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Author Topic: A Greek BIREME  (Read 23386 times)

Tug-Kenny RIP

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Re: A Greek BIREME
« Reply #100 on: July 29, 2017, 10:56:40 am »

Sorry to be at a standstill.   %)

I have sourced some more brass tubes and have to get the car out as they are now ordered and ready for collection some many miles away.

I am seriously thinking of going the Arduino route now and have been looking into it.  I need recommendations of suppliers and the kit required please (help required C-3PO,) as I've looked on 'the Bay' and don't want to overspend on rubbish.

My last computer course was studying 'Basic' and 'C plus' many years ago, but I did take to it and understand and enjoy the technology.   :-))

Much excitement and entertainment to follow.

cheers

ken

 
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C-3PO

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Re: A Greek BIREME
« Reply #101 on: July 29, 2017, 12:54:19 pm »

Ken,

I'll send you a shopping/supplier list later - won't be much

Arduino code is very simple - there aren't that many commands! - https://www.arduino.cc/en/Reference/HomePage

Don't under estimate the power of the little beast - even the 4 cloned board can still process 16million instructions per second

If you understand some of the basic programming generic logic building blocks like "if - then - else" it won't take you long to get up to speed - and if you get stuck many forums to get help...

Apart from some cable, solder , battery connector , battery total spend it likely to be max 10

There won't be much if anything you want to do with an Arduino that someone hasn't already done....

If you want to start preparation you can download and install the free Arduino IDE (Integrated Development Environment) - it's just a posh text editor at heart with some additional functionality from this link https://www.arduino.cc/en/Main/Software

You will then be able to get familiar with the editor - you can type a program and compile it in the IDE - the final bit  - you just need an Arduino attached to your PC via a USB cable to send the program from the IDE to the Arduino board - and that's it!!!

C-3PO



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Tug-Kenny RIP

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Re: A Greek BIREME
« Reply #102 on: July 29, 2017, 09:59:34 pm »


Thank you very much.  I'm following the route and will get it all loaded.

My email addy  is under my Icon.

Cheers

ken
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Tug-Kenny RIP

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Re: A Greek BIREME
« Reply #103 on: July 30, 2017, 11:55:45 am »

Running at full speed now the materials have arrived.   %)

Using a taller gap to allow for the oar movement, we have made another set of Rollocks and placed them in the new pusher frames.  These will be secured in at the bottom allowing for a pivoting movement.  The rods are 2mm hollow brass tubes and take some hammering and bending without snapping, so it came out as desired.




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ballastanksian

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Re: A Greek BIREME
« Reply #104 on: July 30, 2017, 06:27:55 pm »

It is starting to look like a victorian mechanism from a Loom Ken. You may need small children to lubricate them!

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RAAArtyGunner

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Re: A Greek BIREME
« Reply #105 on: July 30, 2017, 11:36:44 pm »

To us others it all looks Greek. O0 O0



Somebody had to say it %) %)
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Tug-Kenny RIP

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Re: A Greek BIREME
« Reply #106 on: July 31, 2017, 10:08:42 am »


The project mechanism is finished.  Wouldn't the Greeks be surprised.    %)

The rotating lift mechanism is secured with tiny 2mm washers, soldered in and smoothed down.  I expect there's a bit more to do to get them moving.

ken

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Martin [Admin]

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Re: A Greek BIREME
« Reply #107 on: August 02, 2017, 04:57:08 am »

 
An distraction for you Kenny!

Ancient Floating Death Stars | Chinese Super Ships Documentary   -  https://youtu.be/KX1OZKKfHGg
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Tug-Kenny RIP

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Re: A Greek BIREME
« Reply #108 on: August 02, 2017, 10:47:35 am »

Something to pass an evening. There might be some ideas there.       :}


Further work has been done on the oar mechanism.  I am fitting the oar pushers into place.  This set-up will provide the side to side movement of the oars. The system is designed to slide sideways back and forth a certain distance.

Slots have been made to allow the for up/down movement which is the next big project.  We are hoping for a computer controlled system and this is being thought about at the moment.   What have I let myself in for, when 60 slaves can do the job better.    %)





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ballastanksian

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Re: A Greek BIREME
« Reply #109 on: August 02, 2017, 09:42:11 pm »

It would be far harder to geneticaly modify DNA to form minute hoomans to row your ship than work up an Arduino system Ken.
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Tug-Kenny RIP

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Re: A Greek BIREME
« Reply #110 on: August 03, 2017, 10:09:17 am »


Yes, we are considering the Arduino route.

Presently gathering the relevant info.   :}

ken

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Tug-Kenny RIP

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Re: A Greek BIREME
« Reply #111 on: August 04, 2017, 04:43:07 pm »


Now we are fitting the rowing mechanism and it was decided to build a test bench so that adjustments and mods could be applied.

I have made a base onto which is fitted the vertical supports.  A false ship side wall was made with portholes and the newly made Pushers have been aligned.

The drive mechanism to move the oars left and right has been experimented with and, believe me when I say, it is proving to be quite difficult.  The motor has to have an arm with one end slotted to pause the pusher during rotation to allow the whole assemble to move sharply up and down at the end of it's traversing.   It is driven via my bench voltage adjuster so that I can run it any speed. 

