Model Boat Mayhem

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length.
Pages: [1] 2   Go Down

Author Topic: Fairmile C 1:24 Scale  (Read 6869 times)

Oldishseadog

  • Shipmate
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 16
  • Model Boat Mayhem is Great!
  • Location: Cardiff
Fairmile C 1:24 Scale
« on: August 13, 2014, 10:40:59 PM »

 Following on from my first posting under the Chit-Chat banner, for those that are interested some more thoughts and details on the Fairmile C project. Obtained the plans on three sheets by John Lambert great detail of the real thing and construction methods, but translating into a scale model gives much food for thought.  I chose the Fairmile because I like the hull form, curves and flare of the bow; in order to keep those lines it has to be a plank on frame/bulkhead build, decided to double-diagonal as per the original.
Once that was sorted, how do I power it.  First thought was a diesel/electric arrangement, but after some investigation decided the scale was too small and the generation/power supply/voltage regulation was far beyond my meager electrical knowledge and abilities.  IC by itself is noisy and problematical with going astern unless gearbox is introduced, but can do without that type of complication.  So electric it is.
Model boat electrics have moved on considerably since my early efforts in the late 60s/early 70s so after considerable research, a lot of which was on this fine forum, I decided on brushless outrunners with lipo batteries.  Four of them.  Props will be outward turning (ie right-hand props on starboard shafts, left-hand props on port shafts, as per traditionally viewed from astern).  Outboard props will have ahead and astern, inboard props ahead only; the intention with the electronics is to have the inboard props cut in at half-throttle or so.  She will take 40 mm props no problem, may even take 45 depending on clearances, but that will be looked into once the hull is planked. Twin rudders, independently controlled.  No helm mixing on the throttles.  I used to drive multi-engine vessels for a living so tank steering and split rudders is the way to go (I have stopped short of fitting a bow thruster).  Thrust bearings? Why not.
Not exactly how the original craft was configured, but I can live with that.
So, how to squeeze it all in?  Looking at the available motor mounts and considering other options I decided to utilise cage-style motor mounts designed for model aircraft very light but robust; bolt the motor on one end, the shaft coupling within the cage, the thrust bearing on the other end of the cage.  The tubulars of the cage clamped to the hull structures.  It will be easily removable as a unit and should make replacement or up-sizing of the motors fairly straightforward if necessary.  There are a couple of photos attached of the experimental drive train.  The motor is a 1050 rev per volt outrunner rated at about 220 watts with a 40 mm prop.  Four cages will fit neatly across the beam of the boat at just about the LCF (slightly forward of it to be precise) so trimming issues should not be too great.  Some drawing extracts of the motor arrangement are also attached.
Now the drive train is sorted, at least in theory, the current job is designing and drawing the keel structure and the lower part of the transverse frames/bulkheads.  I want to try and get as big an opening in the deck as possible to give good access to the innards.  Ideally I would like the deck structure completely removable from about frame 3 aft to about fr.12 but I am still looking into the feasibility of this and the best method of waterproofing the joints, and how to secure the removable section in place I have a few ideas but not fully developed any of them yet.  Hence only the bottom half of the frames being designed at the moment.
It's going to take while to complete the overall design and form of the individual components so I am nowhere near introducing bits of wood to a saw blade, but that will come.  Still got to make space in the garage to build it, my nearest and dearest wouldn't appreciate me taking over the kitchen worktops indefinitely!  I'll post an update on design aspects for anybody interested when things have advanced suitably. {-)
Logged

longshanks

  • Full Mayhemer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 698
Re: Fairmile C 1:24 Scale
« Reply #1 on: August 13, 2014, 11:05:13 PM »

I look forward to this build but am I missing something here?

The Fairmile C had three Hall Scott engines!

Puzzled
Logged

derekwarner

  • Full Mayhemer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 8,195
  • Location: Wollongong Australia
Re: Fairmile C 1:24 Scale
« Reply #2 on: August 14, 2014, 12:31:06 AM »

OSD........

1. are these the thrust bearings you mention?
2. some detail reference to the motor mounts [cage-style motor mounts designed for model aircraft] would also be interesting.... :-))

Derek
Logged
Derek Warner

Honorary Secretary [Retired]
Illawarra Live Steamers Co-op
Australia
www.ils.org.au

mudway

  • Full Mayhemer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 437
  • Model Boat Mayhem is Great
  • Location: Sydney
Re: Fairmile C 1:24 Scale
« Reply #3 on: August 14, 2014, 06:57:33 AM »

If you haven't started building, Christian (CDC) does a fibreglass hull in 1/24th scale.
Logged

TailUK

  • Full Mayhemer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1,664
  • Location: East Midlands
Re: Fairmile C 1:24 Scale
« Reply #4 on: August 14, 2014, 09:47:02 AM »

I look forward to this build but am I missing something here?

