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Author Topic: Touchwood 1/12 scale Bluebird K7  (Read 35878 times)

Biscuit

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Touchwood 1/12 scale Bluebird K7
« on: May 28, 2007, 06:43:18 PM »

Hi,
Just came back from coniston with a model of Campells Bluebird K7, it is a static kit but can be converted to R/C, there or notes in the box to do this dated 1999, with a hot 540 and gear box on 7 cells. Would like to go brushless, Astec have given me a prop size and motor size, Mega 22/20/3 and 34.5.36mm prop on 12 cells, now this seems a bit heavy as the original was only on 7 cells. Does anyone have anymore info on this model? or links to the conversion? as you can see the hull needs a lot of work and the scale parts are made out of resin which is very heavy, will lighten or make new parts including the planning wedges that will be made out of alloy as were the real things. Any help or info will be most welcome.
Thanks
Steve.
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johno 52-11

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Re: Touchwood 1/12 scale Bluebird K7
« Reply #1 on: May 28, 2007, 07:19:50 PM »

If you need to increase the number of sells in the battery pack but keep the weight down Model Power do a 2200mah 2/3 cell thatís 2/3 the weight of a standard cell so a 12 cell pack would only be a little heavier that a 7 cell pack. I have used them in my model of an Atlantic 21 to reduce the weight. This has given better performance but reduced the running time to 20 mins. But they will recharge in 45 mins. Hop this helps.

John
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Biscuit

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Re: Touchwood 1/12 scale Bluebird K7
« Reply #2 on: May 28, 2007, 07:36:53 PM »

Thanks but going to need lots of power to get this up on the plane, might go for a 4sp Lipo pack, or might get away with a 3 cell, only thing is the price of a 4sp lipo pack is about £100, :( I know I use them in my helicopters.
Steve.
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Bridkid

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Re: Touchwood 1/12 scale Bluebird K7
« Reply #3 on: May 28, 2007, 10:32:34 PM »

Steve.

The man you need to talk to is Ernie Lazenby who knows everything there is to know about Bluebird, both model and real! If you post a question on the ASTEC forum I'm sure he will 'bite'. (He is a friend of Gina Campbell, Donald Campbell's daughter) and is extremely knowledgeable when it comes to cell counts, motors etc. You will find him on here.
http://astecmodels.co.uk/phpBB2/viewforum.php?f=9&sid=dfca3b74b973e242a006f1c50979c9c4

Cheers,

Ian.
 8)
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Biscuit

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Re: Touchwood 1/12 scale Bluebird K7
« Reply #4 on: May 29, 2007, 12:16:09 AM »

Thanks Ian,
I have done that, but got no reply as of yet, I think he did the original write up in one of the mags, it seems he is the only one who has done this conversion. He has now built a real turbine K7, just hope he replies to my post, sent him a PM on the Rum Rider forum, Alan at Astec only gave me the motor size and prop, would really like a bit more info as the instructions for the boat are very poor, need more photos, really want to make a good job of this so don't want to just dive in, if you know what I mean. Thanks for the reply.
Steve.
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HS93 (RIP)

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Re: Touchwood 1/12 scale Bluebird K7
« Reply #5 on: May 29, 2007, 12:20:08 AM »

 Biscuit
    In your 3rd picture , is that a join line or repair, I like the look of the boat and the size is right for a nice project, Peter
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Biscuit

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Re: Touchwood 1/12 scale Bluebird K7
« Reply #6 on: May 29, 2007, 09:43:28 AM »

No Thats how it came, it seems like the front half is a separate moulding put on after the rear is joined, this is in 2 half's as well, going to have to put a lot of formers in the rear part of the hull to try and get it flat before I start filling. The hull is going to take a long time to get flat and true. You can see in the pic how far out the hull is, look at the daylight under the rule. Cant just fill this it will way a ton.
Steve
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HS93 (RIP)

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Re: Touchwood 1/12 scale Bluebird K7
« Reply #7 on: May 29, 2007, 09:58:43 AM »

Thats a bit of a shame , what is the inside like ,how are they joined ,did they use tape to join it together. The reason I ask this is that it may be an idea to separate and spend a bit of time re joining to your satisfaction, you may be able to just make a cut at the rear bulkhead so you can get rid of the bowing of the underside,  its a shame it looks nice but just badly joined.