The computer has arrived to be able to program the up and down movement of the pusher, but that will be another story.   %)

Here's the latest views with the oars left and right.






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radiojoe

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Re: A Greek BIREME
« Reply #112 on: August 04, 2017, 06:13:39 pm »

God you've got some patience Ken, I've seen this done with two oars in a row boat but sixty WOW, hope all goes to plan, good going so far.   :-))
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Tug-Kenny RIP

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Re: A Greek BIREME
« Reply #113 on: August 04, 2017, 07:57:35 pm »


Thanks Joe. There's certainly more to this than I first thought.

ken

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Bob K

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Re: A Greek BIREME
« Reply #114 on: August 04, 2017, 08:53:00 pm »

This is a totally fascinating thread Kenny.  I am enjoying every step on your development path.
A huge amount going on in such a limited space.  I know "rowing" is a technical art, a colleague at our club has a lovely working row boat, but only two oars.  Love the challenge you are taking on   :-))
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Tug-Kenny RIP

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Re: A Greek BIREME
« Reply #115 on: August 04, 2017, 09:10:38 pm »


It was indeed fascinating watching them all move in Sync.

They are running on my bench power supply at the moment and I could speed them up or slow them down.  The whole thing looks a  'wobbly mess' at the moment and will need a bit more precision when it comes to fitting them in the boat.

Already I'm noticing errors in design and things that 'don't look right', so much so, that I'm thinking of making another boat. Next time, a bigger one maybe.   %%

ken



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ballastanksian

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Re: A Greek BIREME
« Reply #116 on: August 04, 2017, 09:42:38 pm »

You will soon have a fleet in forced perspective ken!
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RAAArtyGunner

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Re: A Greek BIREME
« Reply #117 on: August 05, 2017, 04:52:17 am »

Might have already been stated/sorted, Using the KISS principle would it not be a row boat repeated/reproduced thirty or whatever times in length.

Also on the real thing was there a 'slot' for the oars as opposed to a round 'hole" ??
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Tug-Kenny RIP

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Re: A Greek BIREME
« Reply #118 on: August 05, 2017, 10:49:33 am »


Ah !!   yes the holes.   %)

Thereby lies a design problem.  The oar has to move in a radius motion. The round holes have to allow for provision of the oar moving sideways and up and down.

Therefore to maintain a non clunking and jamming of the oar when moved sideways, the centre has to be maintained whilst the outer edges of the hole have to be an angle like a cone.  The oar has to be oblong shape to maintain it's vertical position therefore this oblong is presented to the hole and has to move in a rotary movement.

Mechanically, it is actually a bad design, as during it's lifetime, it will wear away the section it rubs.  This also creates friction and drag and 30 of them are causing a load on the motor.

Whilst watching them  'do their thing'  and drinking loads of coffee, it became more apparent there is more to this than meets they eye.  It is also amusing to watch the oars  'drop out'  from the side of the craft whilst in motion as there is no form of  'stopper' at the moment.

When there is, then this point will become the rotational pivot point as well, causing extra problems and loading.  Hopefully this has been solved with the rotational clamp slotted fixture to allow for the oarsmen to pivot the oar. I just need 60 pins to stop them sliding out.

It all feels as if I'm doing a  'Doctorate'  at the university as computers have been ordered to control this system, and we haven't got around to making them go up and down, let alone pausing at each end of the stroke to raise and lower them.

No wonder the slaves were beaten with sticks to keep them rowing.   :}  :}

more later

ken
 



 

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Colin Bishop

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Re: A Greek BIREME
« Reply #119 on: August 05, 2017, 11:32:00 am »

If it is a Greek Bireme Ken, then the rowers are likely to have all been volunteer upstanding citizens not slaves. (depending to some extent on the period of course!)

Colin
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Tug-Kenny RIP

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Re: A Greek BIREME
« Reply #120 on: August 05, 2017, 11:35:17 am »


This will save me animating another character.

                             {-)

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Colin Bishop

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Re: A Greek BIREME
« Reply #121 on: August 05, 2017, 11:42:26 am »

Ooh Ken, you are oarful!  %)

Colin
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Tug-Kenny RIP

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Re: A Greek BIREME
« Reply #122 on: August 06, 2017, 10:39:58 am »


Great grief and consternation.

I am at the point of critical analysis where there are just too many problems for the set up that I have. I am beginning to see that certain things could be made differently so am considering re-doing most of it again.

1.  The oars are spaced wrong
2.  The height from the water level is wrong.
3.  The Length of stroke is wrong.
4.  The hull is too small.

All of this would mean the holes in the hull would need repositioning and that would require a new side to the ship.  ARGH .............................

Any comments guys.

ken
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Colin Bishop

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Re: A Greek BIREME
« Reply #124 on: August 06, 2017, 11:09:46 am »


Hi Colin.  Thanks for the 'heads up' movie picture.

It does indeed show the problems with oarsmen that I am trying to eliminate.

Speed of oars
Stroke distance of oars
Depth of oars
Circular rotation of oars
Thrust of oars

A very interesting project indeed. I shall continue until I get it right.

cheers

ken



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