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Author Topic: Model Boats magazine, other model magazines.... and shows!  (Read 9887 times)

roycv

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Re: .... new editor for Model Boats magazine
« Reply #25 on: May 18, 2018, 05:55:09 PM »

Perhaps I need a chat room, I feel so embarrassed, Aw shucks! (what sort of poetry Klunk?)
expectantly yours,
R
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Klunk

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Re: .... new editor for Model Boats magazine
« Reply #26 on: May 18, 2018, 06:05:36 PM »

general stuff. it's in 2 books but under a pseudonym
.
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Pufango

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Re: .... new editor for Model Boats magazine
« Reply #27 on: November 04, 2018, 08:50:00 PM »

I think Model Engineer magazine is going down hill big style.Hardly any of the content has anything to do with models anymore and the recent cover photos  ,well unless you know  the magazine you would have no idea what it was about! I know it's not a model boat item but they sometimes have build articles on live steam boat engines.I know i have an occasional column (The Wright Way ) focusing on the beginners engines etc. I do believe it’s up to the editor to provide a good magazine .They don’t do it for free!Just  wanted to get it off my chest.Best regards Tony Wright.
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Peter Fitness

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Re: .... new editor for Model Boats magazine
« Reply #28 on: November 06, 2018, 03:53:36 AM »

I don't read Model Engineer, it's way out of my league, bur my brother-in-law, George Punter, an English ex-pat now living in Bundaberg, Queensland, is a frequent contributor. One of his recent series was on the construction of a Saunderson and Mills vintage tractor. He earned enough money from the series of articles to fund a trip to the UK, complete with said tractor, which he entered in the Model Engineer exhibition winning one of the top awards. Sadly the MEE seems to have gone by the wayside after many, many years.


Peter.
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phil_parker

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Re: .... new editor for Model Boats magazine
« Reply #29 on: November 06, 2018, 02:10:00 PM »

Sadly the MEE seems to have gone by the wayside after many, many years.
Really? The London exhibition is terrific. A really wide variety of models and popular with visitors too. 

One issue for all the model engineering shows is getting people to enter things. I know from talking to organisers it's a struggle even to get people to display things, never mind enter the competitions. My guess is that the engineers want everything done for them by someone else. Hobby's don't work like that, either those involved do stuff or it dies. I have a feeling that model boating could be heading down this road...
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Colin Bishop

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Re: .... new editor for Model Boats magazine
« Reply #30 on: November 06, 2018, 02:29:16 PM »

A bit of confusion there I think. Peter is presumably referring to the original Model Engineer Exhibition (MEX) which sadly does indeed seem to be defunct having been last held at Brooklands in 2016. This is quite separate from the London Model Engineering Exhibition staged by Meridienne in January (who are of course also responsible for next Saturday's International Model Boat Show.
Colin
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phil_parker

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Re: .... new editor for Model Boats magazine
« Reply #31 on: November 06, 2018, 03:44:43 PM »

Thanks Colin. I had the wrong exhibition. The London one is still superb though, and I'm looking forward to the boats this weekend. Some late nights beating a new kit into shape for appearing on the KMBC stand.
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Subculture

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Re: .... new editor for Model Boats magazine
« Reply #32 on: November 06, 2018, 07:09:11 PM »

The original Model Engineers Exhibition had an axe taken to it just before the millenium. As I recall they had two in one year- 1999, the first was in the traditional January at Olympia, and a second show in December at Alexandra Palace. After that it stopped, and resurfaced at Ascot, then Sandown a few years later, only now it was a much smaller show and only featured top end hardcore Model engineering, which was a huge mistake IMO.

The show that now takes place at Alexandra Palace started off in Picketts Lock, and although a decent enough show, it was considered very much the poor relation. I don't think it's ever matched the original ME show, but there we are- beggars can't be choosers, and at least we still have something.

http://modelengineeringwebsite.com/MEX_axed.html

Colin Bishop

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Re: .... new editor for Model Boats magazine
« Reply #33 on: November 06, 2018, 07:47:00 PM »

That's a fair report on the MEX.

I was first invited to act as a judge at the 1985 MEX at Wembley Conference Centre and continued to do so for 31 years missing just one. At what now appears to have been the final MEX in 2016 I was the last and sole Marine Competition Judge with some assistance from one of the engineering people.

