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Author Topic: Shockwave 55 !  (Read 15581 times)

Biscuit

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Re: Shockwave 55 !
« Reply #50 on: July 14, 2007, 01:36:26 PM »

Well Guys my bad luck with boats continues  :(  Took the shockwave out this morning, started fine sounded really crisp and not noisy at all, ran it up and down just to check that the cooling system was working, took a little while to see the water come out of the outlet, but when the boat picked up speed it was comming out about 6 inches so thought it was OK. Well turned it around and opened the throttle it just started to really move then spluttered and stopped, guessed it might be a little lean because of the pipe, no problem we will richen it up a little. So got the boat back altered the mixture and tried to start it but guess what no compression ! what the hell happend there then? I am completely gutted once again I have spent hours on a boat going over every thing just to go over the lake and come home without a run. Bought a new piston ring this afternoon, plus ordered a water pump that runs of the carb, has anyone any Idea as to what went wrong ? it could not have got that hot there was a good jet of water comming out the side, maybe the ring juts broke or there was something in the engine that wore it out, I dont know, will take it apart this afternoon and have a look.
Steve
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w3bby

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Re: Shockwave 55 !
« Reply #51 on: July 14, 2007, 02:02:31 PM »

Tough luck, it happens to us all, let's hope it's not a dead engine. Take the head off and then we might be able to help.
What oil ratio were you running and what oil?
Just a thought, you did give it a look over and oil it up after you got hold of it didn't you?

Biscuit

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Re: Shockwave 55 !
« Reply #52 on: July 14, 2007, 02:18:39 PM »

I used the same oil I use in my 1/5 scale cars, its King Cobra Venom, the gold bottle, mix is 150ml to 5litres of fuel. engine only ran for about 3Min's.
Steve.
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Biscuit

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Re: Shockwave 55 !
« Reply #53 on: July 14, 2007, 03:41:04 PM »

Well Thats the end of that! :'(
Something must of got into the engine from the carb side as its taken out the piston and barrel, when I took the choke out I made sure I got the ball and the spring out so its not that ! maybe when I was building something got in there ??? so where do I go from here? a new e-bay motor for 140 or a new 23cc piston and barrel 70 there is a lot of grey alloy in the crankcase, and who knows what else is in there, could wash it out, what you think guys??
Steve.
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Biscuit

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Re: Shockwave 55 !
« Reply #54 on: July 14, 2007, 05:25:32 PM »

Anyone know what these bits might be  ??? found them in the crankcase, going to keep on flushing out the crankcase then buy another 23cc piston and barrel, as I have been told they rev higher, got a horrible feeling that those bits look like the remains of a spring, but it cant be the choke spring as they are a lot thinner, and like I said I am sure I got it out, tell me there is only one in the carb ! Please !!!
Steve.
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w3bby

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Re: Shockwave 55 !
« Reply #55 on: July 15, 2007, 01:03:41 AM »

Check your carb, is the idle screw still there? If not I would guess it is that spring. Most will normally remove this screw to allow the motor to be killed with the radio. Sorry we missed this earlier :-[
For the future, your ratio, whilst fine for cars is weak for a boat motor, most are running a synthetic at around double that, 16:1. I run Castrol TTS, others have their own favourites.
Hope you find a new piston/cylinder for it soon.

glennb2006

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Re: Shockwave 55 !
« Reply #56 on: July 15, 2007, 01:55:35 AM »

Check your carb, is the idle screw still there? If not I would guess it is that spring. Most will normally remove this screw to allow the motor to be killed with the radio. Sorry we missed this earlier :-[
For the future, your ratio, whilst fine for cars is weak for a boat motor, most are running a synthetic at around double that, 16:1. I run Castrol TTS, others have their own favourites.
Hope you find a new piston/cylinder for it soon.

Hi all, notice form the photo's that the idle screw is still present and correct (and complete witha spring) on one of the photo's on the build.

Tough break Steve, especially after the last effort with the SC61. Should be plenty of pistons and cylinders around to get you moving.

Glenn
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Martin [Admin]

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Re: Shockwave 55 !
« Reply #57 on: July 15, 2007, 05:24:26 AM »

How gut wrenching is that!!!!  >:(

How long did the engine run for?

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Biscuit

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Re: Shockwave 55 !
« Reply #58 on: July 15, 2007, 08:42:11 AM »

Yeah, you wouldn't think it could happen again what is it with me and boats?? never mind looks like it could of been my fault again, still the boat looks like its got potential even though it only run for about 3 Min's, would like to keep it as 23cc. My engine is the old 2 port 2 piston ring engine, but sounded really nice and crisp on the throttle, don't know if I can still get this piston and barrel or do you think the new 23cc 4 port single ring piston and barrel will fit ? I will not give up on this one as it did start easy and all I had to carry over to the lake was the boat and Tranny ! So need your help again, been on e-bay can only find 26cc engine parts and motors, anyone got any other links for the 23cc engine ?
Thanks
Steve.
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glennb2006

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Re: Shockwave 55 !
« Reply #59 on: July 16, 2007, 11:20:56 AM »

