldn't stop twiddling with it - nice weighty thing compared to the Hucos I have used. I should have posted pix by now but have been extremely busy visiting hospital this week. I have taken a couple on the iPhone and Pettyofficernick has kindly agreed to post the pictures.

Dave
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pettyofficernick

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Re: Irishcarguy's Constant Velocity Joint
« Reply #1 on: January 16, 2013, 02:19:17 am »

And here they are....
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oldiron

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Re: Irishcarguy's Constant Velocity Joint
« Reply #2 on: January 16, 2013, 04:13:00 am »

An interesting set up. Maybe Mick can give us a bit of a "how to" talk.

John
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essex2visuvesi

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Re: Irishcarguy's Constant Velocity Joint
« Reply #3 on: January 16, 2013, 04:35:26 am »

Brilliant idea, have loads of RC car bits lying around
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RAAArtyGunner

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Re: Irishcarguy's Constant Velocity Joint
« Reply #4 on: January 16, 2013, 05:26:14 am »

You need to machine the correct shaft diameter and thread when converting but you'd expect that.
 
Dave

Which means what? Hazard a guess that there are a lot out there like me, that can't 'machine'.
 
Don't these cars come in different scales/sizes and therefore would not the Joints be also different sizes etc.
 
If so, could not the 'right' size be obtained for your boat without machining.
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essex2visuvesi

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Re: Irishcarguy's Constant Velocity Joint
« Reply #5 on: January 16, 2013, 06:20:23 am »

Quite possibly, but I don't think those particular measurements would be easy to come by.


I do have some of these in my bits box

http://www.yeahracing.com/catalog/df03ra015bk-universal-steel-swing-shaft-tamiya-df03ra-ta04-series-p-2338.html


cost about 15 shipped for the pair.  Thes can take some serious abuse Im running 4 of these in My Tamiya DF03Ra Lancia upgraded with 4000kv brushless motor and a 3S lipo and after 6 months hard use there is hardly any wear in the joints at all


I can take relevant measurements if anyone needs them
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RAAArtyGunner

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Re: Irishcarguy's Constant Velocity Joint
« Reply #6 on: January 16, 2013, 07:34:59 am »

 Are they relatively heavy.
If so, would they be putting increased loading onto the motor/bearings.
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essex2visuvesi

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Re: Irishcarguy's Constant Velocity Joint
« Reply #7 on: January 16, 2013, 07:39:38 am »

the ones I have are not that heavy... even less when modeified to suit this application, no worse weightwise than a regular "Huco" type coupling
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Neil

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Re: Irishcarguy's Constant Velocity Joint
« Reply #8 on: January 16, 2013, 07:50:34 am »

at the moment Mick is recovering from a stroke, so please bear with him for any explanation, and we wish him well with a total recovery.
 
neil.
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Norseman

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Re: Irishcarguy's Constant Velocity Joint
« Reply #9 on: January 16, 2013, 11:29:59 am »


Which means what? Hazard a guess that there are a lot out there like me, that can't 'machine'.
 
Don't these cars come in different scales/sizes and therefore would not the Joints be also different sizes etc.
 
If so, could not the 'right' size be obtained for your boat without machining.

Well Mick will answer your questions when he is out of hospital. As to the first one .... I don't machine but I have a friend who can. Maybe they might be a commercial prospect - who knows?

Dave
Thanks for posting the pix Nick
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Circlip

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Re: Irishcarguy's Constant Velocity Joint
« Reply #10 on: January 16, 2013, 12:37:30 pm »

Can't see into the "Mick" joints but the others are U/J's not CV/J's. The U/J's are basically what we were using in the 50/60's when RipMax were in their prime.
  Regards  Ian.
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essex2visuvesi

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Re: Irishcarguy's Constant Velocity Joint
« Reply #11 on: January 16, 2013, 01:01:51 pm »

Can't see into the "Mick" joints but the others are U/J's not CV/J's. The U/J's are basically what we were using in the 50/60's when RipMax were in their prime.
  Regards  Ian.


Still would think they would be better than the Huco type joints as these are designed to take some quite serious abuse


Im going to chop one up and fit it in my huntsman as a test..... sadly there the ice on the lake is over a foot thick at the moment so no testing till the spring
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Norseman

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Re: Irishcarguy's Constant Velocity Joint
« Reply #12 on: January 16, 2013, 05:46:15 pm »

Mick definitely said CV to me. I wouldn't know the UJ difference?
The action on rotation is very smooth and it feels right too.

