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Author Topic: Marcher Build  (Read 8443 times)

ooyah/2

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Re: Marcher Build
« Reply #75 on: January 26, 2018, 10:17:35 PM »

Hi Ian,


Glad to hear that you are now going for Stevenson reverse gear which in my opinion is by far the better, you don't have any problems with steam leakage at the valves, the only thing that I like about the piston valve is the ease of forward and reverse but the castings are a bit on the heavy side for the Marcher engine.
The throttle valve is also a bit bulky for the marcher so I am posting a pic of a throttle valve that I made for a TVR engine and it works very well, try and get the lubricator before the throttle valve to carry some oil into the valve for lubrication.


Keep up the good work.


George.
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IanJ

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Re: Marcher Build
« Reply #76 on: January 27, 2018, 12:01:35 PM »

Hi George,


From the outset the fall back position was to make the slide valve version, hence not drilling the steam passages in the cylinder head until I was certain the piston valves would be suitable, or as certain as I could be.
If I had not been waiting for the stainless steal and had not made a start on the two-way valve I fear that I would have gone the wrong way.
A throttle valve of the type you suggest possibly incorporating a lubricator is more in keeping with the size of the Marcher and I feel much more elegant than that bulky and heavy two-way valve which may suit a bigger piston valve engine but not the Marcher as it's simply out of proportion.


Already made a start on the valve chests and will post progress presently. Planning to utilise a "grub" on the valve spindle to aid adjustment and not make the screwed version.


Cheers


Ian
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IanJ

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Re: Marcher Build
« Reply #77 on: January 30, 2018, 07:05:23 PM »

The slide valve comprises of; valve chest & covers, both are casting. The spindle top guide & gland follower will be machined from brass as will the valve itself.


The valve chests were first squared up in the mill to aid marking out and holding in the 4 jaw the faces then taken to almost finished size.



The drawing shows the gland follower to flanged type pulled up on nuts on studs. Given that the spindle guide is made up from brass hex bar I have elected to make the gland follower also out of brass hex bar. To that end I have machined spigot on valve chest that will form the glands stuffing box that will be screwed to take the screwed gland follower.
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ooyah/2

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Re: Marcher Build
« Reply #78 on: January 30, 2018, 11:47:02 PM »

Ian,
Are you sure that by making the gland stuffing box as you describe that there is enough clearance between the hex gland and the fork at the bottom of the valve spindle when the eccentric is at its  T.D.C.


I made mine as per the drawing and found that the clearance was only 3/32".  ( see pic )


George.
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IanJ

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Re: Marcher Build
« Reply #79 on: January 31, 2018, 01:08:23 PM »

Hi George,

Simple answer is; no I did't consider the clearance.

I have since had a look at the drawings & I believe that if I keep the length of the spigot to that of the stuffing box as drawn & keep the size of the hex head to that of the gland follower also as drawn I should get away it. The nut will be very thin though.

I have since drilled & tapped both valve chests to take the spindle guides & gland nuts, that hopefully will not foul. Have also machined valve chest covers. 1st. by facing off what will become the outside face but leaving a snub piece to hold in the chuck that allows the inside face to be faced off. Holding it by the snub piece is the only way to achieve the finished thickness of 3/32 (2mm). The alternative would be to use sheet material, although I don't have any. Nevertheless, I feel the overall effect is more pleasing if GM is used throughout.

The final photo shows one of the chests, with its cover in place taken down to finished size.
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IanJ

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Re: Marcher Build
« Reply #80 on: February 01, 2018, 02:48:24 PM »

Valve chests, covers, spindle guides & gland nuts now completed. Also made start on the slide valve by milling out the square recess in the face. The drawing shows it to be 3/16 square, with no radius in the corners? I used a 3mm slot drill which as left 1.5mm radius in the corners. The next operation is to mark out & drill/mill the steam passages in the cylinder head. I will then assess the slide valve in its present form before I attempt to get into the corners with a smaller mill. I do have 1mm somewhere that came as part of set.


Sorry for the lack of actual machining photos, but my iPhone batteries went dead.


PS Don't know how others take & post photos; I now do not use my camera, I now use my iPhone, I use "file share" option to get them into a dedicated file, resize them to 800x600 pixels & then attach them.
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southsteyne2

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Re: Marcher Build
« Reply #81 on: February 01, 2018, 10:36:22 PM »

Hi Mark don't worry about the corners of the valve , just make sure it is flat against the face
Cheers
John
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ooyah/2

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Re: Marcher Build
« Reply #82 on: February 02, 2018, 11:11:43 AM »

Ian,


The radiuses corners are not so important, if you have a 1/16" slot drill just go into the corners with that , or if you can find your 1 mm slot drill use that, as John says make sure that the valve is flat on the cylinder face.
I tried unsuccessfully to find a supplier with a 1/32" slot drill with no success so the 1/16" one sufficed, it's the same with the ports on the cylinder block, I used my 1/16" slot drill and the engine runs well.


George.
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rhavrane

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Re: Marcher Build
« Reply #83 on: February 03, 2018, 06:50:21 PM »

Bonjour,
Sorry, not in the appropriate topic, but I started here.

