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Author Topic: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build  (Read 273473 times)

Canterbury Coxswain

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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #225 on: January 24, 2017, 05:13:24 pm »

Well, it's been just over two months since I have done any serious modelling and, as reported elsewhere in these pages, due to concert rehearsals with my choral society, a seven week bout of hacking cough and then 'THE virus] - went off food and drink and had to cancel Christmas Day. During the past two weeks I have had to totally tidy up my workshop and put away all the things I've used throughout the year [without putting away!!] and likewise all the new bits purchased. Finished yesterday and am well pleased and ready to start with the fitting of the water jets tomorrow. Some may say that it is all too clean and tidy, but that is the environment I work best in and it is also a New Year, so a new start, I also do military modelling [vehicles and figures] - started with 17-09 some 18 months ago - and that I will progress one day a week and the work bench needs to be very clean and tidy for the standard required at the Faversham Military Modelling Group, to see their end products is absolutely mind boggling.
So there you have it - a Happy and Prosperous New Year to each of you and a great year of modelling achievements.
I have attached a couple of shots of the workshop [some have asked what I have when I am indoors] - you will notice what I call 'the Bridge', which gives a good work area across the middle walkway, extra space gained. I have also got my milling machine mended two weeks ago by a fellow MBA-Dover member and it was that that spurred me onto clean that and then the lathe and the tidying spread out from there!
I have also attached a few photos of bolt heads and their nuts made in plastic from Meng [mine got from Scale Model Shop] and also some made in cast resin and from Russia [ mine were from MAN Models.
Finally, I got some more advice fro CupAlloys on the soldering of aluminium whilst I was at the London Model Engineering Show last Friday and purchased their low melting point [178-270 degrees C] flux cored soft solder, so will be trying that later in the week to see if it works better that my previous attempts!
Hope to Post some more later in the week.
Kim - Canterbury Coxswain

PS - !7-09 has just informed me that 16-01 is in Dover Harbour.
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Delboy1958

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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #226 on: January 24, 2017, 06:21:01 pm »

Hi Kim
So glad you are back posting I was getting withdraw shakes  :embarrassed: :embarrassed: :embarrassed:
So much so I bought another lifeboat  {-) {-)
Joined the orange and blue owners.

Del
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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #227 on: January 24, 2017, 08:12:46 pm »

You said it's been 2 months since you did a bit of boat building due to other commitments,I think you are still eating them 2 cakes you had at Warwick lol,but keep up the good work young man


Baloo
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lifeboat-Lee

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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #228 on: January 24, 2017, 10:43:25 pm »

Hi Kim,
  It's true, Del's got a new lifeboat I'm still in shock as I had to ferry it back in my car after the show on Sunday  to his house.
 I sent 17-09 a picture over on FB as I knew it would make you chuckle . {-)


 Glad your on the mend and starting back  on the Shannon as I'm working on mine and came to a halt before Christmas so looking forward to getting back on with the project over the next coming months.


Lee  :-))
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Charlie

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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #229 on: January 26, 2017, 12:49:51 pm »

Hi Kim,
Like lots of others, i'm also looking forward to seeing more of your Shannon build  :-)
I spent a very cold day in Hastings yesterday watching them trial a Shannon there for the first time, using 12-12. It did fit in the boathouse - just! I have posted a video on Twitter, if anyone is interested:
https://twitter.com/CharlieB987/status/824282393255223298
I can post some pictures here if that's ok?
Charlie
PS - 12-17 should be arriving in Dover shortly!

spongie

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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #230 on: January 26, 2017, 12:56:05 pm »

You appear to be stuck in Mersey mode!!!


13-12 & 13-17 ;)
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Charlie

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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #231 on: January 26, 2017, 01:38:04 pm »

You appear to be stuck in Mersey mode!!!


13-12 & 13-17 ;)


Lol! Yes, those are the numbers i meant. Think my brain is still frozen from yesterday. It was so cold that the mist/fog was actually freezing on the lens of my camera!

Howard

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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #232 on: January 26, 2017, 02:19:15 pm »

Just a heads up gents a new sharron Lifeboat going to Skegness on Saturday Just been on local news


                       Regards Howard.
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Charlie

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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #233 on: January 26, 2017, 02:28:57 pm »

Hi Howard,
Yes, that would be 13-17, the new Skegness Lifeboat, on her way home. Currently in Newhaven as per MarineTracker.
Charlie

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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #234 on: January 26, 2017, 04:24:37 pm »

Skegness Shannon Lifeboat 13-17  Joel and April Grunnill  arrives around 13.00Hrs on
Saturday according to Mark Holley Station Mechanic.
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Canterbury Coxswain

