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Author Topic: Card construction vessels  (Read 7199 times)

warspite

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Card construction vessels
« on: April 14, 2015, 01:36:47 PM »

 %)  I have been reading the excellent SD14 card model and i am blown away by the detail of something that - unless it is photographed, it is lost to viewing when the vessel is completed.  :-)
So - many many years ago - about 20 now i think about it, i started to build my version of the castle class corvette - but a convert -i.e. the premise was a corvette resurrected from the scrap yard and converted into a deep see rescue ship for the 70's / 80's, where as i was a little impacient and decided that instead of plotting out multitudes of points for loads of frames i would take several and plot only where the decks met the hull - less the thickness of the percieved hull and cut out frames from heavy duty card.
One initially covered with card ranging from that used to package the usual yearly christmas calanders received from suppliers and the back of the ruled A4 pads it was coated with cascamit glue, with the intension of doing a final skin later, thing is - nows later as far as the hull is concerned, being in a wardrobe, some damage has occured to the bow, so a rethink needs to be done.
one thought is to resculpt the bow and stern by using this existing shape and packing it out and curving it off the existing hull in a plank on frame manner using - cereal boxes, this will come apparent later. (by the way victory is on hold).
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warspite

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Re: Card construction vessels
« Reply #1 on: April 14, 2015, 01:38:48 PM »

and here is a couple of more views
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warspite

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Re: Card construction vessels
« Reply #2 on: April 14, 2015, 01:44:57 PM »

so the questions i am probably going to ask later are related to sealing the outside of the card against rotting in water, and then the stability and ways of removing that annoying problm with ABS/plasticard when it is subjected to that rare but bright ball in the sky, ie breakdown of the polymer bonds.
I have constructed the upper works - sort of - and a photo will be forthcoming when i get a chance.
it will use a visiting helo and I want to have a working deployment system for the recovery of other vessels, like a rubber ball dropped onto the vessel and then it can tow in.
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Colin Bishop

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Re: Card construction vessels
« Reply #3 on: April 14, 2015, 05:47:35 PM »

Working card models date back many years, to the 1950s at least. At that time the favoured sealing material was model aircraft dope as it was thin enough to 'wet out' the card and make it waterproof. I believe Glynn Guest still uses this method successfully. Applying something like epoxy would probably only provide a surface coating and if this was scratched or damaged the water could get behind it. Sometimes the old ways are the best!

Colin
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Howard

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Re: Card construction vessels
« Reply #4 on: April 14, 2015, 06:27:09 PM »

Warspite,
Look at Carlmt,s SD14 and am going to do it the same way on my SD14 he used 0.4mm ply then a coat of epoxy resin on tissue f/glass  he made sure the ply was well stuck to the card  and he,s had no prolems.
                    Regards Howard.
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carlmt

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Re: Card construction vessels
« Reply #5 on: April 15, 2015, 12:07:54 AM »

Another angle to take on this............
 
You have already 'skinned' your hull with card, so adding a layer of ply on this would be excessive.  On the SD14's, the ply hull shell plating replaced the kit supplied card version, and it was this that was coated in glass tissue and resin.
 
A number of years ago, we built a sailing version of the Bremen liner.  This was a completely card-built model - no plastic or wood at all - and to waterproof the hull we used Rustins furniture varnish.  It dries to an extremely tough finish and is totally impervious to water.  If you leave your model in the water too long, however, the hull does go slightly 'leathery', but once it dries it reverts to a very tough finish.  It does have some flexibility too, so there is no danger of cracking.
 

 

 

plastic

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Re: Card construction vessels
« Reply #6 on: April 15, 2015, 08:05:49 AM »

Bremen is lovely - although the pictures seem to make it grow - it looks about 1/400 in the first pic, 1/200 in the second and 1/96 in the 3rd  %%
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warspite

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Re: Card construction vessels
« Reply #7 on: April 15, 2015, 04:50:14 PM »

"xxxxx" - is that the quality I have to aspire to - "xxxxx"  >>:-(

here is a couple of pictures of the super structure
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warspite

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Re: Card construction vessels
« Reply #8 on: April 15, 2015, 04:50:58 PM »

and the next couple, the superstructure is from plasticard or whatever this is.
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warspite

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Re: Card construction vessels
« Reply #9 on: April 15, 2015, 04:56:52 PM »

the idea was to make the inside a bit of a diorama as well with a dsrv in the hanger, with decompression chamber etc, externally she would have the same radar layout as a batch 22, but this was planned in the red plastic rod and will be changed to the brass rod when I start the structure later, the chopper on deck will be a seaking with lights and working rotor, may have to break in to the bridge to add crew, and tidy up the forward face.
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warspite

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Re: Card construction vessels
« Reply #10 on: April 17, 2015, 04:19:55 PM »

And here is the visiting helo, its a 1/72nd airfix seaking in MK2 format, it has working main rotor, and the underside and tail lights work, the doors closed because this hides the 555 chip led controller and the main motor, in the random caption comp, the Mr motorvator has I think a similar motor - not sure - an M2?????, will post the result in a minute
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warspite

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Re: Card construction vessels
« Reply #11 on: April 17, 2015, 04:23:46 PM »

Sorry - a 130 - although a little more rounded
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ballastanksian

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Re: Card construction vessels
« Reply #12 on: April 21, 2015, 09:43:18 PM »

Lookin good:O) I like the finish on the Seaking.