I could not wait to share with you my Kingdon boiler : https://youtu.be/5heUAKoZEW0
And a few pictures here with its future launch : https://goo.gl/photos/tNdsxUQ7eQRApcH89
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IanJ

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Re: Marcher Build
« Reply #84 on: February 03, 2018, 07:19:17 PM »


It I have made a start on the steam passages in the head. After marking out I search out my 1mm slot drill,  I nevertheless chain drilled the ports before using the mill. I found that the mill performed very well and chain drilling was unnecessary. Recesses in the bores were then cut. I made up piece of wood scaled off the drawing to support the head at the correct angle when drilling the steam passages. I have found that the inlet ports are little shallow and need to be taken a little deeper.

It was then that broke my 1mm end mill, not in use but when snagged on the edge of something. I have the little Proxxon milling machine to be great little tool fine work. The available cutters are; 3, 2, & 1mm They are quite robust in use, but can snap if knocked.


So, need to send for a replacement cutter which will come in a few days. However, Axminster Tools who are the main dealer/importer for Proxxon is 30/40min drive for me, so may have ride out next week. A visit can prove to be fatal as their show room is full of all sorts of delightful items!
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IanJ

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Re: Marcher Build
« Reply #85 on: February 12, 2018, 11:32:38 AM »

Got a new 1mm cutter (slot drill) from Axminster Tools & completed steam passages.


Have also completed the valve chests & slide valve. The slide valve version requires; 4 eccentrics, straps & rods which are different to pair that I made when planning to make the piston valve version. The throw of the eccentric is different to that of the piston valve. The machining method remains the same i.e. using suitable size packing in the 3 jaw. The rods are also to a different pattern and machined from a solid piece of square bar.
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SteamboatPhil

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Re: Marcher Build
« Reply #86 on: February 12, 2018, 12:12:56 PM »

This is really coming along well, really nice job.  :-))
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IanJ

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Re: Marcher Build
« Reply #87 on: February 23, 2018, 12:14:41 PM »

The work continues on the link rods, albeit slowly due to a cold workshop (i.e. one end of my garage) & tummy bug. The two are not related, as grandson came home from nursery & shared his newly acquired condition with the whole family!


The ends of the link rods once taken to size were slotted & cross drilled. I do whatever I can & that I feel appropriate by machine tool, I do however, like to do the finishing such as forming the radius by hand.


The eccentric straps/rods need to be assembled & get a bit of a polish. The crucial aspect is setting the length, so may make a simple jig to assist with this.
But first, I intend to make the two expansion links out of 1/8" ms plate. Two ways to do this; (1) All by hand, mark-out, drill pivot holes, chain drill slot & file to shape. (2) Machine, mark-out, set-up on rotary table, drill pivot holes, mill slot/profile, then finish by hand.


If mill/rotary table is not available, then the decision is made for you. I do have small mill & as yet an unused rotary table. So it's option (2), just need to decide the best set-up.
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Mark T

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Re: Marcher Build
« Reply #88 on: February 23, 2018, 04:29:36 PM »

You've made a lovely job there Ian and I really like the way that you have finished the radiuses by hand.  I remember as an apprentice having to use radius gauges with a file and being sent back to the vice time and time again until I got it right.  I think that its a skill that once you have mastered it; it will stay with you for life and you have done a very nice job there.
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IanJ

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Re: Marcher Build
« Reply #89 on: February 23, 2018, 06:24:06 PM »

Thanks Mark,


One way of helping to form a radius on such items is to use a nut & bolt with suitable sizes washers. If left a little loose the file causes the washers to "skid" around as radius comes to size. Personally, I prefer to finish such small items by eye, if it looks right it's very often right. As you & many will know components that need to fit/mate to each other are another matter & need to be as close to the given tolerance as equipment & skills permit.


Many years ago, I also spent the first months of my apprenticeship learning bench skills. The process used to pass on & master such skills is well established; Explain, demonstrate, imitate, practice. It was the practice element that took the time. Why do I suspect that the so called "Modern Apprenticeships" (a term that I hate) lacks in "practice" time. I'll now step down from my soap box!


I have been away from the practical side for a long time & now that I have recently taken up model making I find that it is the the practise bit that needs further work.
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steamboatmodel

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Re: Marcher Build
« Reply #90 on: February 24, 2018, 02:16:48 AM »


Great build. We referred to Washers as "Poor Man's Buttons"  Forman and tool crib had proper hardened button sets, but unless the job required it we used washers.
Gerald.
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IanJ

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Re: Marcher Build
« Reply #91 on: February 24, 2018, 02:05:02 PM »

Gerald, thanks for your comments.


Another device that is often used is the filling rest on the lathe. Comprising of two parallel rollers mounted on a bracket that can be raised on jacking screws so that it embraces the stationary workpiece/shaft. When set at the right height and with the file guided & resting & on the rollers flats can be formed on the shaft. If the lathe spindle has an indexing facility, squares, hexagons,etc. can be produced.


I have never used one, but I am sure there must be others out there that have experience of such tools.