The Fairmile C had three Hall Scott engines!

Puzzled
According to Lambert and Ross,  Fairmiles C's did only have 3 engines.  I'm fairly certain we're looking at a thread title typo and it should be "Fairmile D".
Logged
No human society has ever functioned without models to capture, explain,disseminate,
persuade, sell, reinforce and analyse all kinds of ideas, values, concepts and situations.

cdsc123

  • Guest
Re: Fairmile C 1:24 Scale
« Reply #5 on: August 14, 2014, 10:09:20 AM »

Very interesting project. Let me know if you want a GRP hull and deck I can do all the Fairmiles in 1/24th scale.
Logged

vnkiwi

  • Full Mayhemer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1,600
  • Location: SE Asia
Re: Fairmile C 1:24 Scale
« Reply #6 on: August 14, 2014, 10:15:58 AM »

Christians hulls are good, I have his Fairmile B in 1/24th.
Very nice
Also think your looking at a 'D' rather than a 'C'
 :-))
Logged
If it ain't broke. Don't fix it !

cdsc123

  • Guest
Re: Fairmile C 1:24 Scale
« Reply #7 on: August 14, 2014, 10:18:46 AM »

Thanks  :-))

The section drawing above shows a Fairmile C but with 4 props, 3 is correct.
Logged

Oldishseadog

  • Shipmate
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 16
  • Model Boat Mayhem is Great!
  • Location: Cardiff
Re: Fairmile C 1:24 Scale
« Reply #8 on: August 17, 2014, 08:46:10 PM »

Yes, there is a bit of a liberty being taken with the powertrain - the first post on the project offers some background intentions towards the build, here
http://www.modelboatmayhem.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,48175.0.html

The cage mounts for the motors are from here
http://www.giantshark.co.uk/product/169683/xyh-motor-mount-for-28-30-size-motor
the ones I was sent were black, not as pictured.  I have used a mix of two different sized mounts in order to get the cage long enough to take the shaft coupling.
Yes Derek, the circled item is the thrust bearing.
I had pondered on whether or not to go for a pre-formed GRP hull but decided that drawing, designing and building the hull from the John Lambert plans would be a challenge and ultimately more satisfying, although I am sure there will be times to come when I will regret that decision!

OSD
Logged

Oldishseadog

  • Shipmate
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 16
  • Model Boat Mayhem is Great!
  • Location: Cardiff
Re: Fairmile C 1:24 Scale
« Reply #9 on: April 12, 2015, 10:45:18 PM »

 April 2015

 
Things have moved on over the last few months and basic design of the hull frames and girders has been completed to the point where timber can be cut.  The deck is designed to be removable from frame 4 aft to frame 12 to give access to the innards; deck superstructures, fixtures and fittings will be added later so as not to interfere with the opening. Weatherproof sealing of the deck removable section will follow the system used for hatch covers of commercial cargo vessels convex rubber compressing against a horizontal surface.  Will it work for this boat? Who can say it does in my head and on paper but reality may prove to be different.  If so, a bridge to be crossed at the time.

 
I've decided to install permanent sterntubes for the propshafts brass tubing through the hull likely epoxied into place through which the actual bought-in propshaft/tube will slide with close tolerance, secured and sealed by a run of solder.  Should the shaft tubes need to be replaced it will save having to wreck the hull to get them out.  At least that is the theory.  I may end up having to make a couple of my own shafts they need to be 22.5 inches long and the longest I can find commercially available is only 20 inches.  Yet another challenge. A-frames will need to be fabricated later in the build once shaft alignment is fixed.  Currently in the process of knocking up a building board.

 
A few grabs of plans attached the shape of the prow will be developed during the build the plan shows a best-fit ellipse which is not true to the actual craft.  Frame shapes printed onto paper and the paper pasted to the timbers for cutting; saves a lot of time; couldn't be doing with transcribing the drawings onto the timber in any event the frame shapes are quite complex.  More as and when things have moved on enough.