Over that long period we saw some wonderful work from top class marine modellers and for much of the time I provided some or all of the Exhibition reports in Model Boats magazine. During the heyday of the exhibition the judges were treated very well by the organisers and one of the highlights was a slap up lunch in Alexandra Palace with a three course meal with wine in a wonderful dining room with frescoes on the wall. Truly memorable. Perhaps the nadir came at Sandown Park one year when a bunch of hungry judges were left with nothing to eat until one of the very embarrassed editors managed to produce some very ordinary sandwiches from a local convenience store. How are the mighty fallen!

In the latter days the judges were left to sort things out themselves under the leadership of Mike Law of the SMEE with virtually no support or interest from the sponsors but it became a labour of love and we were determined to keep up standards to the last which I think we did. The MEX judges were always 100% dedicated to maintaining the very highest standards and over those years there was virtually no criticism of the decisions made in the marine classes and the awards which I think is a very fine record. The MEX was always held to be the 'Gold Standard' of model making and model engineering competition and I have been very proud to have been a part of it.

Colin
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Subculture

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Re: Model Boats magazine, other model magazines.... and shows!
« Reply #34 on: November 06, 2018, 09:09:00 PM »

You won't see it return. It takes little effort to drop a fire, but a huge amount to build it back up again.

Colin Bishop

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Re: Model Boats magazine, other model magazines.... and shows!
« Reply #35 on: November 06, 2018, 09:45:57 PM »

I don't expect to. It was on life support for years and a shadow of its old self. But the glory days were good times though.

Shows are disappearing at an alarming rate now though. There will be nothing left soon as the modelling community is no longer big enough to support events at the major venues.

Colin
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Subculture

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Re: Model Boats magazine, other model magazines.... and shows!
« Reply #36 on: November 06, 2018, 09:59:19 PM »

My experience of many modelling arenas these days is that there are far too many individuals who find good reason to do nothing.

The days when large venues could be filled may be behind us, but participation in the hobby can still be encouraged.

Peter Fitness

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Re: .... new editor for Model Boats magazine
« Reply #37 on: November 07, 2018, 05:52:03 AM »

A bit of confusion there I think. Peter is presumably referring to the original Model Engineer Exhibition (MEX) which sadly does indeed seem to be defunct having been last held at Brooklands in 2016.
Colin


Correct Colin, my brother-in-law took his model tractor to Brooklands in 2016.


Peter.
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Neil

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Re: Model Boats magazine, other model magazines.... and shows!
« Reply #38 on: November 07, 2018, 10:10:31 AM »


I only ever went once, and that was purely because the local club had laid on a coach.


I found it both a wonderful experience in the main and also such a variety of "models" to view.


however, what put me off ever going again was the snobbery of those in the higher echelons of the modelling sphere.I found no one willing to chat about their beautiful model steam vehicles, and with their very well built ships seemed to to think that, by showing folders of their builds that all questions should have been answered.........some just don't or didn't realise that you just wanted to chat in general, rather than to probe their building techniques........


I feel that our hobby is for sharing with others, not keeping your knowledge to yourselves......….and this is why such forums as mayhem is a god send to all ship/boat modellers.


that one visit put me off travelling to far flung places to see shows, and TBH Blackpool and Elsmere port are/were the only two I would go too...….purely because of the elitism shown at MEX, all those years ago,


Sadly though it doesn't stop there. some years ago I went to the Southport lifeboat show at the new venue, to show ff the "new" Liverpool class lifeboat I had developed for Dave Metcalf. a chap came to look at the model, and asked all sorts of questions about it, and I happily answered his inquiries. I had seen that he had a beautiful  working model of a steam lifeboat that I had always fancied trying...…….I went over to him as he had the top off showing internals to another modeller. As I approached he quickly put the top on the boat, and when I asked if I could look at the internals he refused point blank.over the next 3 years he refused twice more, even though he wanted me to get a model of the Ann Letitia Russell at reduced price on mates rates...……


this is the sort of behaviour that does our modelling brethren no favours at all, and happily I am glad the way I am...….I am arrogant, bolshy and don't like idiots, but I am helpful and proud of it, and I like to think that anyone can come to me for help, and not be ignored. O0
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Colin Bishop

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Re: Model Boats magazine, other model magazines.... and shows!
« Reply #39 on: November 07, 2018, 10:22:05 AM »

Perhaps it's just you Neil... ;)
There are awkard people in all walks of life, not just at exhibitions.
You only went to the MEX once and made up your mind on that single visit. I have been going for 40 years or more and in my experience the top class modellers have been unfailingly polite, helpful and friendly and modest about theur achievements to boot. Yes there are the occasional prima donnas but they are far and few between and if they don't get th awards they think they deserve are rarely seen again.