A tool that I would like to obtain is a filling machine; bit like a scroll saw, but having a reciprocating file instead of a saw blade. Never seen one, let alone used one, although I understand them to quite small using 6" long files. Can see how useful they could be in forming profiles. Again others may experience of such things.
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derekwarner_decoy

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Re: Marcher Build
« Reply #92 on: February 24, 2018, 08:40:28 PM »

Re : Filing Machine

Ian...........I have seen this young chap Chris from Clickspring use his base mounted reciprocating Filing Machine..........

I also find his work very interesting ........

Derek


www.youtube.com/channel/UCworsKCR-Sx6R6-BnIjS2MA
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IanJ

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Re: Marcher Build
« Reply #93 on: February 26, 2018, 07:51:02 PM »

The Expansion Links are now completed.


I mentioned two ways to produce the expansion links; all by hand, chain drilling & filing, or machining. In the end, I used combination of the two.
From the centre point of a piece of 1/8" ms plate I marked out the two expansion links & mounted them on the rotary table employing a central spigot thus locating the plate centrally on the table. I could of put one on top of the other and machined both together, that however would result in a combined depth of 1/4' which in my view is a little deep for a 1/8" end mill.
Ist. operation was to machine the outer radius followed by the slot. Then the pivot points were drilled. I could not then see any advantage in continuing with the mill, so the plate was removed. A hacksaw produced two blanks that were bolted together, the inside profile was done by hand. The filing takes as long as it takes, but I find it quite satisfying. The final photo shows the links fitted with the bearing bushes. I estimate total time for both expansion links to be around 8 hours. Without the mill the slot could be easily produced by chain drilling and file(s).
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IanJ

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Re: Marcher Build
« Reply #94 on: March 14, 2018, 03:21:28 PM »

The making of the reversing gear continues with the associated drag links, weight shaft arms, anchor link & weight shaft brackets. The drag links & anchor link are simple pieces of flat bar, drilled then fitted with bushes. One way to make the weight shaft arms is to machine them out of solid either in the lathe or on the mill using a rotary table. I decided to make them up from flat bar & bushes in a similar way to that of the drag links. The weight shaft brackets were formed from bending brass strip, drilling the appropriate holes & fitting with bushes. The operating arm remains to be done. The next step will be a final clean up & assembly to check fit.


These little components, although simple, are taking sometime to make. You cannot compromise on their accuracy as it is crucial for the correct function of the reverse gear.  Not shown are the discarded ones were the drilled holes were "just a little off" & at this size, "just a little off" looks appalling! Almost at a point were assembly of engine proper can begin.
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ooyah/2

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Re: Marcher Build
« Reply #95 on: March 14, 2018, 10:33:20 PM »

Hi Ian,
Very neat, I made all the reverse parts in Brass for the long term future as I have seen some Stevenson reverse linkage made in M/Steel and beginning to rust, I suppose it's all a matter of choice, I look forward to you getting things together, it's a neat little engine.


George.
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IanJ

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Re: Marcher Build
« Reply #96 on: March 15, 2018, 01:24:10 PM »

Hi George, as always thanks for your observations.


I used mild steel for two reasons; (1) it was specified on the drawings & more importantly, (2) I had various bits of mild steel to hand.
Clearly in use, the linkages, along with all other parts are going to be kept well lubricated. I assume it's corrosion during the subsequent storage time between runs that you are referring to. If the engine is cleaned, well oiled & stored in dry environment I hope to be ok. Unlike other engines with cast iron cylinders/valve chests etc., engines such as the "Borderer" & "Marcher" are predominately gun-metal with only some external parts out of steel that can be easily checked upon. I hope this will be the case, time will tell.


Cheers


Ian




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Moxis

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Re: Marcher Build
« Reply #97 on: June 13, 2018, 06:20:02 AM »

Long time has elapsed after the last updating of this build. I wonder if everything is fine and Marcher is running nicely? I am asking this because am pondering the purchase of the set of castings & starting a similar project.
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IanJ

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Re: Marcher Build
« Reply #98 on: June 13, 2018, 07:11:44 PM »

Hi Moxis,


You are right it has been sometime since I posted progress on the Marcher Build. I have been some what distracted due to another project taking priority. I have only been the Project Engineer. The Project Sponsor (my good lady) & the Project Manager (Grandson) have being  setting the priorities!


The project that I refer to the building of a "Toylander", a scaled down Series 2 Land Rover. There are nevertheless, similarities with boat building; the body (hull) is moisture resistance MDF, propulsion is two mobility scooter motors powered by two 12 volt batteries. No navigation lights as such, but it has got working headlights, side lights & indicators. its now completed, other than painting the wheels.


I can now resume with the Marcher build which is at stage as per my last post.


Regards


Ian
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Moxis

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Re: Marcher Build
« Reply #99 on: June 13, 2018, 07:28:54 PM »

Thanks Ian for your reply. In fact I had also drawings for Toylander, but didn't ever build it. And years went by & grandchildren grew up so fast that they wouldn't fit any more into the small car, so I sold the plans.

So now I wait eagerly that you will complete your Marcher build and we can see how nicely and smoothly it is running.
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