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[inertia]

Inertia,

Quote from Inertia - "I don't know if either of the other sound systems mentioned here have this DIY facility - I suspect they don't."

WRONG for USM RC2  They also include Audacity and you simply add or edit their or your own .wav files and save them onto your up to 8GB micro sd card

Regards
Jonathan

So? I said that I didn't know - not that they definitely don't. Unlike some folk I don't mind being wrong now and again. That said, I'm astonished at the vehemence of your defence of this unit; it's only a model sound system, not life or death.
Frankly I don't give a tinker's cuss which unit is ultimately purchased - like I said, it makes no difference to me and I won't feel that my manhood or integrity have somehow been questioned.
Get a grip, for goodness sake.
Dave M

[sailorboy61]

Totally agree Dave,

There's always some on here that feel personally offended when you hold a different opinion to them. It's a forum, somewhere for an exchange of ideas and opinions - if you don't like what someone else says, walk away and leave it behind.

Its the same kind of mentality that left Neil battered around the head with a crash helmet...... grow up!

[g6swj]

Not sure how you pick up vehemence? What tosh about life and death - really.

Vehemence was not intended simply putting the facts correct.

So when someone says "Wrong about x " you can pick up feelings from it?

May be I should have said

Dear Interia,

Blah Blah Blah

Your wrong

It was not a personal attack on you! just correcting facts - no offence intended :)

Regards
Jonathan

[dougal99]

Sailorboy haven't you just contradicted your own argument?

[g6swj]

Sailorboy

Apply your response to yourself!

A quantum leap from unemotionally correcting a fact to bashing someone if the head in my world!

Regards
Jonathan

[derekwarner]

Guys.......possibly I was a little harsh in my comment on the sound offered for a VW Golf GTI  .....

The supplier may have in avertedly linked that name with the sound of another source 

However I did find the sounds of other ...air start and heavy electrical cranking delayed start very lifelike  .....

I suggest any members who have been in marine engine rooms would agree.......   Derek

[inertia]

No offence taken, I'm sure - but was there really a need to write "Simply not true" eleven times, then follow it up with an exhaustive (and exhausting) list of the sounds that this thing has? Perhaps that's where I picked up the suggestion of vehemence - to the extent that I felt like I'd been bashed over the head.
The best points are usually made succinctly. We should agree to differ. 
DM

[g6swj]

Inertia - Ok  - I'll watch my repeat words in the future - did not realise they could have that effect!

Derek, - Pleased you found some better sounds ! This product really does deserve some exploration as it is so much more than a sound module and has applications in lots of RC models (boats/cars/planes/ trucks) etc. switching -  example  lights / flashing leds in sequence / up to 4 sounds simultaneously / random sounds (eg seagulls), create servo control macros....

Regards
Jonathan

[Coxn John]

One thing I have noticed that seems common amongst most makers, they say that whilst a 4ohm speaker is ok, an 8ohm is much better, that I can understand....but.....why does that speaker need to be 4inches wide when I know I can buy a 2inch 8ohm speaker ? Or does the physical size of the speaker make a huge difference ?  ( I doubt i'd be able to get a 4inch one in my boat)

[johno 52-11]

@G6SWJ, thanks, but that's too high a note, & too 'pistony',  mine needs to be much lower, & raw noise, as if you put a straight through  boy racer exhaust on your Skania

 Coxn John I will leave the discussion on which is the best sound unit to others but the biggest single factor in getting a good sound from your boat is the fitting of the Speaker. A good friend of mine has a Seven Class with an old JJC system fitted and this sounds great on the water. you ca hear it here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-feBlbzRxNs I have seen the same type of boat with the same sound system and it sounded tinny and weak even with the addition of an amplifier and it was all down to the way the speaker was fitted.
 
If you have a heard a sound sample of the engine you are looking for but want it without some of the treble then you may be able edit it with a sound application that has a graphic equalizer and re-record it with just the base frequencies that you are looking for.
John

[Coxn John]

Johno, iv been on the real boat more than once, & i'll never forget its sound, of course NOW I wish id recorded it, doh !
Youre not the first to recommend  the JJC, pity theyre not still around :(

[inertia]

G6SWJ - Looks like peace has broken out. Thanks. 

Coxn John
The impedance of the speaker is dictated more by the requirements of the amplifier. Too high and you get little volume; too low and you risk blowing out the speaker cone and damaging the amplifier. The size of the cone is dictated by the size of the magnet which in turn depends on the power output of the amp. Too small a magnet/speaker would not survive the power of a decent amplifier and would sound very tinny even if it did. This is why 1/12 scale lifeboats use such large speakers i.e. because a 10W amp is usually considered the minimum required for a decent bass sound. You can now obtain some decent 2" bass speakers - or so I understand - but I've neither seen nor heard one yet.

Johno is dead right about fitting the speaker. Just chucking it inside the boat, loose on the end of its leads with no baffle board, sound tube or enclosure is a waste of a sound system. The frame of the speaker should be firmly attached to the hull of the boat to maximise any resonance, and the air column from the front of the speaker MUST be given a direct path up and out of the boat e.g. via a sound tube. On no account should the air from the back of the cone be allowed to mix with that from the front - they'll cancel each other out. Steve Dean, who is/was a professional sound engineer, wrote a good article in MMI some while ago about fitting speakers. I know he reads this stuff and I'm hoping he will remind us which issue it appeared in. It is well worth a read.
Dave M

[Coxn John]

Ah, right, I get that, thanks

[Tug Fanatic]

I know exactly what you mean about sounds. I have been very unimpressed by all the model boat sounds apart from one which was fitted in the model below. It was truly great - it had that big engine at a distance sound whilst most are poor examples of a small engine with your ear pressed against it. Unfortunately the owner told me that the sound system is no longer available. I have thought of sitting at Felixstowe at 5am on a nice morning and recording the sound of a ship arriving/ leaving. 

