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[Netleyned]

Thats the stars and stripes out of the window then

Ned

[radiojoe]

Maybe We should ban French, Spanish, Dutch, Italian any one else's flag we had fisticuffs with. Not many flags about  th en,would that make 'em happy or would they find new things to whinge about




To start off I would propose all Roman emblems, after all what have the Romans ever done for us. Besides coming here in 43 starting rows.

They gave us roads, they gave us central heating,    sounds a bit like Monty Python here.

but seriously a model of a German warship would not look right without German insignia, I wonder if a German sailing a British ship would get told to remove British insignia. 

[david5]

Hello all,
some of you may know the boat in question it's a Siebel Ferry in 1/24 scale, if you have seen it then you will know where the Swastika is, our pond was built for pond yachts in 1896, which should help our club cause, but I wouldn't trust the council that far.
What really gets on my "boobs" is that the complainant goes to the council after walking past us and not saying a thing, easy to hide behind a computer, spineless.
That boat has been to the Benelux countries who I would think would have good reason to object, but not a thing.
Thanks for your opinions, they follow my thoughts, I'm going to sit on this for a day or two, otherwise I might say something the club might suffer for.
David5

[TheLongBuild]

Is this yours ?.

[Colin Bishop]

If it is a scale model as opposed to making an explicit political statement then there should be no legal or other basis whatsoever for a ban.

There are enough re runs of the Battle of Britain film on TV and nobody appears to object to those.

The Council should be put politely but firmly in their place. Legally they haven't got a leg to stand on.

'Small minded people' is right. You cannot airbrush history, things happened and must be acknowledged. Reproducing historic insignia on models on the grounds of accuracy is no crime. People don't have to look at it if it offends them.

If you stand your ground then the council will back off.

Colin

[david5]

Yes that's the one.
David5

[grendel]

perhaps they want them replaced by VW logos?....
Grendel

[tobyker]

Nor is there any reason why you shouldn't play that excellent old German folk song "The Pirate". Do make sure you get the words right, though.

[RAAArtyGunner]

As an aside here in Australia it is the Rising Sun AKA the Japanese emblem/flag.
However the Australian Army General Service badge is also called the Rising Sun.
This is the badge worn by all members of the second AIF in WWII.
So much for critics who know nought.
Display the Swastika and Rising Sun, etc, where appropriate.

[nemesis]

Hi, With due respect to other posts, I believe it was called the "Fylfot" in ancient Egypt. Nemesis

[Peter Fitness]

Hi, With due respect to other posts, I believe it was called the "Fylfot" in ancient Egypt. Nemesis

A Fylfot, while very similar, is slightly different to a swastika as it has shorter "limbs".


Peter.

[RAAArtyGunner]

Hi, With due respect to other posts, I believe it was called the "Fylfot" in ancient Egypt. Nemesis

More info here,

http://history1900s.about.com/cs/swastika/a/swastikahistory.htm

[mermod]

About 20 years ago we had a club member that had a 2 metre long Russian Udaloy warship and he used to drape a  Russian flag over the stand then sit the boat on it, nobody thought twice about it until we did a display at a shopping centre and the management received complaints about it, silly really.

Phill

[Neil]

there's nowt so strange as folks, Phill,

[HUNTER]

A little story here...many years ago on the date of the late Bernie Wood's birthday, we invited himself and his good lady wife down for the weekend. In a moment of madness, and in the Great Man's honour, I decided to fly my German battle ensign out in the garden on a long pole...the flag was huge, I thought it looked great out there, fluttering nicely in the breeze.


Within minutes, we had people knocking on the door complaining loudly (Graham Sheppard may well remember this) and veiled threats from the people who lived just up the road behind my house of making the complaint official.


Needless to say, the flag remained flying until  His Lordship arrived and had seen it...only then did we take it down.


Rich

I remember it well Mr H. However it was not me complaining!!
I think the people were complaining more about Das Boot being played at full welly with you dressed up in boots, shorts, jacket and Hat along with that whip - ouch!
The final crunch was flying the 'Big Mac' flag!!Lol

[sparkey]

  Years ago I had a model of a German E-boat with a Swastika on the deck and as far as I can recall nobody complained about it. Bearing in mind what the German Nazis did to my family if anyone should be offended it should be me. The way I look at it if the real boat had a Swastika on it the model should as well, what does offend me is the thugs who have Swastikas tattooed on their bodies without understanding what evil people used this symbol for. Models do a lot of good for people who make and sail them and should be correct as possible. Swastikas used as a symbol of hate do no good to anyone,
Ray.    