Dave

Edit .... I could undo it?
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irishcarguy

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Re: Irishcarguy's Constant Velocity Joint
« Reply #13 on: March 03, 2013, 12:37:05 am »

Well I am glad to see the discussion ongoing. I am back on my feet but pretty weak at present. I don't have full use of the fingers of my left hand & I am a strong lefty, never mind what 19 days lying on your back does to your body, when you get out of bed you forget you have legs.Now about the joint that Dave has so kindly put up pictures of. It is a true C/V joint as it has 360 degree movement in any direction which a U/Joint does not. A single Huco will only act in one plane hence the need for to double the joint. If you don't & the Huco has the Slightest Misalignment it will have a tight spot in EVERY single rotation & I doubt that the vast majority of us get our motor/shaft alignments 100%.This has been an ongoing discussion for a long time. I am fairly new to boats but have over 50 years in the auto industry & 2 years of engineering school. One has only to look at the propshaft on any rear wheel drive car to see that they use TWO U/joints in the shaft & they also have to be aligned or what some call phased or they will bind at some point. I see many beautiful models on the forum using a single Huco & I will tell you now that if it is not a 100% in alignment it will be binding at some point of its rotation.This will cause power loss & vibration & the only way to cure it is a double joint. We do have the Dumas dog bone joint of course & the plastic sleeve units as well. As you will see from the tests done by John (oldiron) the Dumas was the best one of the ones he tested.The joint that I found in my search is made by a US company,HPI Racing in California. I tried to talk to their R&D department about having copies of the one I modified made but no joy they would not even put my call through,too busy they said. I have a lathe so I used that to do the mods. One end has to be drilled to fit the motor shaft.The long shaft that goes to the wheel I cut off at about 1 inch & threaded it 4MM. I then made a sleeve out of brass & threaded it internally 4Mm as well. the sleeve will now attach to a 4MM drive/propshaft. If your propshaft is 3 or 5 MM  you will have to thread one end of the brass sleeve to match the propshaft. This is well within the skills of most of the guys on this forum, but if you want one made I will do one for you at cost including the joint & sleeve which is about $25. As for the question of weight it weighs 23/25 grams depending on the length of the sleeve. It is also very strong & better yet you can buy a repair kit for it as well for just $8. All I  can say in conclusion you will not find any other joint on my boats unless the one of my own design proves better & which is still being developed (3rd prototype at present)As you know I had a slight delay. One of the factors that pushed me into buying a milling machine was in the quest for a better joint & I could not make it accurate enough free hand. If you have questions or want more information PM me, I may be slow in answering but I will try to answer all.Mick B.       
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Mick B.

irishcarguy

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Re: Irishcarguy's Constant Velocity Joint
« Reply #14 on: March 03, 2013, 12:53:56 am »

Sorry Guys & Girls I should have also said that I cut off the threaded end of the hub to which the wheel is attached & put two grub screws to lock the joint to the motor shaft(3MM High Quality tap & proper size drill for the tap). Again it is not hard to convert, just a little patience & good tools. It Must be a very good Die to thread the axle shaft as it is high quality steel. Mick B.
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Mick B.

irishcarguy

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Re: Irishcarguy's Constant Velocity Joint
« Reply #15 on: March 03, 2013, 01:06:56 am »

There was a question raised about sizes, my answer would be that the joint I got would meet most if not all applications, the part that needs to be changed is the sleeve depending on the  the propshaft size. The sleeve can be increased in diameter to fit any propshaft & there is ample metal in the joint to take 6MM motor shaft. That would be the largest motor shaft I would recommend. It all sounds a bit complicated but believe me it is actually very easy to do if I can do it.Mick B.
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Mick B.

irishcarguy

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Re: Irishcarguy's Constant Velocity Joint
« Reply #16 on: March 03, 2013, 01:13:38 am »

I should thank Dave(Norseman) my good friend,& also Pettyofficernick for the help on getting the photos on the forum, pretty good guys I would say, Mick B.
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Mick B.

Norseman

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Re: Irishcarguy's Constant Velocity Joint
« Reply #17 on: March 03, 2013, 06:34:48 pm »

One of the factors that pushed me into buying a milling machine was in the quest for a better joint   

Shouldn't you have bought a rolling machine  {-)
I'm off ........  :police:

Dave
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irishcarguy

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Re: Irishcarguy's Constant Velocity Joint
« Reply #18 on: March 03, 2013, 06:46:36 pm »

Smart-A--S You are not sharing any of mine, so there. Mick B.
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Mick B.

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Re: Irishcarguy's Constant Velocity Joint
« Reply #19 on: March 03, 2013, 07:35:38 pm »

 :-)) Dave.......... {-) {-) {-)
    Glad your back Mick O0 O0
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