[GAZOU]

 

Why you get bored to voice your boats?

A real boat is audible alongside the quay

As soon as it is twenty meters we do not hear it any more

Divide the real sound by the scale of the ship and it is peanuts



Say I ? How much costs the German gadget ?     

[Tug Fanatic]

......................A real boat is audible alongside the quay

As soon as it is twenty meters we do not hear it any more................
   

How wrong you are. If you are out on a small sailing boat at night you can hear a large ship coming for miles. If you go somewhere quiet - often dawn in summer - you can hear a big ship at several miles and/or a tug working hard or a pilot boat/ lifeboat at the same distances. Unfortunately what you hear sounds nothing like what comes out of most sound units.

I agree other noises can soon make it difficult to isolate and that it needs to be subtle.

[malcolmfrary]

...but.....why does that speaker need to be 4inches wide when I know I can buy a 2inch 8ohm speaker ? Or does the physical size of the speaker make a huge difference ?

Sound is air being moved.  To get a louder sound, more air has to be moved.  The amount of air moved depends on how far the speaker cone moves, and its area.  For a smaller area, it has to move further each stroke, and there rapidly comes a point when it cannot move further without something falling off one way, or running into something solid going the other. 
So size does matter.  A small speaker can be persuaded to have a longer travel, but it needs, among other things, a much more powerful magnet, and these come HEAVY.  It also needs a lot more power to move it the extra distance in the time available. 
There is a reason why sound level gets referred to as "volume".
Back in my days of interest in HiFi, I picked up a snippet about speaker siting (thats a speaker in a cabinet in a room) - if the speakers bass response in the middle of a room is zero dB, if you move the speaker against a wall, the aparrent response doubles to +3, move it to a corner, it doubles again to +6, move it up to the ceiling in the corner (or down to the floor) double up to +9.

[Steve Dean]

I guess it's time I chipped into this thread. Those of you that know me will be very aware that sound effects in my models is a big part of what I do. As Dave (Inertia) pointed out I wrote a detailed article in Marine Modelling International about this very subject. In essence to create low frequencies requires as large a speaker as you can get in the model (taking into account space and keeping the centre of gravity as low as possible). Also the speaker needs to be mounted on a baffle and preferable enclosed to in effect create a loudspeaker cabinet. (The sides of the hull can form part of the enclosure).
Of course to be able to hear it the sound needs to be able to get of the model. Therefore, to state the obvious, there needs to be openings through which the sound can travel. On my large Irish Sea Coaster, this is through non-glassed portholes, skylights, etc, etc. On my 1/12th trawler this is achieved by having the speaker facing upwards in the wheel house floor with the sound coming out of an open sliding door. On my Alien creation (which most people have seen this year) the speaker is mounted in the back of the seat in which the Alien sits. This has a very deep rumbling sound which you can hear over a large area.
All of these models use a 4 or 5 inch diameter paper cone speakers of very good quality. If you use a small mylar cone speaker then the laws of physics come into play …… therefore don't expect good sound.
Also it is worth pointing out that sometimes to create a good sound in a model that the sound needs 'tweaking'. Remember, we are trying to create an illusion. My trawler is regularly complemented for its engine sound, however in truth the real vessel doesn't sound like the model. If the model accurately sounded like the real thing there would be nothing to hear !!!
If you need any further input keeping posting as I am always pleased to help anyone.
Steve.

[red181]

might not be what you want, but, I use an mp3 board from technobots, with an amp from some pc speakers, and two 2" waterproof speakers, again from technobots. The unit has "triggers" that are operated from the tx, I use an sd card, which I can swop depending which boat I use, eg, its currently in my Orca Jaws boat, so I have (using audacity free download) a diesel engine (not throttle linked, so its just a constant speed) and I have a load of clips from the movie Jaws (free downloads) dialogue, music etc

The speakers are on the deck, with the wheelhouse over them, with portholes removed to let the sound out, and the hull underneath is boxed to make the soundbox. I agree, its not ideal, but this is now a couple of years old, and things have come on now so I am sure it can be better, but when the boat is relatively close, at a moderate speed, the engine is playing, and I can select which sd card track I want, dialogue, music, to play over the engine sound, done setting the volume levels with audacity. I am rambling now!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XZsOMiYtpmY&list=UUkLx4hwwN0smYq3Xygyi9-g

[Coxn John]

Thanks guys, I am in talks with the supplier iv decided has half a chance of supplying what I want. I'll report on here whatever the outcome.

[GAZOU]

 

How wrong you are. If you are out on a small sailing boat at night you can hear a large ship coming for miles. If you go somewhere quiet - often dawn in summer - you can hear a big ship at several miles and/or a tug working hard or a pilot boat/ lifeboat at the same distances. Unfortunately what you hear sounds nothing like what comes out of most sound units.

By very quiet weather, without wind, cut engine, nobody speaks, we hearsa boat to several km.
All right.
Reproduce this noise divided by 48 to see ............... to hear
In workshop we shall hear the noise
In show we shall hear nothing

There are things which we can reduce, others not, it is not realistic.
But that amuses us, it is the purpose

[Tug Fanatic]

All I can say is that if you hear the tug that I referenced you would be impressed. It is very subtle & it can be overpowered by other noise, which is as it should be, but it really does add something. It is the only model boat sound that I have thought added to the illusion.

Each to his own.

[Coxn John]

Hmmm, well the position now is,  Iv got to find a recording of the noise I want, & after much hunting I haven't yet found...

[Coxn John]

I seem to have found a Rother (same engines)  Lifeboat owner prepared to fire it up on the water to do my sound effects, WOOHOO