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Author Topic: Missing Flight MH370  (Read 22294 times)

Martin [Admin]

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Missing Flight MH370
« on: March 13, 2014, 03:51:36 PM »


OK, no one else has mentioned it....

 Missing Flight MH370 from Kuala Lumpur to Beijing.


... it's like the plot to a 1970's James Bond film or the stupid TV series: LOST!

    I find my own insatiable desire for answers very interesting.
    Am I a ghoul, petulant or intrusive?!...

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Netleyned

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Re: Missing Flight MH370
« Reply #1 on: March 13, 2014, 03:59:21 PM »

Just curious Martin.
A lot of experts are scratching their heads over this.
Myself, I would have thought that any aircraft transmitting
an ocean would have some sort of EPIRB fitted as well as the
beacon in the black/orange box.
Something fitted to the top of the fuselage or tail fin
that would detach on impact.

Ned
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DavieTait

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Re: Missing Flight MH370
« Reply #2 on: March 13, 2014, 04:27:04 PM »

There are systems that send back , in real time , engine data to Rolls Royce which will give them a time that contact was lost ( don't think those transmitters can be disabled from the cockpit ) , from what's been said it looks like the crew switched off the AIS ( Automatic Identification System ) transponder and all other transmitters. It might now be time for a system to be added that CANNOT be disabled by the crew ( and would prevent the aircraft from taking off if tampered with on the ground ) that sends out a continuous position/altitude/course/speed data back to a central control room then they would know instantly when a plane was in trouble
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tobyker

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Re: Missing Flight MH370
« Reply #3 on: March 13, 2014, 04:35:20 PM »

This is very strange indeed. If there really is no floating debris, did the plane crash over land into some forested uninhabited area? Do the Chinese know a lot more than they are letting on, in order to justify giving Malaya a hard time? Or has the plane been hijacked to some out of the way  airstrip and whipped under camo netting the minute it got there? Weird. Very sorry for the families.
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Neil

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Re: Missing Flight MH370
« Reply #4 on: March 13, 2014, 04:56:27 PM »

apparently those  transmitters attached to the engines were transmitting for another 4 hours after she had disappeared.......if it weren't so serious and tragic, one would start to believe in alien abduction!!!!
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Re: Missing Flight MH370
« Reply #5 on: March 13, 2014, 05:25:43 PM »

Triangulation of the engine transmissions
would surely have given the last known position.
If they transmitted for four hours they were obviously
not under the ocean.

Ned
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TailUK

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Re: Missing Flight MH370
« Reply #6 on: March 13, 2014, 05:35:22 PM »

From what I've read, the aircraft could have travelled another 100 miles from having lost power (engines and electrical).  So if the last transmission was the time of failure then the search area could be a 200 mile circle, which is a lot of sea.  If it had turned to return to the nearest airfield then it could have made it back over land.  Given that the area is fairly densely wooded the possibility remains that the wreck is hidden in the jungle. 
If she ditched and didn't break up the aircraft may have sunk intact leaving little or no wreckage to find.  It's incredible in this day and age that such a big aeroplane could be completely lost.  With search coverage and satallite surveillance it can only be a matter of time before it's found.
What ever the cause and reasons for the mystery the loss of of so many is a real tragedy and one can only hope that at least some of the passengers are still out there in liferafts. 
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Re: Missing Flight MH370
« Reply #7 on: March 13, 2014, 09:11:09 PM »

That story about the engine data has now been retracted by the Wall Street Journal, where it originated. Rolls Royce received two data packets from the onboard ACARS system, one just after take off, and one on the climb to cruising altitude. Nothing exceptional was noted in them.


Nothing is sent continuously in real time, as the cost of the satellite/radio bandwidth would be prohibitive.


Lance
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RAAArtyGunner

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Re: Missing Flight MH370
« Reply #8 on: March 13, 2014, 09:20:06 PM »

 
It has been reported here, that the black boxes, actually Orange, are obsolete 1990's technology and have not been upgraded to modern standards because of the $100,000. cost per aircraft.
 
If they were modern 'boxes' then the wreckage would have been found by now, using GPS type data like as in mobile phones etc.
 
Makes you wonder, they go on about crash proof and redundant back up systems but skimp elsewhere.
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BrianB6

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Re: Missing Flight MH370
« Reply #9 on: March 13, 2014, 09:29:35 PM »

So far in the 'normal' press, no one has mentioned alien abduction.  :embarrassed:

There was one report of an aircraft seen flying low over a Vietnamese island at the right time and on the direct route to Beijing.   If the pilots were incapacitated and the plane was at a low level on autopilot, how far could it have flown?   My uneducated guess is that it will never be found after all this time.
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Umi_Ryuzuki

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Re: Missing Flight MH370
« Reply #10 on: March 14, 2014, 05:34:54 AM »

Our current news media reports that the plane transmitted, or "pinged" a satellite for
four hours after it disappeared. They are searching East toward the Indian Ocean.
The plane had enough fuel to fly for up to six hours after its last reported contact.
If this is the case, the search area becomes huge, and the plane could even have been
landed or crash landed somewhere.

It becomes more and more like a James Bond movie or "Lost" as more info keeps being
disseminated and reported.

 :o

Pondweed

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Re: Missing Flight MH370
« Reply #11 on: March 14, 2014, 06:38:29 AM »

After, was it 5 days, the Chinese came across with satelite images of floating wreckage in the area where 370 was last heard from, using Occams theory, that's probably the place it wrecked.

Never mind the elaborate theories having the crew turning off techno devices and flying on weird courses for unexplained reasons, 370 probably nose-dived into the sea due to an event on board around the time the signals were lost.