 
OSD
Logged

colin-stevens

  • Full Mayhemer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 695
  • Location: Southwater
Re: Fairmile C 1:24 Scale
« Reply #10 on: April 13, 2015, 10:57:54 AM »

Nice drawings. Look forward to the build.
Logged
grumpy old XXX

John W E

  • I see no ships !!
  • Full Mayhemer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 8,508
  • Location: South shields
Re: Fairmile C 1:24 Scale
« Reply #11 on: April 13, 2015, 04:33:49 PM »

hi there

When I first saw this drawing, like everyone else, Fairmile C - 3 shafts - and then a little bell began to ring - I know there was a Fairmile C used on the St Nazaire Raid but I don't think she was altered mechanically to 4 shafts. However, there was an article somewhere along the lines about the Blockaid Runners or the Ball - bearing runners to Sweden during WW2.   I know they converted several vessels and I am certain/sure one of them was a Fairmile C which I think may have been operated by the British Army i.e. Royal Army Service Corps and I wonder if this one had been mechanically altered to increase speed.   I very much doubt it though, as I haven't found anything positive about it yet.    I have found something about the Boat called Grey Viking which was used - I am sure Christian will know :-) .

Look forward to the build.

Aye
john
Logged

MTB Hulls

  • Full Mayhemer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 63
  • MTB Hulls for Shipshape Models
  • Location: Gibraltar
    • MTB Hulls picture gallery
Re: Fairmile C 1:24 Scale
« Reply #12 on: April 13, 2015, 08:06:21 PM »

Hi John


How goes it? best Camper Nick blockade runner website is the Paxman-Ricardo history page here;
http://www.paxmanhistory.org.uk/blockade.htm


The 4 shaft C was never a reality as far as I know.
Logged
Regards,
Christian.
http://www.mtbhulls.co.uk/

Oldishseadog

  • Shipmate
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 16
  • Model Boat Mayhem is Great!
  • Location: Cardiff
Re: Fairmile C 1:24 Scale
« Reply #13 on: April 15, 2015, 05:32:05 PM »

It is now - at least in reduced form!


OSD
Logged

Oldishseadog

  • Shipmate
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 16
  • Model Boat Mayhem is Great!
  • Location: Cardiff
Re: Fairmile C 1:24 Scale
« Reply #14 on: November 22, 2015, 05:28:28 PM »

Test post as seem to be having problems with latest installment
Logged

Oldishseadog

  • Shipmate
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 16
  • Model Boat Mayhem is Great!
  • Location: Cardiff
Re: Fairmile C 1:24 Scale
« Reply #15 on: November 22, 2015, 05:29:25 PM »

 November 2015
Two years have passed since inception good job there is no rush.
Bought a cheap scroll earlier in the year and all hull frames, beams and girders have been cut.  It is now just a case of working out the order in which to stick it all together.  First-fit of the parts appears ok although there is a slight wave in the keel plywood which hopefully will be rectified as the hull becomes more rigid as construction progresses.  Pictures speak a thousand words so here they are:

 
OSD
Logged

Oldishseadog

  • Shipmate
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 16
  • Model Boat Mayhem is Great!
  • Location: Cardiff
Re: Fairmile C 1:24 Scale
« Reply #16 on: November 22, 2015, 05:30:09 PM »

and another
Logged

Oldishseadog

  • Shipmate
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 16
  • Model Boat Mayhem is Great!
  • Location: Cardiff
Re: Fairmile C 1:24 Scale
« Reply #17 on: November 22, 2015, 05:30:50 PM »

and another couple
Logged

Oldishseadog

  • Shipmate
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 16
  • Model Boat Mayhem is Great!
  • Location: Cardiff
Re: Fairmile C 1:24 Scale
« Reply #18 on: November 22, 2015, 05:31:57 PM »

And yet more ...
Logged

ballastanksian

  • Full Mayhemer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5,601
  • Model Boat Mayhem inspires me!
  • Location: Crewkerne
Re: Fairmile C 1:24 Scale
« Reply #19 on: November 30, 2015, 08:47:51 PM »

I have learnt a lot from your design and cut of the frames and keel. I like the scarfe joint.
Logged
Pond weed is your enemy

Oldishseadog

  • Shipmate
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 16
  • Model Boat Mayhem is Great!
  • Location: Cardiff
Re: Fairmile C 1:24 Scale
« Reply #20 on: August 29, 2016, 10:50:41 PM »

 Late August 2016
Progress on the old girl has been slow the last 6 months or so, mainly due to other calls on diy skills, but she is slowly coming together.  The main framing of the hull is done and the keel is now suitably straight.  The removable deck section has been cut free.  Currently in the process of fabricating the weathertight seal arrangements to (hopefully) keep the water out of the innards.  Engine mounts are in, prop stern tubes are not yet secured but seem to fit ok a bit more work to do on the hull before confident to stick 'em in.  Will probably work on fitting the electronics while all-round access to the hull is still possible before starting to plank (or maybe that is just my excuse for putting off planking for as long as possible!).  Some photos of progress to date.
OSD
Logged

derekwarner

  • Full Mayhemer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 8,195
  • Location: Wollongong Australia
Re: Fairmile C 1:24 Scale
« Reply #21 on: August 29, 2016, 11:17:24 PM »

All looking good OSD ...the engine room machinery layout is very tidy :-))...and your framing is very sharp for hand cut scroll saw work

The original vessels I understand were double diagonal planked in mahogany, which in our 1:24 scale and in two layers could be difficult to work with.......what specie of timber/s will you be using for the planking?

