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Author Topic: 34" Crash Tender  (Read 13162 times)

Steven.T

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34" Crash Tender
« on: December 08, 2013, 04:28:47 pm »

Hi Guys,
Bought this of ebay the other week, thought I'd put some pictures on.
I believe it's an Aerokits model, single prop with a Johnson 600 motor powering it. Currently has a 6v Sealed Lead Acid battery although I'm looking to change this, going to try it on 7.2v then maybe 12v depending on performance. On 6v it went a decent pace, but just not quite enough  :-))
[size=78%]It currently is on 27mhz but I intend to buy another reciever for my Planet T5 and make it 2.4ghz.The speed controller is a M'troniks marine 15.[/size]



































The mast at the back won't be staying, I intend on removing it and making a new one for the front as per the prototype.
I think I'm going to try and get hold of some decent looking monitors to go on it, theres only one fitted at the moment. And I don't think the little boat and crane will be staying, although I intend on making new cabin tops for the monitors, so I can have both if I wish!
Not too sure about the planked deck, as nice as it looks, I just don't know if it looks right, same goes for the spray rail.
The search light on the front looks like a Robbe one, it works, but isn't wired up, so I intend to do that aswell!
And need to source some decals for it, just to finish it off!


Any more ideas for improvements?
Cheers,
Steven
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Steven.T

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Re: 34" Crash Tender
« Reply #1 on: December 15, 2013, 04:40:53 pm »

Had the boat running today, water was a little choppy with the wind, but it ran well.
Tried it on my 7.2v battery and she goes a fair speed, although I don't think weather conditions were particularity helping!
For some reason the rudder seems to be working in reverse, so right to go left, left to go right etc which got a bit confusing, think I can sort this on the transmitter switches though.
Anyway, I think I have decided to re-do the paint, and paint the spray rail aswell, it stands out too much on the water ( functionally it works great!). Still unsure what to do with the planked deck though...


Quick video, I apologise for the wind noise!:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XfC0WEkGpC0


And some Pics:


















Cheers!
Steven

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pompebled

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Re: 34" Crash Tender prop.
« Reply #2 on: December 15, 2013, 09:26:08 pm »

Hi Steven,

If you like the way the boat runs and the prop was in the state shown in the picture, fix the bent blade and you'll find the boat runs even better.

Regards, Jan.
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Steven.T

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Re: 34" Crash Tender
« Reply #3 on: December 15, 2013, 10:01:41 pm »

Hah! Well noticed Jan! I thought it was just the way it was, didn't even think to compare the two!
Will duly correct and see how it runs next time!
Thanks!
Steven
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Steven.T

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Re: 34" Crash Tender
« Reply #4 on: January 19, 2014, 09:41:58 pm »

Well after having a disaster with the old prop (one blade snapped clean off!) I had to get a new prop. Whilst I was there I thought, well, I might aswell get a better motor...
Now going on the fact that Vintage model boats who now make a similar kit recommend a brushless motor and ESC, I found the same ones on HobbyKing for a lot cheaper, and well, it almost flies on 7.2v! The motor is a 1250kv outrunner.














And a quick video:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=52XNI3YB--I&edit=vd


Cheers,
Steven
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peter61_uk

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Re: 34" Crash Tender
« Reply #5 on: January 19, 2014, 10:53:32 pm »

Well after having a disaster with the old prop (one blade snapped clean off!) I had to get a new prop. Whilst I was there I thought, well, I might aswell get a better motor...
Now going on the fact that Vintage model boats who now make a similar kit recommend a brushless motor and ESC, I found the same ones on HobbyKing for a lot cheaper, and well, it almost flies on 7.2v! The motor is a 1250kv outrunner.














And a quick video:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=52XNI3YB--I&edit=vd


Cheers,
Steven

Good result there Steven.  :-))

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Cheers
Peter

pompebled

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Re: 34" Crash Tender
« Reply #6 on: January 20, 2014, 04:50:46 pm »

Well after having a disaster with the old prop (one blade snapped clean off!)
Hi Steven,

I feel a bit guilty this happened..., I should have warned you the blades were soldered on and using pliers isn't the way to go, as you've noticed.

Using a hammer on a small anvil (or another hammer in the vice) is the way to go to 'unfold' a bent blade

Do you have a link to the motor and prop in question?
If you ran full throttle in the video, the hull is capable of more (don't know if the captain is comfortable with running beyond scale speed though...).

Regards, Jan.
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Steven.T

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Re: 34" Crash Tender
« Reply #7 on: January 20, 2014, 05:36:15 pm »

Hello Jan,
I managed to straighten out the prop as you advised. It wasn't until the coupling became damaged I had to remove the propshaft, and whilst putting it back in with a new coupler, the blade snapped!