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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #235 on: January 26, 2017, 04:26:48 pm »

I knew I was missing something in my life - all these MBM moments!!
Derek - I had heard you were back in orange and blue mode - I trust it is the correct BS / Pantone shade of orange!! Sorry 17-09.............................
So glad that you will no longer have the shakes though, that places the responsibility back on me!
Baloo - Many thanks for your Christmas card - is was the first one to arrive! That must have been down to your lovely wife ... [rhymes with Baloo!!] - she is so different to you. Will I ever forget the cake for the 'judges'? I shall try it myself later this year.......................
Lee - glad you are still able to help the old and infirm, pity you don't live nearer me!
Charlie - Thanks for the information - please feel free to post some photos on this thread, it will be most welcome. As for the getting the pre-fix numbers wrong - join the club. When 17-09 spoke of 16-01 the other day I thought it was a Shannon. When a photo of a Tamar at Dover came my way yesterday on an email, I thought, what is he up to! Then realised it was me - ugh. Good job Spongie and Howard are out there, to keep us on the straight and narrow.

A little bit of information to go with the previous shots of plastic and resin bolt and screw heads.
Set A Large covers 1.8mm / 2.2mm / 2.6mm [six double rows of each = 35x2x6 = 420 heads of each of the afore-mentioned three sizes, which are measured across the flats.
Set B Large covers the same measurements and numbers, but have washers under the heads and nuts.
Set A Small covers 0.8mm / 1.00mm / 1.4mm [six rows of each = 40x2x6 = 480 heads of each of the three sizes.
Set B Small covers the same measurements and numbers, but have washers under the heads and nuts.
Set C has 1.3mm / 1.5mm / 1.7mm circular rim with an 'allen key' insert hole - same numbers as in Set A Large above.
Set D has 0.8mm / 1.0mm / 1.4mm circular rivets with similar numbers - the spikes tops on the other side are 1.3mm / 1.5mm / 1.7mm

The MasterClub resin bolt head on washers are 1.6mm for 100 items - code MC435069 with MC435079 being the same but nut on washer for other side. The spherical rivets are 1.8mm for 100. There are other sizes, but these suit one of my models. Look at MAN Models website.

Hope to be posting yesterday's little bit of forward progress in marking up the transom area for the fitting of the water-jets later on tonight.

Kim




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Charlie

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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #236 on: January 26, 2017, 08:42:08 pm »

Here is a small selection of photos from Yesterday's Shannon trials at Hastings.

Canterbury Coxswain

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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #237 on: January 26, 2017, 10:20:59 pm »

Charlie,
Many thanks, those are some really great photos and plenty of detail for some of the stern/transom information required. I must get down there sometime soon to have a look at her and see if there are any small differences [think I have spotted one - the circular hatch lock down mechanisms on each corner appear all black/NATO black - very dark grey].
If you get more, do feel free to post them here.
Don't forget I owe you a visit here - so while the workshop is tidy and the machines are working..........
Kim
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Canterbury Coxswain

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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #238 on: January 26, 2017, 11:27:30 pm »

Got the RNLI plans out yesterday and made a small start - took several hours, but it is going to be one of those 'measure THREE times and then cut' jobs, as I have never put water-jets in before, so want to get it right first time. There is more to rectify here [over my two shaft and props boats - in my opinion] if I get it wrong. Please, if you are building a Shannon alongside my build, and you don't agree with the way I am doing it, then ask why I am doing it and/or do what you feel best!
Now I have a full set of the RNLI plans and then a set I have had enlarged, so that I am working from a 1/12th scale set. That way I measure and make, rather than measure, calculate and make. For me the latter leaves one open to a lot more chances of making a mistake. Here is what I did:
  • measured in millimetres the distance from the centre line on the plan to the edge of the Starboard side [176mm] and then the same on the Port side [173mm] - what!!!!??*** This was a good start, so I then measured everything side to side and against the models dimensions as I went. A slightly slower process.
  • decided to mark a centre line from the one on the transom / stern deck [already agreed and OK during the work so far done] and take it down to the top of the area where the water-jets will exit to the rear.
  • then put masking tape over the stern / transom surface and continued the line down, making sure that it was central here too. Give or take 1mm here and there I was satisfied.
  • using a set-square I drew the two internal lines up from the hull bottom which represented the water-jet plate 'vertical' edges. You can see they just overlap when they reach the top at the deck level. So far, so good.
  • I did notice at this stage, when studying the plans, that the Port trim-plane [tab] is in the 'up' position' and the Starboard one is in the 'horizontal to the hull bottom' position.
  • I then drew on the two water-jet plates [having done it in pencil on the first and second measurement] in ink on the third measure! The plates would not lie flat against the hull as the very small stainless screws holding the trim-plane hinge plate on precluded this. I shall show what I intend to do next post.
  • I then checked the water cooled exhaust dimensions, measured their distance out from the centre line and again measured and drew in pencil their position. I was not happy with what I saw from the plans, so checked my photos of the actual boat and noticed the top of the circular plate was a couple inches down from the top of the recess - so I adjusted this - then I inked it on. When I stood back I had used the wrong end of the rod that had been turned on the lathe on the Port side! Out with the correcting fluid [courtesy of Mrs. B and her crossword and Sudoku area on the kitchen table] and amended.
Not a lot, but it all took time - 'gently, gently catchy monkey'. The trouble with tidying up is you forget where all the tools and other items have gone and I spent ages looking for the 'allen' screwdriver of the right dimension to undo the water-jet plates that had been assembled for the LBES display board on my stand area at Warwick!
I might not get much more done in the next few days as I spent four hours rehearsing with another second bass here today, readying for our Concert this Saturday evening when the main item on the programme is Carl Orff's 'Carmina Burana', sung in Germanic Latin and in places at great speed. A full rehearsal Friday evening and again Saturday afternoon. Stops me getting bored. Then there are all the other five pieces by Percy Grainger and Benjamin Brittan - hey ho.
C.C.