Peter
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Biscuit

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Re: Touchwood 1/12 scale Bluebird K7
« Reply #8 on: May 29, 2007, 10:35:31 AM »

Peter,
They are glassed together from the inside so you cannot see the join, its thin so like I said might be able to put some formers in the hull ,put it on a flat surface and glue them in and hope this keeps the bottom flat. Still not getting any where with my search for someone else who has done this conversion, no reply from Ernie, he is my last hope before going it alone. Not too happy with the quality of this kit as it cost £160, but I suppose its a starting point.
Steve.
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Re: Touchwood 1/12 scale Bluebird K7
« Reply #9 on: May 29, 2007, 10:55:23 AM »

You will have to watch for the bottom ripling with bulkheads you could do with some sort of keel on the inside so it does not go concave in between the bulkheads, at least its nice and light ,just out of interest was the bottom ment to be hollow ,did they suggest you use a gearbox with the Mega 22/20/3    anyway I hope you sort it out it will make a nice project ? Peter
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Biscuit

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Re: Touchwood 1/12 scale Bluebird K7
« Reply #10 on: May 29, 2007, 02:24:04 PM »

No, The instructions don't really tell you anything, so not sure if its supposed to be like that, would of thought it needs to be flat. As to the motor, I don't know if it needs a gearbox, asked Allan at Astec what motor to use and thats what he reccomended, no mention of a gearbox. Got some weight's in the hull at the moment, I know its a long shot but it might help to flatten it out a bit.
Steve.
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OneBladeMissing

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Re: Touchwood 1/12 scale Bluebird K7
« Reply #11 on: May 29, 2007, 07:09:53 PM »

That GRP moulding looks poor. Did you look at it before you bought it. Given the amount of work required I'd have asked for a discount.
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Tug-Kenny

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Re: Touchwood 1/12 scale Bluebird K7
« Reply #12 on: May 29, 2007, 08:56:07 PM »


Have you tried filling the hull with Hot water and standing it on a flat base ?  ( maybe start with warm first)

Just a thought.

Ken
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Biscuit

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Re: Touchwood 1/12 scale Bluebird K7
« Reply #13 on: May 29, 2007, 09:16:03 PM »

Yeah I know the moulding is poor, but my son bought it from a shop in Coniston, said he looked at it and thought it was great ! (kids eh!) so got to sort it out, thing is, every one thinks this a really nice boat but they only see the finished Item, not the box of bits, that one on the box lid must have taken months of work and tons of filler to look like that. As for the hot water has anyone tried this before on any other type of fiber glass model ? must admit was thinking of using a hair dryer. Would it harm the boats performance if it was left concave, as it only rides on the front sponsons and the prop?
Anyway, thanks for the replies, any other Ideas?
Steve.
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riggers24

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Re: Touchwood 1/12 scale Bluebird K7
« Reply #14 on: May 29, 2007, 10:45:15 PM »

Before you start pour water in to the hull, PM either bluebird or Kayem. They have both been around since fibre glass was invented ;D
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Re: Touchwood 1/12 scale Bluebird K7
« Reply #15 on: May 29, 2007, 10:55:29 PM »

Riggers, Chinese proverb say:  stoop if roof is low  ;D

serious side: we can go through the pros and cons of why this hull looks so heavily built and it is distorted through the flat area of the hull.  It has obviously been lifted out of the mold when it is still 'green' the molding has not cured sufficiently and shrinkage has taken place rapidly.

Cure:          Its a difficult one with it being a flat area;   one method you could try, but its not guaranteed to work:  Two pieces of solid timber, perfectly flat - one to fit inside the hull, one to fit on the outside of the hull - same shape and size as the distorted area. Two, three or even four very large G-clamps enabling you to clamp the two piece of wood together, thus sandwiching the bottom half of the hull in between the two pieces of wood.

Method:     Either boiling water, poured into the side of the hull and keep the boiling water in the hull until the bottom of the hull becomes flexible; immediately empty the boiling water out of the hull.  Place the inner piece of support timber on the inside of the hull, the outer piece of support timber on the outside of the hull.  Clamp with as many G-clamps as possible.   This MAY work, but, I suspect when the hull has cooled down, it may return to its original shape.  Its worth a try though.

Over to Kayem......

Aye
John E
BLUEBIRD
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kayem

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Re: Touchwood 1/12 scale Bluebird K7
« Reply #16 on: May 30, 2007, 10:44:17 AM »

Did I hear someone calling my name....?

First thing to say is that these are some way from being the best fibreglass mouldings I've ever seen, but you've all worked that out for yourself, and I can see that it was made from poor quality glass mat, which makes me wonder about a few other things. Before doing anything though, does anyone know what shape the bottom of the boat is supposed to be, maybe it's meant to be concave like that? Assuming that it should be flat though, I'd say that any distortion is in the original mould, it wouldn't have occurred just from the moulding being pulled from the mould too soon while it was still a bit soft, though that wouldn't have helped. Can the hull be flexed into shape with just moderate pressure from your fingers, or is it too robust for that? If it can be flexed, it should be possible to straighten it, but heat alone isn't going to work. The way I'd do it is to cut a piece of 1.5 or even better 3mm ply to fit inside, chamfering all the edges carefully so it fits really well. Then, after sanding, dusting and cleaning the inside of the hull, cut a piece of glass mat to the same shape, and wet it out with resin inside the hull, I'd stick with polyester, though epoxy would also be OK. Then I'd support the outer edges of the hull with strips of 1.5mm ply, enough to force some slight convexity into the thing, you can always sand it flat later, and placing a pre-prepared length of straight and fairly hard wood on top of the ply, clamp the whole thing firmly to the edge of your workbench overnight. As an alternative, you could screw through a thinner length of wood inside the hull into something flat and solid on the outside, filling all the screwholes later, I've used this method to correct hogged hulls successfully in the past. If the hull moulding is too hefty to flex though, if you want it flat, you're going to have to fill in the concavity. The way I'd do it is to sand and clean the outside of the hull, and then epoxy a sheet of something like obechi the full length & width of the hull. Once again, clamp well overnight, and then plane and sand everything flat. Before doing this, I'd epoxy a few cross beams inside the hull to hold the shape.

