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[NFMike]

Nuffink to do with model boats but I've argued for years that you should always leave your car in gear when parked.
Got a Safety Novice from work today advising: 'Always leave your car in car when parked'.
But I didn't know it was actually in the Highway code!

https://www.gov.uk/waiting-and-parking/parking-at-night-248-to-252
Rule 252 Parking on hills. If you park on a hill you should:

Yes, but no. The code is only talking about on a hill, not always.

[NFMike]

  Back in the 60s, when American cars had huge steel bumpers, it was nothing unusual to see one lengthening a parking space by nerfing the other cars. Bad enough with manuals, but disastrous if an auto was left in 'Park'.

But these days a lot of American autos (and probably others too) won't let you take the key out of the ignition unless it's in P.

[Mad Scientist]

Am I the only one who's noticed that the underlined bit in Martin's post reads 'Always leave your car in car when parked'?

Tom

[grasshopper]

Probably not, just the first to mention it.

[Bob K]

That item has been in the highway code for some time, and refers to hills, the like of which are common in parts of Cornwall and elsewhere. To do anything else with modern parking brakes would be inviting trouble.  Since dual circuit brake hydraulics have been accepted as the secondary braking system the mechanical version seems to have been downgraded from a handbrake to a parking brake.  Often these only twist the rear shoes giving very little real brake effect.

Having reasonable mechanical empathy with your machine it is natural to depress the clutch on starting to save dragging half the transmission round too.  My pet gripe is people who wear out their parking brake ratchet by clunk-clunking the mechanism instead of using the button provided. A worn out ratchet pawl will fail to hold the brake one day.

[Colin Bishop]

My pet gripe is people who wear out their parking brake ratchet by clunk-clunking the mechanism instead of using the button provided. A worn out ratchet pawl will fail to hold the brake one day.

I have had cars where the handbook tells you to do exactly that - to operate the automatic adjusting mechanism!

Colin

[NFMike]

I have had cars where the handbook tells you to do exactly that - to operate the automatic adjusting mechanism!

Colin

Of those who actually have a handbook and know where and what it is, how many do you think have actually read it? 

[Captain Povey]

I used to live in a house with a sloping drive. One day my neighbour from across the road called and asked why I had parked on his drive. When I went outside sure enough my car's handbrake had lost its grip and the car had rolled off my drive crossed the road and stopped on his.  Now I always park a manual transmission in gear and turn the wheels to the appropriate side. I now live on a steep hill and definitely apply hand brakes, turn wheels and leave in gear. Its belt, braces and safety pins for me. I have been thinking of modelling some wheel chocks too.  Graham

[dpbarry]

mine was an old ex mot centre parcel van, we figured it had been round the clock 2 maybe 3 times, and it had a tappett that would wander out of adjustment at a whim, I remember pulling up at the side of the road, leaving the engine running and taking the rocker cover off, tweaking the tappett by ear, rocker cover back on and back under way, in less time than it just took to type this.
Grendel

Ahhh!!  The good auld OHV. 


Declan

[john44]

I usually buy Toyota / Lexus cars and all the ones I've had recently (last 6 years)  can't be started without the clutch pedal being depressed or if it's an automatic, the brake pedal pressed.



To start my Toyota Verso The clutch pedal has to be depressed before you can press the start button.
Just wish I could hear the indicator when it flashes.


John

[html]

Hello.
With quite a few modern cars the handbrake operates the foot brake pistons in the rear calipers so when parking up you should actually press and hold the footbrake on and apply the handbrake at the same time otherwise the handbrake holds the pistons on a hot warm disc which then contracts as it cools ant gets thinner but the pistons stay where they were and the grip is lost and the car rolls off if not in gear.
In San Fransisco USA there are officials who go around checking parked cars and if you have not got you wheels turned into the kerb you will get a fine.
Saw that last time i was there.
Regards sub.

In parts of San Fransisco they have to park at 90 degrees to the kerb, otherwise they are fined

Brian

[html]

My C4 Picasso has to have its brake pedal pushed and be in neutral to start and an automatic brake, which applies as soon as the engine is turned off and releases when I start to accelerate. I can manually apply the  handbrake if I am waiting on a hill, it then releases automatically when I start off again.


Brian

[tobyker]

FWIW Suzuki motorbikes won't start unless the clutch is in and the sidestand up.

[Tombsy]

I have a remote start in my truck that pretty common here for warming them up when it's -20C. My truck is a manual shift so you have to go through a little routine to arm it, in neutral, parking brake on, key off, then when you get out and close the door the truck shuts off and locks the doors.
So you can't leave it in gear but it's pretty flat around here lol.

[Sandy]

Yes, I do wiggle the gearstick as it happens, but of course I need to take it out of gear when I stop it so it is usually out of gear when I get back in.