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ZENOAH-G260PUM-ENGINE-WT-257-CARB-RC-BOAT-PETROL-GAS_W0QQitemZ300127962543QQihZ020QQcategoryZ2564QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
This fella does complete motors cheap as 139, I think ifyou contact him he does spares too.

http://search.stores.ebay.co.uk/rcworldwide-com_zenoah_W0QQfcdZ2QQfciZQ2d1QQfclZ4QQfrtsZ30QQfsnZrcworldwideQ2dcomQQfsooZ1QQfsopZ1QQfsubZ0QQsaselZ97427162QQsofpZ0

This one does Zenoah spares but lists cylinder and piston for PUM26 only, maybe email him and ask. 26cc piston and cylinder 46 quid, might be better with new motor at 139.

http://stores.ebay.co.uk/PMB-rc-parts_Zenoah_W0QQfsubZ5700176QQfrsrcZ1
This one is Prestwich's ebay shop, Dave does (or can get) most Zenoah parts.

http://www.bhhanson.com/bhabout.htm
This one is for BH Hanson in the states. Their service is always good and they can get spares.

With luck, you will find the parts you need, I presume they still make spares for the 23cc motor.

Good luck,

Glenn

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Biscuit

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Re: Shockwave 55 !
« Reply #60 on: July 16, 2007, 01:21:02 PM »

Thanks for the Links Glenn,
As I am in this situation I have been looking around at various motors, and come to the conclusion that 23cc is the way to go, this motor seems to rev higher and seems to go well on a steel tuned pipe like mine. My Model shop deals with King Cobra, so been in touch and they can do me a new 4 port single ring piston set up that should go straight on my crankcase, this should be a good power increase over my old 2 port set up  :) what you think?
Thanks
Steve
Ps just one other thing, there was a lot of water coming up the prop shaft, can you put some type of o-ring or seal on the end of the tube, the flexi shaft is 6mm and the tube is 7mm I/D so quite a bit of clearance. ???
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w3bby

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Re: Shockwave 55 !
« Reply #61 on: July 16, 2007, 03:02:52 PM »

I am almost 100% sure that the 4-port head will not fit on the 2-port case without significant work, the ports don't match up. You need a 2-port head or a new motor. :( In stock form the larger volume of the ports and the lighter piston mean that the 23 will potentially rev higher than the 26.
Water up the stuffing tube is nothing to worry about, a good bit if grease on the flex and the problem goes away. Also it is only a problem when the boat is still and who keeps a speed boat still for any length of time...NOT me at least...... ;D

glennb2006

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Re: Shockwave 55 !
« Reply #62 on: July 16, 2007, 03:12:44 PM »

Hi Steve,

I think Ian is correct I am afraid, not sure the parts are interchangeable, have asked the question of one of my techy mates!!


Will let you know the outcome.

Glenn
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glennb2006

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Re: Shockwave 55 !
« Reply #63 on: July 16, 2007, 05:16:53 PM »

OK, got the reply from Al at BHHanson:
Afraid it is not great news, copied and pasted below:

"Glen, the ports dont line up and the cylinder wont fit the case. The bolt spacing is also wider on the late model case/cylinder...and the new engine uses the larger bore carb. I have gaskets, rings, 2 ring pistons available for the old engine. no cylinders."

If you can find a cylinder somewhere you can get the rest, but most likely for the costs involved, it may be better to bin what you have and get a new motor.

Glenn
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Biscuit

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Re: Shockwave 55 !
« Reply #64 on: July 16, 2007, 05:33:11 PM »

OK Glenn thanks,
It looks like its going to be hard to get the old cylinder and piston, phoned my shop and told them but its on its way, but they said no problem they can send it back, so will be looking for a new 23cc motor I suppose, nothing is easy is it? this cheap project has turned out not so good.
Cheers
Steve.
Ps again, Do you thing the 26cc motor will be just as good as that 23cc, bearing in mind I am running that steel tuned pipe? I could just buy that 139 motor of e-bay.
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glennb2006

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Re: Shockwave 55 !
« Reply #65 on: July 16, 2007, 08:45:46 PM »

I see no reason the 26cc motor won't be as good Steve, I think the tuned pipe is sold as being suitable for the 26 and 23cc motors. You will probably need to run a bigger prop to get the benefit of the bigger motor. Might be some second hand ones kicking about if you keep your eyes open on ebay etc.

At least spares are available.

The other choice is to find a cylinder and rebuild yours, would be the cheapest option.

Glenn
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Biscuit

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Re: Shockwave 55 !
« Reply #66 on: July 16, 2007, 10:20:28 PM »

Cheers Glenn,
Been in touch with that guy Blueyfishy, got motors in stock for 139 plus postage 14, will wait and check out that new cylinder just to make sure it wont fit, then probably buy the 26cc. Have you any Idea what the cylinder is made of ? as I could bore it out to take a 26cc piston and save the motor for my other SC powered nitro boat, have access to a large M/C shop, or maybe weld up the scores in the cylinder and re- m/c them back, just a thought. Once again thanks for the replies its keeping me going, off work sick at the moment so trying to get it sorted while I am at home.
Thanks
Steve.
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glennb2006

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Re: Shockwave 55 !
« Reply #67 on: July 17, 2007, 09:27:21 AM »

Not sure Steve, most lilkely it will be Nikasil or some other hard coating on the aluminium. Not sure it is feasible to bore out that farto take a 26cc piston, also, the piston is heavier.