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Delboy1958

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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #239 on: January 27, 2017, 07:15:28 am »

Hi Kim
Fitting those water jets is an interesting job I have fitted them to 2 boats in the past
but in the old days you used to get a cutting template to fold round the stern of the hull.
which made it easy.
The life boat I bought is a 37-35 Rother class which was based at Dungeness too.
It is a very well made model.
I have been doing small bits for the A L R too but I have been laid up with the same
chest infection thing as you since the 5th of December just getting to normal.

See you soon

Del
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Ron Rees

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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #240 on: January 27, 2017, 11:42:42 am »

Hi Kim,


Nice to see you back....missed you, Mind you I know how busy this time of year can be, been making all the special effects, magic tricks, set pieces and some costumes for Jenny's latest Pantomine 'The Sword in the Stone' very good it is as well. Plus we've also had the dreaded cold/cough, so haven't really got much done except making a small Vacuum Former to do the visors for the 1/12 RNLI helmets.


It's only 4 inches square but with the mould made can pull 9 of them in clear polycarbonate each time. I'll do the 1/24th and 1/16th moulds as well soon.


Been playing with spray Polyurethane foam, working on an idea to build hollow 1/24th hulls of the Severn initially, so its an outside master mould with an inner 'inside mould' suspended inside it to give a shell of hard PU foam 5/8th (15mm) thick. The surfaces are coming out really smooth but will need to be skinned and resined over for strength........All good fun but a bit messy at this stage. If the idea works I can make a hull in about 15 minutes! Trust me to try something different.


Cheers....Ron Rees.
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Canterbury Coxswain

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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #241 on: February 01, 2017, 11:24:47 pm »

Ron,
Sorry to hear both you and Jenny have had the 'dreaded' too. Glad the Panto went well, please give her my regards and a reminder that I hope she gave you quite a lot of 'Brownie Points' for all the help and expertise you gave her!!!!! I lost the ones I was carrying over from 2016 to 2017 when I passed on the 'dreaded' to my wife!
You seem to have been very busy on the modelling front too. I hope to have a go at painting one of your RNLI 1/12th heads soon, once a DVD has arrived from a very eminent airbrush professional that 17-09 and I have got to know over the past year. This will be a new approach for me, so we'll see what happens.
Down here in Buckinghamshire at the moment as family duties have called and I'm helping an ageing aunt.......hope to get back for the weekend to carry on with the water-jet fittings. I will now attempt to follow this post with an update of the little I did last Saturday, between rehearsals for the Concert - it went very well and was a sell out with a standing ovation at the end, well worth all the effort.
Cheers, Kim
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Canterbury Coxswain

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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #242 on: February 02, 2017, 12:41:45 am »