[david48]

I saw the start of Dads Army last night , I did not notice any complaints in the morning press. Any government that bans PC gets my vote.
David

[cuppa]

Years ago I had a model of a German E-boat with a Swastika on the deck and as far as I can recall nobody complained about it. Bearing in mind what the German Nazis did to my family if anyone should be offended it should be me. The way I look at it if the real boat had a Swastika on it the model should as well, what does offend me is the thugs who have Swastikas tattooed on their bodies without understanding what evil people used this symbol for. Models do a lot of good for people who make and sail them and should be correct as possible. Swastikas used as a symbol of hate do no good to anyone,
Ray.    

Well said Ray

[Geoff]

It is a matter of historical accuracy and a fact that the German ships did have their flags painted on. I think the best solution is really to just ignore it and see what happens. I agree there is no law about it as you are not flying the flag promoting any political views.
 
See if the complainant does so again then politely talk to the council and explain its a model boat and is historically accurate and if they get "iffy" ask them on what basis you are breaking any laws.
 
Unfortunately we live in such a PC age that any allegation no matter how stupid needs to be followed up to protect the council from racist allegations. I would be surprised if you hear any more about the matter.
 
Small minded people as it is a  "MODEL BOAT!"

[Neil]

how things PC wise have taken off in the last quarter of a century.......


I remember reviewing the kit of Caldercraft's PCF  Swift boat for Marine Modelling International when it first  came out onto the market.........

At the time they were always wanting to get their editorial out before Model Boats mag, and the editor at the time, (not Chris Jackson, but the original ed) and he said to me............."do something different with it.

Well, I actually found it a very boring boat to build and the motors recommended at the time ( no brushless in those days and it sailed with the larger motors I put in like a slow narrow boat,) and so for the review I repainted it from the  recommended colour scheme into a colour that I obtained via a letter  from the Vietnamese Consul in London.........I also painted ( again given to me via the consul) the number 13 in Vietnamese graphics........( got some pics of it somewhere)

and submitted it to the magazine,  with bright red graphics over an olive green, thinking that it would be rejected and asked for yet another repaint.

But no, the ed published the review complete with pictures.........................and bearing in mind that the Vietnam war had not long been over, in comparison to WW2...............not a single complaint was made to the  magazine or myself.................It even had a home made Viet Cong pennant flying............just shows how people are becoming less tolerant as time goes by , rather than more tolerant of the past..............a weary world we live in at times.

[inertia]

Neil

The most maddening thing is the increasing number of people who are predisposed to take on the responsibility of being offended on behalf of everyone else. Mary Whitehouse used to be the most highly visible and vocal leader of a very small band of them; now there's one of 'em on every local TV vox-pop. I've given up shouting at the telly - it only encourages the sanctimonious prigs.

Two questions to ponder: How many people who'd actually heard the programme telephoned the BBC to complain about the Brand/Ross/Sachs answering machine affair, and how many complained only after the Daily Mail published details of it? Like you say, a rather sad and weary world.

Dave M

[Yarpie]

Not only is it sanctimonious passing individuals that are to blame for their sensitivities being offended, but the malaise has befallen huge conglomerates as well.

In order not to offend visitors to the London based Olympics last year, an advertising poster was produced of the River Thames in central London with HMS BELFAST (complete with historic camouflage scheme)..................... AIRBRUSHED -OUT.

The Bleedin' Heart Brigade and their accomplices have taken over the Asylum.

Roll on my three score years and ten.

[Geoff]

To widen the topic a little. Our entire history is being airbrushed out. The maritime museum in Greenwich used to house the best collection of warships in the world - all gone some years ago now - not PC to hark back to the days of the British Empire. The Science Museum in Kensington has removed the ship model display - not enough visitors. Maybe if they advertised it some it would have helped but I think advertising the British Empire and sea power would be un PC as well.
 
I wasn't aware of the Belfast being airbrushed out and that is discracefull.
 
About the only thing we are allowed to advertise is out historical involvement in slavery. However if you ask who was William Wilberforce you just get a blank stare. He brought in the anti-slavery laws and the British Empire sought to impose this on the rest of the world but I guess to mention that is un PC as well!!!
 
Rant over (for the moment!)
 
G

[tonyO]

Hi
Didn't we have an issue like this a couple of years ago at Alfold Charity Model Boat Show?
TonyO
 

[radiojoe]

At a SWA exhibition, at a war veterans weekend held a couple of weeks ago there was German insignia of all types on the appropriate vessels, and the veterans had no issues with this whatsoever, so if the people who actually fought in the wars don't have problems with it, why should the bleeding hearts brigade,