The motor I have got is this: http://hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewitem.asp?idproduct=29574


As for the Prop, I just used one the local model shop advised, I think it is this one: http://www.alwayshobbies.com/model-boats/running-gear/propellers/speed-propeller-35mm-2-blade-m4-threaded


I was running full throttle on the video, however the motor was only running off a 7.2v battery. The speed controller can take up to 13v (If I remember correctly!). A friend of mine has a 11v Lipo or whatever the nearest equivalent in LiPo terms is, so think I am going to try that next time!
Scale speed doesn't really bother me, I think it would be nice to have that little bit more speed available when I want it!
Thanks,
Steven
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Dicky-P

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Re: 34" Crash Tender
« Reply #8 on: January 20, 2014, 07:08:13 pm »

Glad to see you have removed the crane and lifeboat, looks much better.  Are you fixing the fire jets and other accessories which can be bought from model slipway
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Steven.T

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Re: 34" Crash Tender
« Reply #9 on: January 20, 2014, 07:14:18 pm »

Ordered the new fittings earlier today from model slipway  :-))
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pompebled

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Re: 34" Crash Tender
« Reply #10 on: January 20, 2014, 08:26:14 pm »

Hi Steven,

With the motor running on 3S Lipo (11,1V) you're in for a treat, as 12.000 rpm under load is something entirely different from the sedate 8000 rpm on 6 cells NiMH (which also have a hard time delivering the current, making you go even slower).
Make sure the NiMH are warm from the charger when drawing considerable current, as NiMH tend to get damaged when drained heavily cold.
When you apply full throttle, make sure the rudder is straight and throttle down in turns to start with, it's too cold to swim...

The prop in the picture looks ugly, with all the flash on the outside edges, I hope yours looks a bit more civilized, with clean edges and a sharp trailing edge.

Trimming off the flash is best done with a thin blade (razor), as the plastic only gets mores scruffy when using sandpaper or a file.

I assume you've seen what 4S does to an 800KV outrunner in my MAS:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-igDcvLySEM&feature=youtu.be
Granted, the prop is bigger...

Regards, Jan.
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Steven.T

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Re: 34" Crash Tender
« Reply #11 on: January 20, 2014, 10:26:14 pm »

Cheers Jan.
Yes, I think it coud be fun on the 3s Lipo!
Actually, I was suprised at how long the NiMH battery lasted, it ran for a good 45 minutes, and that was at full pelt 95% of the time!


I will have to look at the Prop, see if it looks in good nick.


If anyone was wondering what the black thing is on the front of the boat, I bought one of those Keyfob spy camera things of Amazon. It seems quite good, and provided around 7 minutes of footage before the battery went flat in it!
Seeing as though I can't be bothered to edit the video files, if anyone is bored heres the full 7 minutes, a few close encounters with my Brothers toyish speed boat, oh, and the time stamp is wrong!  :-)) :
For some reason the video hasn't uploaded properly and seems to be juddering, I'll upload it again tomorrow and hope it comes out better!


Cheers,
Steven

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pompebled

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Re: 34" Crash Tender
« Reply #12 on: January 20, 2014, 10:41:33 pm »

Hi Steven,

It's really nice how little current the brushless outrunners draw if you don't go overboard on the propsize isn't it?

I'm able to run my MAS with 9600mAh Lipo on board for more than two hours continuously in mixed running.

I have never depleted the batteries yet, I'm going to do some runs with a friend's telemetry set on board when the weather gets a bit warmer, I'll be able to tell you how long I can run full throttle then.

Opening the video nearly gave me a fit, as the volume was set for 'normal youtube watching', the pink noise at full blast was scary...

Regards, Jan.
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Steven.T

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Re: 34" Crash Tender
« Reply #13 on: January 20, 2014, 10:49:22 pm »

Hi Jan, the video hasn't uploaded correctly for some reason. The original when I view it straight off the SD card is as smooth as a whistle, and the sound, well, I think I will take the video off because its gone terrible!
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Steven.T

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Re: 34" Crash Tender
« Reply #14 on: January 21, 2014, 07:16:39 pm »

Right, After editing the video so it's only 4 mins long, It's now uploaded OK to Youtube, so it shouldn't blow your ears out now!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v4llYAMB4Pk&feature=youtu.be




The other boat is my Brothers "toy" speed boat, only cost 10 from Netto years ago. It goes a decent speed, but the battery doesn't last long... especially after racing each other as you can see about half way through the video, I need a little more speed I think!
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Steven.T

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Re: 34" Crash Tender
« Reply #15 on: February 09, 2014, 10:18:54 pm »

Had the boat running on my friends 3S lipo today, by heck it shifted! Once it got up to speed it was apparent there was some torque roll, not sure how to counteract this without going twin prop counter rotating, which I'm not intending on doing!


So, I've now decided I would like to run it off a 12v (or somewhere near that) battery. I'm unsure whether to stick with the NiMH's that I'm used to, or to change over to LiPO. I have the chargers and everything for NiMHs, but have never owned LiPO, so really I would like to stick with what I know, but theres a little voice in my head saying change to LiPO. I'm a bit unsure over how safe LiPO's are.


