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Author Topic: Coastal range ex-Smit-tug  (Read 70407 times)

Hande

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Coastal range ex-Smit-tug
« on: January 27, 2016, 03:57:09 PM »

This is the header post of my build.


Based on Billing Boats BB528 (Smit Nederlands), I have started a modified vessel - sister ship of Smit Nederland - ex-Smit Finland, ex-Finland, now UREKA XIV (St Vincent and Grenadines, Malabo, Morocco), IMO 7800473.


I have started by following the instructions of Billing Boats. Turns out there are different versions of the instructions and the part list. So I have hardly begun, when I have had to interpret, and adopt. That's a lot of fun, however.


I have assembled the Becker rudders out of 29 parts each. I am practicing air brush painting with them (Model Color brass).
The props nozzles are installed into the hull with glue (I am really hoping I chose the correct glue!).
The rudder supports (assembled out of 7 parts each) are installed to the prop nozzles (again, did I choose the correct glue?).
The prop shaft pipe supports are installed into the hull in the right positions (I am most surprised about being able to get them right in one shot!).
The anchor chain pipes are tentatively in position (wondering, where I should cut them...).
I have cut and filed the main deck to fit the hull. Gluing ABS to the plywood of the main deck is my main nightmare right now! I'm feeling, if I mess up with that joint, the whole project in in jeopardy. Today, I found a PU glue that says it's especially good for my purpose.


So, this the status, today.


I have conducted research on glues, paints and other. It seems that in almost every step, I have finally ended up with a sub-optimal solution. I suddenly realise it's good to make notes - why not in this forum, to be sure - so as not to repeate mistakes, or at least avoid some of the extra work that I have already spent, in my next project... Heureka! In following posts, you will find my notes. I am eager to see some feedback!


Ok - next I will study how to post some pictures, here. Hold on a minute...











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Hande

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Re: Coastal range ex-Smit-tug
« Reply #1 on: January 27, 2016, 06:03:41 PM »

NOTE-Rudders.


This particular version comes with a 29-part solution for each rudder. Being as laborious as it is, there is good reason to deliver them in one piece.


Remarks:
- the pieces are acrylic. I used CA to the best of my ability, but still several seams had to be glued again after them breaking. Now, I'm afraid they will break some time later.
- I managed to fit everything so as to allow the rudder to work properly - with some sweat, to be sure.
- To make the Becker-function work, a small brass thread had to be fitted into the tiny upmost bit, which required drilling with high precision. turned out that my dremel is so fast that the speed of the drill _melted_ the plastic! I spent just too much time drilling the on the other rudder and the whole thing was almost lost. The other one went ok. With pathcing and adjusting the rudder seems to work, but it is not pretty. After the paint work and some bending of the thread, the functionality was retained and it doesn't look too bad. The melted portion being hidden under the hull, I decided that I will live with it. May be, allowing time, even forget..?




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Hande

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Re: Coastal range ex-Smit-tug
« Reply #2 on: January 27, 2016, 06:33:54 PM »

NOTE-Bottom of the hull inside


The instructions say a strip has to be glued in the bottom. Then a sole plate is to be attached.
Since I have no idea about the best method of attaching the sole plate, I leave is loose as long as I can. I don't have the plan ready for the electricals, so I don't know, what kind of room I'm going to need for the assembly of the engine room.


Note my clever three-legged spider that presses the strip down for glueing. There is a block of lead to provide the pressure.
Here, I used Loctite's hybrid glue, and after it having cured, sanitary silicone to keep inevitable water from getting to the strip.


Remarks (or questions that I ask myself, rather):
- Should I have made the bottom strip waterproof before glueing it into the hull?
- Is silicone good in this case?
- Is the hybrid glue the right choice? (this question is because I used that glue in an other place with unsatisfactory results - see a later post)
- How SHOULD the sole plate be attached? Simply glue (I'm thinking waterproof Gorilla wood glue)?
- Why does Billing Boats not suggest provisions to support the main deck?





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Brian60

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Re: Coastal range ex-Smit-tug
« Reply #3 on: January 27, 2016, 07:05:22 PM »

The Beckers look nice, but I think I would have used the correct acrylic bonding agent rather than superglue.

Hande

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Re: Coastal range ex-Smit-tug
« Reply #4 on: January 27, 2016, 07:36:19 PM »

Thanks Brian60.
The thing is - after days of research, I concluded that cyanoacrylate IS the correct one. Sigh...

Now that I searched "acrylic bonding agent" I came to the right place. May be this was a terminology issue? I was just looking for "glue" and "acrylic". Billing didn't use your term in the instructions...