Future polish gets alot of mention in the modelling press as a good pre weathering surface, but if it helps keep even  card model waterproof then it has even more properties.

TTFN, Ian.
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warspite

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Re: Card construction vessels
« Reply #13 on: April 25, 2015, 10:26:13 AM »

Currently the hull is still not finished, the idea is to plate it even more and as I start the process will put more photo's on as they happen, in the mean time here are the 3 main items in situe.
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warspite

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Re: Card construction vessels
« Reply #14 on: April 25, 2015, 10:47:00 AM »

The double bottom that was created is actually not square to the deck, when she is upside down, one side is lower than the other, so I will have to look at the possibility of building a section on this to bring it in line with the other side, though it may not be worth it, she is only a test bed for the concept, she was in fact conceived as a recovery vessel - just looking like a DSRV - rather than a tug.
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warspite

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Re: Card construction vessels
« Reply #15 on: April 26, 2015, 01:02:06 PM »

well here is the start of the bow and the reshaping its getting  :}
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warspite

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Re: Card construction vessels
« Reply #16 on: April 26, 2015, 01:51:51 PM »

Right, to start a line was drawn on the card up the centre, at the base the rule was used to allow for the scoring i.e. the first 20-30mm was folded up to give a defined starting point, when this was positioned at the base of the hull the line was positioned with that on the deck and the sides allowed to fold naturally around the prow, until they met the number 1 frame position (which coincidently is also at the base of the bow).

Using a pen I marked the number 1 frame position as well ran the pen around the top of the hull as a guide, using the rule, I marked the straight line between the number 1 frame and the bottom of the line, after cutting at least 20mm on the waste side of the lines, tried the card, then the rule was used with a Stanley knife along the No. 1 frame lines, checked it again.

Using evo-stick multi purpose contact adhesive applied to the hulls leading edge and along the centre line of the card, this was let for a couple of minutes before being fitted and pressed into place, it was left for a couple of minutes for the adhesive to get a grip.

I applied some contact adhesive to the top and bottom edges of the card and hull at the No. 1 frame and folded the card back - then I realised I had not created a way of holding them to the No.1 points, so out came the string and a frantic couple of minutes getting the string on and the points touching. I then decided to fill the rear edge of the right side with approximately 20mm wide strips of card along the outer edge, as you can see the rule eventually was used to keep this edge straight between the top and bottom of the hull, until the glue sticks, the space between the bow and the 20mm edge was filled with pieces of card cut into triangles and slid in.

Hopefully this will be strong enough to take any knocks in use, will probably look for a penatrating resin later, now will need to do the same for the other side, when the rule will be available, oh - pieces were cut to try and remove the low spot between no.1 and 2 frames (I think there was another frame between but its not defined to be able to see it).

Just released the right side and set up for the left - will see how that goes later on.
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warspite

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Re: Card construction vessels
« Reply #17 on: April 26, 2015, 05:46:20 PM »

Well its later and the left side is done  - sort of - as the pictures show the leading edge bit went better than the right, but the infill did not, need a few more pieces to be inserted, so but for a small step up on the bow when I plate the deck this is pretty much as I wanted it, plating the middle section next will be a challenge as this will need to emulate the leading edges of the bow, this time creating a fold over for the deck, I am in two minds as to whether to do cut outs in the side for companion ways, but I have to have a think about the best way of doing it so it looks good.

On reflection the companion ways will need to be cut before I plate the middle section, as this will allow me to plate over if it does not work, so I will need to do some research  :D.
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ballastanksian

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Re: Card construction vessels
« Reply #18 on: April 27, 2015, 09:49:57 PM »

The penetrating resin will be essential to make the hull water tight but will have the advantage of giving you a good solid structure onto which you can build.

Thanks for the update.
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warspite

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Re: Card construction vessels
« Reply #19 on: May 04, 2015, 03:27:11 PM »

Here is this weeks update, Saturdays weather was not that good, so didn't do anything, but Sunday fitted the forward right side middle section to the centreline along the bottom, today did the infill at the bow, Sunday however had a little accident and knock over the tin of adhesive, got most of it back in the tin, but spent ages sorting that out.
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warspite

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Re: Card construction vessels
« Reply #20 on: May 04, 2015, 03:30:27 PM »

The two strips of card are so the string does not stick, I had to do the underside bit separately, its a little rough but this is skin 2 of 4, hopefully 3 and 4 will be better. Skin 2 is to create the modified shape from skin 1, 3 and 4 will be to finish her off and provide the safety rail etc.
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ballastanksian

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Re: Card construction vessels
« Reply #21 on: May 04, 2015, 11:14:23 PM »

She's coming on well.
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warspite

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Re: Card construction vessels
« Reply #22 on: May 05, 2015, 03:28:19 PM »

Photo 31a, shows the problem with trying to be clever, need to fill in the join and stick it down before the next layer goes on.
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warspite

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Re: Card construction vessels
« Reply #23 on: May 06, 2015, 03:50:35 PM »

Any recomendations for a penatrating resin, after the string was removed, she looked ok just need to create the same on the other side now.
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ballastanksian

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Re: Card construction vessels
« Reply #24 on: May 08, 2015, 12:23:37 AM »

Glynn Guest uses thinned cellulose dope to penetrate balsa and card elements of his models followed by neat dope as a hardening and surface medium. It might not do as good a job filling gaps though.

A quick look on Google suggests there are numerous penetrating resins for wood and also Epoxy and fibreglass resins that do the same.

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