Whatever build speed you make....just keep the images coming through.... Derek
Logged
Derek Warner

Honorary Secretary [Retired]
Illawarra Live Steamers Co-op
Australia
www.ils.org.au

tghsmith

  • Full Mayhemer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 113
  • Model Boat Mayhem is Great!
  • Location: raleigh NC
Re: Fairmile C 1:24 Scale
« Reply #22 on: August 30, 2016, 11:31:52 AM »

looking great, the long build period will be your friend as advances in 3D printing over the last 2 years have been outstanding, fittings and guns are now  available in precise and lightweight versions,(RN crews may be on the way from a designer I've been in contact with)  think about a weight reduction program before planking, at 1/24 weight will not be your friend.. grams removed now will pay off later....
Logged

Oldishseadog

  • Shipmate
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 16
  • Model Boat Mayhem is Great!
  • Location: Cardiff
Re: Fairmile C 1:24 Scale
« Reply #23 on: August 30, 2016, 08:59:02 PM »

Thanks Derek - sharp blade and changed often!
Not having done anything like this before I am not sure which timber to use for the double-diagonal planking, but after doing a bit of reading I am veering towards half-mil x 5 or 6 mil limewood, said to be good straight compact grain.  Mahogany itself may be a bit too open grain and prone to splitting to be practicable.  As the hull is going to be painted I am not too bothered about the visual appearance of the outer layer of planking.  The top layer of the deck I may well try in mahogany and leave it bare wood - I have no idea if the deck on the real thing was painted, but my experience with wooden decks on proper ships is that they are untreated (in the days when they had caulked timber decks that is, rather than the utilitarian compound that seems to proliferate and readily break-up these days).  Any wisdom to be offered over materials and methods would be gratefully received.

tghsmith - thanks for the comments re 3D printed fittings - I am a long way off that stage yet but will bear them in mind.  I am hoping weight is not going to be too much of a problem; as she is now she is just short of 1.5 kg; hull form calculations (WPAs & Simpson's Rules) indicate a waterline displacement of about 4.5 kg.  However, as mentioned above I have not done anything like this before so I will keep weight in mind (my calculations could always be wrong ...).

Thanks for your interest chaps.
OSD
Logged

Oldishseadog

  • Shipmate
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 16
  • Model Boat Mayhem is Great!
  • Location: Cardiff
Re: Fairmile C 1:24 Scale
« Reply #24 on: November 12, 2019, 03:23:38 PM »

 November 2019
 Well, how time flies!  I would love to say the old girl is finished and whizzing about a local pond but sadly that is  not the case. Life has been such that things I like to do have been overtaken by things I need to do.  Therefore the build has been taking very much second, if not third and fourth place, over the last two or three years.  As I have said before, good job there is no rush.  You never know, by the time I finish her there could be miniaturised nuclear fission cells instead of LiPo batteries and steam power will be all the rage again...!
 Having completed all the framing and fabricating the rudder linkages for the split rudders (I know, I know the originals had but this is my build for my own amusement!!) I bit the bullet and started the planking.  I decided to do a loose-fit base layer of vertical planks to get an idea of the hull shape and to fine out any irregularities.  I used 10 x 1 (mm) limewood strip and Titebond 3 sticko and some of the strakes have been sanded down to almost see-through thicknesses in order to suitably fair the lines.  But she is sound.  Over the top went a layer of aircraft tissue applied with watered-down waterproof pva which seems to work quite well in turning moisture.  I am now mid-way through the first layer of diagonal planking.  Slight cock-up with the direction of the diagonal at first that's what comes from working with the hull upside down and not fully thinking it through first (in other words, inordinate enthusiasm to get started) but should have no serious effects on the finished hull.  First layer of diagonal is 8 x 1 (mm) limewood and more Titebond 3 (just ordered my second 8-oz bottle); the intention is for the outer layer to be 6mm strip, which should just about be on-scale for the craft, probably 0.5 mm thick but I will see how well the first layer sands down before deciding.  At current rate that should be about 2021 (year, not hour...).
 I will probably trim the stem back and build-up a laminated stem-piece of hard wood to take the collisions she will no doubt have; that is way in the future but may go some way to explaining the slightly ragged appearance of the stem in the following photos. Talking of which
 OSD

Logged
Pages: [1] 2   Go Up