Glenn
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w3bby

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Re: Shockwave 55 !
« Reply #68 on: July 17, 2007, 09:31:24 AM »

As Glenn advises unless you have access to plating services then re-boring then cylinder is not an option, sorry :( (I believe they are Nikasil as well)
Save the crank and your pennies to build one of these maybe  :o

Biscuit

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Re: Shockwave 55 !
« Reply #69 on: July 17, 2007, 08:11:28 PM »

WOW !!
That sure looks nice ! maybe I can have a play with my old motor got a few 23cc car cylinders laying about, I know these are only a 2 bolt crankcase fixing but got a load of bits a large m/c shop and time to fiddle :) in the mean time I have bought that 26cc motor off Bluefishy even though the price has gone up to 145, mind you he did knock a 5 off the postage, he reckoned with my pipe it should pull 16500rpm seems optimistic but who knows ! on the prop size, I have on the boat at the moment a bronze looking thing that just has a number on it saying 467, in my box of bits I have found another prop which says Prather 270 ?? the Pranther looks brand new, if this is the one to use would it need balancing ? it looks kind of dark grey in colour.
Thanks
Steve.
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Biscuit

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Re: Shockwave 55 !
« Reply #70 on: July 18, 2007, 09:44:53 AM »

Hi all,
My new motor turned up this morning, not bad as I bought it 11.30 yesterday, 145 for 26cc engine plus race carb and alloy throttle link, tool kit as well. Says got to run it in for 3 tanks at 1/4 throttle is this right? plus do you think I should run a pump, as going this slow might overheat the engine with my cooling set up. But not a bad price eh? even sent me 2 "Bluefishy78.com" stickers, will be using this guy again he was very helpfull, well now time to fit it.
Thanks,
Steve.
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w3bby

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Re: Shockwave 55 !
« Reply #71 on: July 18, 2007, 09:56:13 AM »

The bronze prop is an Octura, 67mm in diameter with a pitch of 93.8mm (67 x 1.4 ratio) and should work well with the 26. The Prather is 70mm with a pitch of 106.7mm and is probably a slightly better choice to start with. Grey in colour means stainless so balancing and sharpening will take a little longer. You should also check the balance of the Octura before you run it. Octuras contain beryllium and you should wear a mask, long sleeves and take precautions not to spread the dust around. I do filing and sanding in a bowl of water.
16500 with a pipe should be achievable.....
Running in you will get many opinions, run it like you stole it, take it easy and build up, one fast. one slow etc etc. The one I have heard and used is to run the engine until hot and then let it cool totally, repeat this 4-5 times then go for it.
Use a good oil, I use synthetic (Castrol TTS) and at the ratio 16:1. Good luck......

glennb2006

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Re: Shockwave 55 !
« Reply #72 on: July 18, 2007, 04:23:53 PM »

Hi Steve,

pretty fast delivery time. I'm with Ian, I actually use the same Castrol oil too. Run it around to warm it through without going too nuts, then bring it in and cool it off, I use a rich mixture to make it run cooler and get more oil through the motor.

I did mine for about total of 30 - 40 mins running time, getting slightly longer each time then started to lean it out and run it faster. Been OK so far.

I wouldn't bother with the pump, just make sure you are getting cooling water over the side as you run it. You don't want it too cool - You of all people know what can happen!!

Good luck.

Glenn
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Biscuit

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Re: Shockwave 55 !
« Reply #73 on: July 18, 2007, 08:30:10 PM »

Thanks Glenn,
Got the motor in today, took a while as you have to change over the mounts and put the clutch on, must make myself a clutch puller! Still its in, took me ages to make a bracket to hold the throttle cable as the carb is very different to mine, it was one of those jobs where you cut up loads of cardboard templates, then try to make it out of alloy sheet, (not so easy is it) now I am waiting for the o- rings for the pipe as the old one looked a bit deformed, comming from Dave Males hopefully. Got no primer, guess you just stick your finger in the crab and Wang it over a few times ??? still not sure about the pump.
Steve.
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glennb2006

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Re: Shockwave 55 !
« Reply #74 on: July 18, 2007, 11:18:09 PM »

Yip,

I believe that is the technique employed, finger over and two or three pulls, then try with no finger. Repeat until it starts. You'll get the feel for it once you have it set up.

ONe thing I did buy for my motor fairly early on and mine did break, is a replacement bit that goes inside the pull start, original is plastic and they can break, got an aluminium one from Hanson I think it was. Works OK ever since.

Might be a worthy spare for your tool box, maybe just don't be as rough as me with the pull start will help too.

Enjoy!!

Glenn
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