With my build we have to remember that I am using the commercially available Kehrer [KMB] Modellbau WaterJet28s, which are not dedicated to the Shannon, but I am planning to make mine as near as I can get them to the real machine. What does that mean?
  • The main exit for each water-jet on the transom of the real boat is an eccentric circle [a smaller circle within a larger circle - in this instance at the bottom of the larger circle.
  • On my model the larger circle is the exit for the water-jets, a little oversized. That is how I will build them, with plans to reduce the size of the nozzle provided [although the manufacturers warn against this as the units 'are already optimised to the best performance'. However, I plan to make this so they could be changed back to the original nozzles. Andy Griggs has already tested both to good effect on his son's version of the Shannon
  • I also aim to have a bucket system that mimics the real boat version too, but again building it around the KMB units.
  • Added to this I want some of the small detail added around these units to make them look like the real versions.
  • Alongside this I aim to have the two trim planes [tabs] working independently - only time will tell.
So, last Saturday for an hours relaxation between the Concert rehearsals I achieved the following:-
  • Firstly, I added the three plates that make up the central transom hitch point from the boat to the carriage and also the plates that the central water-jet protection bar is welded to. This was to make sure that my spacing was still correct.
  • I then put the markings on the transom, using red arrows, where the Port and Starboard stabilisers for the carriage mechanism wheels rested against the bottom of the hull.
  • Then, using set-squares, I drew the centre line down from water-jet circles
  • I put more masking tape along the bottom of the hull and then continued this line along the bottom of the hull from which I could mark out the water-intake areas of each of the water-jet units.
Done! Step back and admire - only to now realise that I have not allowed for the 2mm thickness of the fibre glass hull! Not to worry [I hope], the water-jet plates already marked up with their respective hinges are as on the real boat, so need to stay here. This weekend I will:
  • Cut out the two holes on the transom
  • Delta sand the areas where the intakes will be fixed on the inside of the hull, to make a smooth and slightly thinner thickness
  • See how they look with a 'dry fit'
  • Then progress to fit and cut the apertures from the outside, if they are not 'cocked' up in the air from the horizontal too much, or......
  • ......cut the actual shape of the intake so that they can be fitted flush to the underside of the hull.
Watch this space................ [Yes Delboy, this is going to be fun - but it's just a hobby, not life and death! Remind me of that when I have botched it, please].
C.C.
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Canterbury Coxswain

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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #243 on: February 02, 2017, 12:54:08 am »

Could Martin ['im with the colourful shirts - as at 'Warwick'] or any other reader please inform me how I can turn the penultimate photo in the last post up the right way, even at this late stage? It started out the right way up on my computer.
Many thanks,
Kim
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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #244 on: February 02, 2017, 01:58:04 am »

Hullo Kim....it always amazes  %)...all of the materials are of the 300 Series stainless steels, on non corrosive synthetics :-))......then they place a $2.00 aluminium material locking ball  <*< over a flange tube set?

Or is there some design advantage/purpose here that I do not understand?.......Derek
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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #245 on: February 02, 2017, 06:55:13 am »

That's one of the many zinc sacrificial anodes on the boat.


Lance
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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #246 on: February 02, 2017, 07:28:02 am »

Hi Kim glad you have got over you nasty illness and now back working on the Shannon. With reference to your setting out of the water jets outlets above
I see you have put them in the centre of the plate were on the real one they are off centre towards the bottom. This might become a problem if you are going to try and put the nozzles on like the real one?. With ref to the trim tabs I thing both work together I might be wrong.

Cheers John
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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #247 on: February 02, 2017, 08:35:07 am »

Hullo Kim....it always amazes  %) ...all of the materials are of the 300 Series stainless steels, on non corrosive synthetics :-)) ......then they place a $2.00 aluminium material locking ball  <*< over a flange tube set?

Or is there some design advantage/purpose here that I do not understand?.......Derek


Think you will find they are sacrificial anodes Derek.


Ned
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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #248 on: February 02, 2017, 12:27:22 pm »

How silly  :D of me not to twig to this....thanks Lance & Ned

[However the following is a little confusing as the tube & any fabricated brackets as shown in the build would I believe be AISI Grade 316 and the structural bolts Grade 304 and these both being austenitic in themselves or individually do not rust....however both of these Grades of stainless steel will corrode when subjected to high levels of chlorine/chloride at elevated temperatures]

Derek
http://www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=3&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwiD3u68tfHRAhUGrJQKHZzYDIQQFggoMAI&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.penflex.com%2Fchloride-chlorine-levels-and-stainless-steel-alloy-selection%2F&usg=AFQjCNFuoJ-eZhHAAs8dI4uKcU6DBSsE8Q

_____________________________________________________________

Courtesy of ASSDA

The stainless steels, including 304 and 316, are more positive than zinc and steel, so when stainless steel is in contact with galvanised steel and is wet, the zinc will corrode first, followed by the steel, while the stainless steel will be protected by this galvanic activity and will not corrode. The rate of galvanic attack is governed by the size of the potential difference.
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Re: Shannon 'RNLB The Morrell' 13-02 [Models by Design] - a 1/12th build
« Reply #249 on: February 02, 2017, 01:34:12 pm »

Whoops, just looked back and found Lance
Had already pointed out the anodes.
Must read prior posts in future :embarrassed:


Ned
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