I will append the information into my note.
And everytime a rudder snaps, I will use the correct stuff. I wonder if I'm going to do that 52 times.


btw.
I have learned that not all chemicals are equally available in different countries.
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Hande

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Re: Coastal range ex-Smit-tug
« Reply #5 on: January 28, 2016, 04:57:08 PM »

NOTE-Aligning the driving gear


I'm sure Billing Boats have deliberated on the different materials, but this particular choice caused me headache.
The propeller nozzels are glued with Bostik Grab Adhesive. If I had found the Polyurethan glue at that time, I would have used it.
At any rate, Bostik seems to stick very well.


The rudder support is made of 7 parts each. I learned a lot by assembling, attaching them to the prop nozzles and finishing them with putty. A lot of pain, too.


I was really afraid to install the prop shaft tube supports (I wonder what the official term is...). If I would miss the alignment, I would have had to make new holes and all the rest of the repair work. The hole assy would move after the supports were installed and I thought about it for two days, how to foresee that movement and have the whole assy land in the correct position. I found no scientific method so I did it by trusting my eye and hand. - It went well, thank you very much...


Now everything is nicely aligned. THe prop shaft requires tiny adjustment sideways, but I can do it while achoring the shaft tubes on the inside.


Couldn't be happier about this minor success!


Any opinions about the painting of the rudders? Brass color looks really nice, but in every model that I have seen, the rudders are painted the same color as the hull (antifouling red). I know that it's the reality, too. One doesn't want sea creatures attach themselves on the rudders. So am I vain in the wrong way, if I go with brass and neglect the reality of marine equipment maintenance?



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Brian60

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Re: Coastal range ex-Smit-tug
« Reply #6 on: January 28, 2016, 06:11:54 PM »

How you paint it is entirely up to you. To be a true replica of the ship then it should be antifouling red. But if you want to interpret it as brass then do so. What I would say is that in real life the rudders would be made of steel, only the propellors would be made of bronze not brass, although I'm sure many ships now have even propellors made of steel for cheapness.

I'll just touch back on the acrylic. using superglue what actually happens is the two sides of the rudder stay as two sides with a layer of glue holding them together in the centre - a bit like a sandwich with two slices of bread and a slice of ham in the middle.

Acrylic bonding agent or weld as it is also known actually melts a micro layer of each side of the rudder, as the weld/bond agent evaporates (it only takes a few seconds) the two micro layers fuse together forming just one piece of acrylic not two. I hope this explains the advantage to you.

Hande

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Re: Coastal range ex-Smit-tug
« Reply #7 on: January 28, 2016, 07:11:24 PM »

Of course! Steel - not bronze. Even less brass - how stupid of me! I _was_ thinking of bronze (I confused brass for bronze. Sorry about my poor English...).
So painting the rudders in _brass_ makes even less sense. No matter how pretty.

Let's see how they will turn out. I'll sleep on it.
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Hande

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Re: Coastal range ex-Smit-tug
« Reply #8 on: January 31, 2016, 09:16:51 AM »

NOTE-Twin propeller spin direction


I switched the propellers across (in my picture they are wrong, I figure). I have understood that they should spin inwards (when forward), obviously countering their rotating directions. The kit came with a right spin and a left spin propeller.


What is the contemporary wisdom about this matter - anyone?



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Brian60

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Re: Coastal range ex-Smit-tug
« Reply #9 on: January 31, 2016, 09:49:14 AM »

On a standard tug hull viewed from the rear, the left would turn clockwise and the right would turn anticlockwise. This tends to suck/make  the aft end squat down in the water and so enhances pulling power.

On an open aft hull, such as an anchor handling tug (my avatar or the link in my signature for posh venture) they turn the opposites, left turns anticlockwise, right turns clockwise. This doesn't make the aft squat so much. If the rear end squats too far on these the workdeck floods with water even more than it does under normal conditions, such that the ship could become un-manouverable.

Of course real life doesn't always equate to models, so unless you are going to enter tug towing contests, then it really doesn't matter as long as they turn opposite to each other, ie not two left props or two right props.