Anyone got any preferences on what's best?
Cheers,
Steven
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pompebled

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Re: 34" Crash Tender
« Reply #16 on: February 10, 2014, 05:12:10 pm »

Hi Steven,

Running on 3S gives you more than 12.000 rpm under load, that's 1,5 times more than on 7,2V NiMH...
Add to that the more lineair output of the Lipo's and away you go.

To reduce the torque roll you'll have to change the prop to a smaller three blade, or compensate by shifting the weight in the boat to the opposite side, which looks daft when the boat doesn't run, or only moves slowly.

If you watch the video of my MAS, you'll see it also lists under prop torque when full throttle is applied, using a lot of rudderthrow when running this fast is not adviceable, as you may cause a spin that even can result in tiping the boat over...

I'm using Lipo's in all my boats (and transmitters) nowadays, treat them right (as you should every battery chemistry) and they are safe to use.

Regards, Jan.
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Steven.T

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Re: 34" Crash Tender
« Reply #17 on: February 11, 2014, 08:56:55 pm »

Cheers Jan,
I'm still not totally convinced about these LiPo's. I have come across these LiFePo4 batteries a few times now, which are apparently safer and there are some 3s ones, which is 9.9v rather than the 11v of lipos at 3s. I was wondering, the 9.9v (so basically 10v for arguments sake) is only 1v short of a 3s Lipo, Is this going to make it noticeably slower? If anything, it might be enough so that the torque roll isn't as apparent?


Heres the battery I am looking at for reference...
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__37391__ZIPPY_Flightmax_4200mAh_3S1P_30C_LiFePo4_Pack_UK_Warehouse_.html


It's also lighter than my 7v NiMh, which is never a bad thing!


Cheers,
Steven
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pompebled

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Re: 34" Crash Tender
« Reply #18 on: February 12, 2014, 05:41:21 pm »

Hi Steven,

LiFePo are even more resistant to abuse than Lipo's.

A fully charged LiFePo has 3,7V, so a 3S equals 11,1V where as a Lipo is 4,2V fully charged, 3S is 12,6V.
I doubt you'll notice the difference other than in a direct comparison.

I'm using Lipo's only because I have a number of them for use in my competition boats, using the ones that don't cut it in competition anymore (after one or two seasons), they still work very good in my scale applications.

Regards, Jan.
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Steven.T

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Re: 34" Crash Tender
« Reply #19 on: February 12, 2014, 08:45:15 pm »

Great, Cheers Jan, I think I'm going to give the LifePo4 a shot, at least I can ease my mind about the safety!
Cheers,
Steven
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Steven.T

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Re: 34" Crash Tender
« Reply #20 on: February 13, 2014, 09:14:56 pm »

Here's a quick (literally!) video if it running on the 3s Lipo on Sunday...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g4C9rKfPKLo&feature=youtu.be




Cheers,
Steven
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pompebled

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Re: 34" Crash Tender
« Reply #21 on: February 14, 2014, 05:22:14 pm »

Hi Steven,

Nice, that's more like it!
Slightly over scale speed, but not ridiculously fast.
I like the running attitude with the nose slightly out of the water.

I bet if you record it in HD (or double speed) and play it back slower, it'll look like the real thing.

Have you seen the video of my MAS?
That's 'slightly' over scale speed...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-igDcvLySEM

Regards, Jan.
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Steven.T

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Re: 34" Crash Tender
« Reply #22 on: February 14, 2014, 11:29:46 pm »

Cheers Jan! Yeah It's a nice speed, it's still very controllable, whilst still knowing its got the extra oomph!
It does run nicely as you say, the nose lifts out at about half speed and very slowly raises until it's at top whack which is where it is in the video.


Yeah, I have watched your video a few times, very impressive turn of speed there!


I think after this weekend (hopefully running it on the new battery) I will start looking at the boat cosmetically. The fittings kit from Model Slipway has arrived (fair bit of weight there!). I'll need to make a mast somehow as this isn't included in the fittings kit. Also the cabin sides need rubbing down and spraying grey again. I think I'm going to spray the deck aswell, I'm not sure if I like it in the wooden finish it has. I think if I'm going to make the boat look realistic I might aswell do it...
Also the hull needs respraying both red and black.
Lastly, the Spray rails. These do seem rather on the large side, I understand these help the model to get up on the plane, but do they need to be as big as they are? They will be getting painted to match the hull anyway, but I can't help but feel they could be a but smaller...
Thats all for now again...
Cheers,
Steven
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pompebled

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Re: 34" Crash Tender
« Reply #23 on: February 14, 2014, 11:41:21 pm »

Hi Steven,

They do look a bit on the large side, but when the do their job right (deflecting the spray), I would paint them first and see if that makes it look better.

Sprayrails need a certain size to be more than just ornamental, as the water isn't scaled down with the boat...

Regards, Jan.
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Dicky-P

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Re: 34" Crash Tender
« Reply #24 on: February 15, 2014, 10:40:16 am »

Spray rails on mine are 1/8th square as per the design drawings. These work very well
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