Funnily enough, my current Mazda 6 is the first car I have had which requires the clutch to be depressed before it will start although I have experienced this when hiring cars abroad. I guess you get used to anything really. Quite enjoyed the auto when driving in the USA and Canada but not sure whether it would be responsive enough for typical UK traffic conditions.

Colin

An automatic car will always be quicker than a manual trans car at least in terms of acceleration.

Almost nobody can change gear manually as fast as an auto box can.

Plus, every time you shift gear in a manual car you are disengaging drive from the wheels when you depress the clutch so the car is not being driven just coasting.

The only way you can change gear fast in a manual car is not lifting off the accelerator and kicking the clutch like you kick a ball.

But that is very mechanically unsympathetic.

Which is costly.

[Colin Bishop]

True in theory but in traffic you frequently need a quick kickdown by dropping a couple of ratios to accelerate, you can do this directly in a manual but I have found that autos tend to lag in these situations, mind you they were American/Canadian cars which may not be set up the same way as European ones.

Colin

[grasshopper]

Quite agree with Colin, Automatics always seem to be a bit lacks-a-daisical when it comes to getting off the line!
I've just bought a brand new RAV4 automatic and the kickdown is always a bit on the slow side, even in the so-called 'sport' mode. The car I chopped in for it was an Avensis 2.2 manual diesel estate which was never in the wrong gear or had slow acceleration because it had a proper clutch, not a slush box and I was in complete control....
Prior to that Avensis I had a Lexus RX450h hybrid which rarely had an issue with acceleration because the electric motors kicked in and alleviated the necessity to kick down....that was a nice car, just a tad expensive.

[NFMike]

Depends on the automatic. RAV4 has a CVT which are always a bit slow to wind up, whereas a 'traditional' auto can change in a flick (though the engine still has to rev up). But most cars are set up for economy these days which never helps.
However, nearly all autos have some form of manual override, so if you really want to drive like a manual you can use that.

[grasshopper]

My RAv is the 6speed automatic, the CVT on the new model is petrol engine only I think.
The Lexus was a CVT and you're right about it winding up, but the electric motors made up for the lag.


Been playing with the paddles behind the steering wheel but I reckon its  still slower than a manual.....but then that's one of the reason I changed, getting old, lazy and shouldn't be charging around everywhere at a gazillion miles an hour!

[pugwash]

Had RAV4's since the long wheelbase model came out about 95 - never let me down and could
always be started without depressing the clutch.  'Course they are all manuals not old mens
autos.  Best cars I've ever had(except for fuel consumption)  Always parked in gear - or they would end up through my neighbours house wall across the road - quite a steep hill round here.

Geoff

[Sandy]

Well, I have driven lots of automatic American cars and quite a few manuals and an auto will hands down hammer a manual into the ground.

An auto will kick down one, two or even three gears in the time it takes you to push your accelerator foot to the floor.

It will have changed gear and be accelerating by the time you start moving the manual gear lever wondering which gear would be best for the overtaking manoeuvre all the while the clutch is disengaged and the engine has dropped off to idle because you have lifted off the accelerator as well.

As for getting off the line, hold the auto against the brake, load up the torque convertor, lift brake foot, stomp accelerator foot....and you are gone. If you haven't gone, you are spinning the tyres, so lift accelerator, let the tyres hook up, press again.

In a manual, build revs, are they enough to avoid a bog when the clutch comes out, not sure, give it some more, step off clutch, bang, what happened there?

In a manual, build revs, are they enough to avoid a bog when the clutch comes out, not sure, give it some more, release clutch gently, slip, slip, clutch out, more revs, more revs, hang on need to change gear, clutch in, off accelerator, move lever, clutch out, back on accelerator... where's the other guy gone...

[Colin Bishop]

Well in Canada last year, driving a Ford Fusion (new Mondeo) putting my foot hard down produced only a very leisurely response.

Colin

[Bob K]

In just over a year, when I will have to renew my UK driving licence every three years and get my Doctor's OK each time, I may have to consider one of those automatic things, or even an electric pavement-legal single seater.
The later are poorly equipped to transport model boats.

Not everyone can cope with automatics.  See https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v9t3XBXmtgQ

[html]

In America last year the Honda Versa I had was terrible for acceleration, which is unusual for an American car they are usually like rockets  when you start off. My C4 Picasso which is a 2.0ltr is very quick away in fact too quick, spinning the wheels is very easy in it even fully loaded with passengers. It does have some paddles under the steering wheel for manual driving, it is not so quick using them I presume because of human reaction time.

Brian

[grasshopper]

Thing is about auto' boxes, they probably react very well to an input but a decent driver will already be in the right gear by virtue of seeing a potential situation and being prepared for it.


In an over taking situation for example, you assess the space and speed required for the manoeuvre, select the gear in preparation and when the times right accelerate and go. In full auto mode you see the same space, hit kick down, wait for it and possibly crap your pants....


Formula 1 cars aren't full auto's, don't think NASCAR racers are either....must be a good reason for it?