Hande

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Re: Coastal range ex-Smit-tug
« Reply #10 on: January 31, 2016, 12:59:58 PM »

I'm sure, the direction of the spins wouldn't matter in my model.
On the other hand, I like to think of it as a miniature of a real thing.
I leave the propellers according to your first configuration (left clockwise, right anticlockwise).
Thank you!
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derekwarner_decoy

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Re: Coastal range ex-Smit-tug
« Reply #11 on: January 31, 2016, 01:23:49 PM »

Hande......one point you may wish to review is the outside diameter and profile of the propeller blades compared to the inner diameter of the nozzle

The design concept here of improved thrust is relative to the velocity of water through the mouth of the nozzle and the redirected turbulence that is created by the close diametrical clearance between the propeller & the nozzle

You will also find that propeller blade geometry is vastly different when used with nozzles.......in that the tip of each blade is flattened out to blend in with the profile of the nozzle ID or bore

To call a spade a spade ...the propeller's you show here [image 4633] with the nozzles you depict would have near ZERO thrust benefit over the propeller's alone >>:-(

Apart from that, your build and detail as shown to date is of first class construction :-))

Keep us posted with many more images ......Derek
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Brian60

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Re: Coastal range ex-Smit-tug
« Reply #12 on: January 31, 2016, 03:44:29 PM »

While what Derek says is true for hydro dyamics and waterflow through the nozzles, it is not always followed in real life.  The first photo here shows simply what Derek means, the tips of the blads are flattened so as to follow the nozzles closely so enhancing thrust.

The second one shows also that a lot ships 'followed fashion' in that they put Kort nozzles on but were quite happy with the thrust of ordinary propellors inside of them..

Hande

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Re: Coastal range ex-Smit-tug
« Reply #13 on: February 01, 2016, 11:26:56 AM »

It would be interesting to see a picture of Smit Nederland's or sister ship's propellors.
I would like to bet that Billing boats had no concern about thrust efficiency when selecting the propellers for the kit.
The ones that came with the kit are 3-blade and generally are just regular propellers.


I suppose changing the propellers at a later stage is merely a question of buying them. No technical obstacles?

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Re: Coastal range ex-Smit-tug
« Reply #14 on: February 01, 2016, 12:29:07 PM »

Looking at the photo of the props I did not realise how poxy the Billing ones are, might change for some modified plastic four blades.
Steve.
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Brian60

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Re: Coastal range ex-Smit-tug
« Reply #15 on: February 01, 2016, 12:44:41 PM »

Looking at the photo of the props I did not realise how poxy the Billing ones are, might change for some modified plastic four blades.
Steve.

I just looked at the last image. I hadn't noticed just how poorly they fitted the nozzles. They are far from correct. Even using standard 174 pattern props, the tips should just be missing the inside of the nozzle. The pair above look to be 146 pattern used on large ships up to around 1960 then superceded by better style. You could use those props but then take off the nozzles. I would put them to one side for use on something else and buy a larger pair.

I'll see if I can turn up a photo of the props fitted to the Smit.

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Re: Coastal range ex-Smit-tug
« Reply #16 on: February 01, 2016, 03:12:52 PM »


HELLO Hande, I also built from scratch the smit nederland. Here's how I solved the problem of the rudders and backer of kort rings.


I drew with autocad the pieces that make up the helm baker. In practice I did sliced horizontally the helm in 10 layers. I made 5 layers with a profile with the hole for the hinge and 5 layers with a profile without hole for the hinge. Then I glued the layers one on 'more to get the shape of the rudder. The parts were laser cut from a sheet of plexglas 5 mm thick. Always plexigals I made the blanket perforated laser, replacing the wood as it is more 'easy to finish and waterproofed.











Some photos of the details of the rudder baker. I've made using a piece of a brass zipper and brass rods from advanced kit rotterdam

















kort rings are used to increase the power of thrust of the propellers. I made them realize plastic by an micro mechanics. I realized the grooves with the milling cutter for the base of the rudder and the lock ring fixing to the hull. The first I realized by a square-aluminum. The second by a length of beech suitably trimmed.
Here are the pictures of what indeed said.













Greetings
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Hande

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Re: Coastal range ex-Smit-tug
« Reply #17 on: February 01, 2016, 06:07:20 PM »

Che imponente, Francesco!


Nice facilities for drilling and even laser-cutting.
So far, I am using the parts provided in the kit. The rudders are also from the Billing Boats kit.


Let's see, if I get encouraged to start a scratch build. I seem to lack proper facilities to attempt that.


Regards to Salerno!


btw. Anybody from around Genova here that wouldn't mind a visit from a fellow modelist? Just to quickly see your model. (Parlo italiano un po.)

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Re: Coastal range ex-Smit-tug
« Reply #18 on: February 01, 2016, 06:18:54 PM »


Brian


The second propeller seems to sit _outside_ the nozzle! Or is it an optical illusion?