IMHO
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RAAArtyGunner

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Re: Missing Flight MH370
« Reply #12 on: March 14, 2014, 06:52:43 AM »

So far in the 'normal' press, no one has mentioned alien abduction.  :embarrassed:

There was one report of an aircraft seen flying low over a Vietnamese island at the right time and on the direct route to Beijing.   If the pilots were incapacitated and the plane was at a low level on autopilot, how far could it have flown?   My uneducated guess is that it will never be found after all this time.

There was a report, that the last one that went down in the Ocean, took them two years to find, so perhaps, the same length of time will be needed once again.
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Martin [Admin]

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Re: Missing Flight MH370
« Reply #13 on: March 14, 2014, 08:52:24 AM »

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GAZOU

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Re: Missing Flight MH370
« Reply #14 on: March 14, 2014, 09:03:39 AM »

Let us imagine a system as on lifeboats.

The black flight recorder (orange) is in the water,
 a system inflates balloons
flight recorder  rise on surface
 we find orange boxes
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Hellboy Paul

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Re: Missing Flight MH370
« Reply #15 on: March 14, 2014, 09:12:37 AM »

Let us imagine a system as on lifeboats.

The black flight recorder (orange) is in the water,
 a system inflates balloons
flight recorder  rise on surface
 we find orange boxes


Wouldn't work, the flight recorder could be trapped under wreckage...
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GAZOU

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Re: Missing Flight MH370
« Reply #16 on: March 14, 2014, 09:24:20 AM »

It works on boats, why not on planes?
He could have several systems there fixed to the surface of the plane.
System which starts in the contact of the water
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Hellboy Paul

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Re: Missing Flight MH370
« Reply #17 on: March 14, 2014, 09:38:26 AM »


How many flight recorders would you need though? They are heavy..

So a single recorder is the only realistic option and you would still be relying on a crashed plane coming to rest in a certain position with NO wreckage directly above it as the recorder would only travel upwards...


If this system worked 100% reliably don't you think the aircraft designers and engineers would have incorporated it already?
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warspite

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Re: Missing Flight MH370
« Reply #18 on: March 14, 2014, 09:51:35 AM »

Black boxes are fitted inside the tail section are they not, inside signifies it is difficult for it to be release without a complete and catastrophic failure of the fuselage. Having an ejector pod throwing out a beacon is not such a bad idea, gives a closer idea of the locale to look in and can be separate to the box being only a beacon.
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GAZOU

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Re: Missing Flight MH370
« Reply #19 on: March 14, 2014, 10:13:40 AM »

Let us admit: recorders in double!
The weight of a man?
What is the weight of a plane?
The engineers did not make because the man pays, not the recorder
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Martin [Admin]

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Re: Missing Flight MH370
« Reply #20 on: March 14, 2014, 11:34:56 AM »


I'd like to go on record for patenting purposes later on.


All planes should be fitted with a water soluble dye that is automatically releases orange dye for up to 7 days in the even of a water landing. ( Don't life rafts have these? )


All planes should be fitted with a Smoke Flares that discharge once a day at precisely 12:00 in the even of a crash landing.
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NFMike

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Re: Missing Flight MH370
« Reply #21 on: March 14, 2014, 11:58:29 AM »

All wonderful ideas but destructive forces involved in a serious crash make most of them impractical - ships don't generally impact the water at 200mph. The recorders are sealed in extremely strong boxes and buried in the tail to provide extra protection. Putting it on the surface of the aircraft would expose it to more damage and anything like a flotation pack would likely be stripped off in the crash. As mentioned, cost and weight are significant commercial factors too, and getting the world's aviation authorities to agree on new rules to force adoption of such things is not easy.

A good solution is probably to introduce continuous data transmission back to 'base' but anything transmitting is potentially unreliable and the sheer volume of data would be phenomenal. Just go to one of the aircraft tracking websites, like flightradar24, and see how many aircraft are in the air. It's hundreds just in Europe. You might need an entire constellation of satellites just to deal with aircraft data.

Change will come, but as aviation is so international and needs system and hardware changes around the world, most significant changes will take a while to be agreed and implemented.

NFMike

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Re: Missing Flight MH370
« Reply #22 on: March 14, 2014, 12:01:47 PM »

All planes should be fitted with a Smoke Flares that discharge once a day at precisely 12:00 in the even of a crash landing.

When's that? Midday GMT? So they'd have been looking for smoke from MH370 around midnight.

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Re: Missing Flight MH370
« Reply #23 on: March 14, 2014, 12:16:19 PM »

It may well be worth recalling the disintegration and subsequent crash of the PanAm 747 on to Lockerbie.
That aircraft was intended to blow up over the Atlantic. I can't recall the aircrew having time to make a distress call (?). But a lot of data was eventually recovered.
However. Backtracking the flight and having regard to its speed and altitude etc. it was reported that the "event" began when the aircraft was in the vicinity above Newcastle. If (and it's a big "if", the Malayan 777 didn't turn west then the falling debris from an explosion would carry on falling for quite a distance. All very nasty. BY.
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NFMike

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Re: Missing Flight MH370
« Reply #24 on: March 14, 2014, 12:55:38 PM »

If (and it's a big "if", the Malayan 777 didn't turn west then the falling debris from an explosion would carry on falling for quite a distance. All very nasty. BY.

It doesn't need to be an explosion (eg. terrorism). A major structural fault (which is what a bomb effectively causes) at 500 knots and 35,000 feet can still result in almost instant disintegration of the aircraft. I would have expected them to have found at least a little floating debris from such an event by now, though.
If it made land then yes it could well all be hidden in jungle, but that's a long way to be off course with no contact. It is a bit puzzling.
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