Let us know how you get on. 
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Biscuit

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Re: Touchwood 1/12 scale Bluebird K7
« Reply #17 on: May 30, 2007, 04:09:26 PM »

Thanks Men,
Done the hot water thing, as you can see its a lot better now, put the hull on a flat surface, (old mirror) then put a heavy lump of steel inside then added the boiling water. This was left for a few hours but the problem was, yeah you guessed it, the hull leaked so was getting in a right state in the kitchen water every where. I have made some formers to go inside the hull, it only needs slight pressure on these to make the hull fairly flat so with a thin coat of P 38 should be able to get it flat. Ah, then I reinstated the panel lines an rivits around the cockpit area that were covered in filler, quite pleased with this as you can see the before and after photo. Still loads to do on the hull, plus might have to move the formers about later as not sure what power set up I am using yet but least they will enable me to get the hull flat, think with a bit of P 38 here and there it will come out ok, its looking better already, thanks for your help, will keep you posted.
Steve.
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Tug-Kenny

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Re: Touchwood 1/12 scale Bluebird K7
« Reply #18 on: May 30, 2007, 04:39:51 PM »



Looking better .............. ;D


ken
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Martin [Admin]

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Re: Touchwood 1/12 scale Bluebird K7
« Reply #19 on: May 30, 2007, 05:11:54 PM »

Re: Photo with towel......Can I have a biscuit please Biscuit?  ;D

BTW. As you are thinking of going brushless motor, do you have any experience with brushless?
.... not many people have, especially in boats.

Martin.
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splodger

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Re: Touchwood 1/12 scale Bluebird K7
« Reply #20 on: May 30, 2007, 06:01:24 PM »

Wouldn't want to pour cold water on your hot water treatment, but I tried that once with a distorted fibreglass hull. It worked a treat, but 24 hours later it was worse than before. Assuming they aren't going to get in the way, maybe if you fitted enough bulkheads straight away, it might hold something close to the correct shape, but kayem is right, to get rid of the concavity, I think you'll have to make it convex before you add any bulkheads, then you might end up with a flat bottom, that hull may have been distorted for years, it isn't going to give up the fight too easily.
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Biscuit

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Re: Touchwood 1/12 scale Bluebird K7
« Reply #21 on: May 30, 2007, 06:22:57 PM »

Re: Photo with towel......Can I have a biscuit please Biscuit?  ;D

BTW. As you are thinking of going brushless motor, do you have any experience with brushless?
.... not many people have, especially in boats.


Hi Martin, Been using brushless motors for about 4 years now in my Helicopters and planes, will never go back to a brushed motor again, even got them in some of my model cars now. Also I was in at the start of the Lithium cells, another giant leap forward. My ECO 8 electric helicopter on a 4Sp pack will out perform my Raptor 30 which has an Irvine 39 in it. So yes got a bit of experience thought its time to stick one in a boat, think the Bluebird deserves it dont you ?  :)
Martin.
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Biscuit

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Re: Touchwood 1/12 scale Bluebird K7
« Reply #22 on: May 31, 2007, 03:03:43 PM »

Did a bit more on the boat last night, cut out the cockpit and made the seat frame, took a load more material out of the back of the seat to lighten it, plus spent hours getting the rear engine cover to fit the hull. Going my own way on the rear cockpit bulk head, will fit cockpit runners then canopy and make baulkhead to fit this at the rear. Slapped on a bit of filler here and there and its not looking to bad, started to look good when I cut out the air intakes and did not need as much filler as I thought, going to have a go at the cockpit canopy tonight and the bit I am mostly looking forward to, the jet pipe.
Steve.
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Martin [Admin]

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Re: Touchwood 1/12 scale Bluebird K7
« Reply #23 on: May 31, 2007, 03:34:52 PM »



Found this on the web - http://www.touchwoodmodels.com/ - seems they are still around.
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Biscuit

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Re: Touchwood 1/12 scale Bluebird K7
« Reply #24 on: May 31, 2007, 06:48:30 PM »

Yeah , They are very helpfull, been in contact a few times now, Stuart Delf has been replying to my e-mails, and steering me in the right direction, and do you need it on this kit !! :)
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