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Author Topic: Staircase or ship? ( Dazzle paint )  (Read 6687 times)

Brian60

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Staircase or ship? ( Dazzle paint )
« on: March 26, 2015, 08:28:14 PM »

Was this taking dazzle paint too far?  %% .....

Martin [Admin]

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Re: Staircase or ship?
« Reply #1 on: March 26, 2015, 09:19:42 PM »


Effective though!
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meechingman

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Re: Staircase or ship?
« Reply #2 on: March 26, 2015, 09:43:09 PM »

Striking, but I assume that's in drab greys, black and white, unlike what they've done up in Liverpool to the Edmund Gardner and the Snowdrop.
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tigertiger

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Re: Staircase or ship?
« Reply #3 on: March 27, 2015, 03:00:12 AM »

Striking, but I assume that's in drab greys, black and white, unlike what they've done up in Liverpool to the Edmund Gardner and the Snowdrop.


Not sure.
I thought, but stand to be corrected, that on purpose of 'Dazzle' camouflage was to disguise the speed and direction of travel, making if hard for gunners and torpedo operators to plot bearings. If that is the case the ship being visible would not be a problem, and drab would not be needed.


BTW this is purely speculation on my part.
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malcolmfrary

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Re: Staircase or ship?
« Reply #4 on: March 27, 2015, 09:19:26 AM »

There was a mass of theories in the various navies.  Looking back, any scheme that aimed to confuse range finding told the other navies what your navy thought they were using for rangefinding.  Some interesting stuff here - http://io9.com/an-illustrated-history-of-unbelievably-camouflaged-ship-676257937
Schemes could vary on what the perceived threat was, the estimated level of ability of the opposition, the theater, in some cases, the assumed preferred time of day of going into action (Mountbatten Pink?) and what type of confusion was wanted.  Some camo could be used to disguise the type of ship, or even if it was a ship in the first place.
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meechingman

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Re: Staircase or ship?
« Reply #5 on: March 27, 2015, 08:21:45 PM »

My point was that what they've done up in Liverpool is hideous, in the name of 'modern art'. I'm sure any gunnery officer would have given orders to 'shoot at that ruddy coloured thing over there!'
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malcolmfrary

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Re: Staircase or ship?
« Reply #6 on: March 27, 2015, 10:43:05 PM »

My point was that what they've done up in Liverpool is hideous, in the name of 'modern art'. I'm sure any gunnery officer would have given orders to 'shoot at that ruddy coloured thing over there!'
Agreed, but one problem is that to hit the hideously decorated eyesore at any distance you need to get its range, if it moves under all that paint, you have to plot it to guess where your shells should be landing.  Another problem is that colour photography did not exist during WW1, so all of the coloured pictures are at best B/W with colour added later, with unknown accuracy but probably much closer that the modern "artist". 
I can only hope that the gunnery officer could be persuaded to direct his attention to the present day artist.  With the reputation of RN gunnery officers, this could involve either shellfire or cannibalism.  Since I am more inclined to believe the artists of the day, either outcome would be satisfactory.
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meechingman

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Re: Staircase or ship?
« Reply #7 on: March 27, 2015, 11:02:35 PM »

I can only hope that the gunnery officer could be persuaded to direct his attention to the present day artist.  With the reputation of RN gunnery officers, this could involve either shellfire or cannibalism.  Since I am more inclined to believe the artists of the day, either outcome would be satisfactory.


 :-)) :}
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dodes

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Re: Staircase or ship?
« Reply #8 on: March 29, 2015, 04:10:56 PM »

Dazzle paint scheme was never intended as camouflage, but to make the vessel stand out and confuse the eye of the opposition as to what he is seeing and apparently they did use at times some pretty weird colours.
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tigertiger

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Re: Staircase or ship? ( Dazzle paint )
« Reply #9 on: March 30, 2015, 02:02:18 AM »

Various color schemes found on line.
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tigertiger

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Re: Staircase or ship? ( Dazzle paint )
« Reply #10 on: March 30, 2015, 02:07:58 AM »

Here are some more. These are highly stylized prints but show how the eye would be confused.
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tigertiger

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Re: Staircase or ship? ( Dazzle paint )
« Reply #11 on: March 30, 2015, 02:18:36 AM »

Some that will make you ask question
What is it?