Or, the nozzle seems to be part of the _rudder_ rather than means to increase the power of the thrust.
Seems that it's the nozzle-rudder assy that turns. The rudder is fixed to the nozzle? Better maneuverability?


This brings me to the position of the propeller inside the nozzle. - I positioned the tip of the propeller hub just at the level of the nozzle's edge (vertical) level. It seemed a sensible thing to do. Should have researched more?





While what Derek says is true for hydro dyamics and waterflow through the nozzles, it is not always followed in real life.  The first photo here shows simply what Derek means, the tips of the blads are flattened so as to follow the nozzles closely so enhancing thrust.

The second one shows also that a lot ships 'followed fashion' in that they put Kort nozzles on but were quite happy with the thrust of ordinary propellors inside of them..
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Hande

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Re: Coastal range ex-Smit-tug
« Reply #19 on: February 04, 2016, 11:40:07 PM »

 Everything plywood in this kit seems to be curved.
 After recovery from my hospitalisation I have worked on these curved parts.
 
 The plywood of the sub-deck started falling apart after another soaking in vinegar-water and extensive heating with a hot air gun. I may have to make a new one after all.
 
 The parts of the frame of the sub-deck were also curved. They are 5 mm thick so I don't plan to try to straighten them, but rather sand them so that the frame as a whole will be straight horizontally. It goes below, so some vertical skew is acceptable. I worry about the fit between the main deck and the sub-deck, now.
 
 I filled the flaws in the ABS hull with a wall paint and sanded the hull. It's getting ready for painting. Only I don't know, if I should paint the hull after I have installed the main deck, or before. Opinions anybody?
 
 While sanding the hull, one of the Kort nozzles snapped off the keel. WRONG GLUE (again). Nothing too dangerous - I glued both nozzles again with PU.
 
 - It's just... well... if model building is a series of ups and downs... this is a minor down. Sigh..!
 
 And I wanted to make everything so perfect. But now I'm already compromising with  quality. But when the parts are not high quality, I can only compromise or make new parts. I have no scratch building experience, so my new parts are not necessarily going to be better quality, either.
 
 Being a little more philosophical - What I like about this hobby, is that I can slow down or speed up as I wish. When in doubt, I sit back, study Mayhem discussions and reflect on my options. Sometimes I sleep two-three nights, before I dare continue.
 
 Besides, it's the building that's the fun part! Fortunately, I don't have to start worrying about finishing and the fun ending for a long long time ;-)

(re-paginated - admin )
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Hande

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Re: Coastal range ex-Smit-tug
« Reply #20 on: February 04, 2016, 11:50:56 PM »



I'm sure Billing Boats have deliberated on the different materials, but this particular choice caused me headache.
The propeller nozzels are glued with Bostik Grab Adhesive. If I had found the Polyurethan glue at that time, I would have used it.
At any rate, Bostik seems to stick very well.



Ha ha! NO GOOD. Bostik Grab Adhesive does not stick to ABS. In case you are considering...



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Hande

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Re: Coastal range ex-Smit-tug
« Reply #21 on: February 08, 2016, 04:18:00 PM »

After frustration with the screwed-up sub-deck (standard Billings quality, I understand) I needed a feeling of success - no matter how minor.


Here's the frame, at least. I will cut the sub-deck on a fresh sheet of plywood. Wish me luck, please!



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Re: Coastal range ex-Smit-tug
« Reply #22 on: February 08, 2016, 04:23:36 PM »

Is there a competition for the most exotic (as in weird) glueing arrangement of the deck onto the hull?  ;)
The key is the usage of blocks of lead (at the ends of the hull, covered in cloth) to tie the whole arrangement together.
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Re: Coastal range ex-Smit-tug
« Reply #23 on: February 10, 2016, 01:57:03 PM »

Sub-deck onto the main deck.


I came up with this idea after some pondering:


The supporting frame of the sub-deck is left outside the sub-deck's edge enough to fit in the triangular spaces that I left under the main deck, while having installed the cross-hull supporting rod partly visible. As you can see, the sub-deck will be well secured forward, and I will need securing fasteners only in the aft-end.


I feel good about this solution  :-)



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Re: Coastal range ex-Smit-tug
« Reply #24 on: February 11, 2016, 06:21:34 PM »

Re-enforcement below the sub-deck I felt necessary.
Provision for wireing below the deck - although not sure, what I would need to wire there. One never knows...
I thought about the wireing only after I had already glued the re-enforcement at the edge of the superstructure hole in front.





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