How many ships?


How big are they (see both images)? This question would really affect ranging.
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colin t

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Painting Challenge
« Reply #12 on: April 02, 2015, 08:00:05 AM »

Here is a challenge, who will be the first to build and paint the refurbished Liverpool Ferry SNOWDROP.


Come on you Liverpool lads.  :embarrassed: :-))
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imsinking

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Re: Painting Challenge
« Reply #13 on: April 02, 2015, 10:12:52 AM »

And for anyone who doesn't know . . . .


The ferry in question . . .

Must have been smokin' some good stuff . . .  %%


Personally I like a possible Royal Navy interpretation . . . .

Via an imaging program . . . . O0 
Bill
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Martin [Admin]

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Re: Staircase or ship? ( Dazzle paint )
« Reply #14 on: April 02, 2015, 10:13:15 AM »


Ferry across the Mersey:
  http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-32158049

Liverpool's 'Dazzle ship' opens to public to mark WW1 centenary



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Arrow5

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Re: Painting Challenge
« Reply #15 on: April 02, 2015, 10:43:18 AM »

I agree, the artist`s interpretation is far from WW1, more like a 1960/70`s hippy Volkswagen Combi, only missing the flower motif and a peace symbol.   The accommodation ship in Orkney does it better.
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meechingman

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Re: Painting Challenge
« Reply #16 on: April 02, 2015, 03:09:51 PM »

I agree, the artist`s interpretation is far from WW1, more like a 1960/70`s hippy Volkswagen Combi, only missing the flower motif and a peace symbol.


I think you've got something there. Thinking of what they (not me, I was far too young-honest!) were smoking back then, maybe the person responsible had some left over.....  :D



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Colin Bishop

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Re: Staircase or ship? ( Dazzle paint )
« Reply #17 on: April 02, 2015, 03:36:11 PM »

I think the 'artist' who also apparently designed the Sgt Pepper album sleeve, is just using it as a excuse to indulge his ego.

On the other hand, painting a Mersey ferry in a scheme which makes it difficult to tell in which direction it is travelling might not altogether be a good idea....

Colin
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malcolmfrary

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Re: Staircase or ship? ( Dazzle paint )
« Reply #18 on: April 02, 2015, 08:39:36 PM »

 Just hope that there's never an insurance accident.  "What colour was it?"........."Can you blow in this bag for me, 'Sir'?"
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Re: Staircase or ship? ( Dazzle paint )
« Reply #19 on: April 03, 2015, 01:43:39 AM »

Actually, if dazzle is to confuse gunnery, range finding, then the Snowdrop has failed. They have very helpfully painted a target on the side. %)
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derekwarner

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Re: Staircase or ship? ( Dazzle paint )
« Reply #20 on: April 03, 2015, 02:02:48 AM »

Once read an article.....that suggested the inspiration and basic concept of the Sgt Pepper album sleeve was 100% Lennon...which I didn't find difficult to accept ;)..... Derek
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McGherkin

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Re: Staircase or ship? ( Dazzle paint )
« Reply #21 on: April 03, 2015, 01:25:09 PM »

You don't really want the dazzle paintjob to be too effective on that ferry though. Whilst it may have helped stop submarines in the war from telling where you are going, it would also help a modern day skipper have heart failure when he realised that the ferry was actually approaching him instead of going away!
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dodes

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Re: Staircase or ship? ( Dazzle paint )
« Reply #22 on: April 04, 2015, 08:17:33 PM »

You have to give it to them, only a scouser would paint their local ferry so colourful.
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dave301bounty

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Re: Staircase or ship? ( Dazzle paint )
« Reply #23 on: April 13, 2015, 10:14:57 PM »

You would,nt believe the controversy this has caused amongst the Merchant Navy assosiations, its not in keeping ,definitely out of line ...
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