Colin
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roycv

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Re: Model Boats magazine, other model magazines.... and shows!
« Reply #40 on: November 07, 2018, 12:57:02 PM »

Hello all, I feel compelled to respond as I have had two model yachts in the competitions at MEX.  I have two bronze medals for which I am very pleased.  I love talking about my models so usually end up with a sore throat.  My experience of MEX is that the builders were rarely present but could be found if present, by a steward.

However I was approached by someone at an outside event who quizzed me in detail about the construction of my yacht which was a static to working conversion, with follow up emails.  I was therefore very surprised to see a review of this yacht (kit) in the other model boat magazine by this person, who without seeing my yacht and having such long conversations would never have built the boat.

Likewise I did some free building to a model boat and donated £20s worth of bits for a schoolboy (parents present).  I took them all to a club visit and brought with me a RC boat to sail.  I think their consciences was salved by giving me a bottle of wine, unfortunately I knew much about wine at the time and judged it borderline cooking!

Never heard another word!

So I look at conversations with strangers in a slightly jaundiced way now, fortunately I have many friends who are welcome to chat for as long as they like.

Regards Roy


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phil_parker

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Re: Model Boats magazine, other model magazines.... and shows!
« Reply #41 on: November 07, 2018, 04:21:03 PM »

I don't expect to. It was on life support for years and a shadow of its old self. But the glory days were good times though.

Shows are disappearing at an alarming rate now though. There will be nothing left soon as the modelling community is no longer big enough to support events at the major venues.

Colin
Not all modelling communities are shrinking too small to put on shows. Any weekend of the year, you'll find dozens of model railway shows. It might be that there are more railway modellers, almost certainly so, but also that within the hobby there are more people willing to go to the trouble of organising an event. I've spent a lot of time at ME shows and listened to several people bemoan the lack of them ,as well as criticizing the event they are at. I always suggest they put on their own "superior" event but they recoil in horror at the idea.

If people in a hobby are content to sit back and let someone else do all the work, the hobby is likely to die out.
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Colin Bishop

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Re: Model Boats magazine, other model magazines.... and shows!
« Reply #42 on: November 07, 2018, 05:40:46 PM »

Phil,

I think you are being a bit unrealistic here. Model Railways are many, many times more popular than model boats and attract a wider age range from what I have seen at multi model shows. The railway hobby supports a far larger commercial sector too whereas model boat trading in the UK is almost a cottage industry with no really major players.

When I attend model boating shows such as Warwick or the joint model engineering shows I find I appear to be a fair bit younger than most of the people on the stands and visitor and I turned 70 this year. At this age you don't have the energy you had when you were younger or the physical strength or the willingness to drive long distances and the odds are that you have one or more chronic medical conditions to boot!
Furthermore, modelling may no longer be your main interest and there are other things you want to do while you still can, in the case of my wife and myself it has been travelling to tick things of our bucket lists. So in my case, whilst I am still very interested in building models I am no longer enthusiastic about continuing to be involved in the wider aspects of the hobby as I was when I was younger and spent most of my spare time organising regattas, serving on the MPBA, and promoting scale course designs as well as managing to actually build boats as well. Been there, done that and moved on.
I would never complain about events that continue to be put on as I am well aware of all the work that goes into a successful one and the people who are willing to do so are to be congratulated, likewise the clubs and their members who give their energy and time to supporting them. But as far as model boating is concerned, and I think to a lesser extent other branches of model making, the well is increasingly beginning to run dry as older people leave the hobby and are not replaced.
There is nothing to be done about this in the longer term except to support events that are still going and not to complain if the entry fees are put up to keep them viable. Even now the costs of entry are way below what you could expect to pay at other public attractions as anyone who has considered visiting a National Trust property recently will be well aware.

Colin
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phil_parker

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Re: Model Boats magazine, other model magazines.... and shows!
« Reply #43 on: November 07, 2018, 06:14:38 PM »

It's a vicious circle. Railways have always done a lot to promote the hobby and the result is an audience large enough to support a trade presence. OK, it's always been a more popular hobby compared to engineering and boat, but if you look back many years or so, not that much more.

I'm reminded of being involved with a large general show locally taking place over the August bank holiday. My role was with the railway exhibits but that meant going to meetings for the whole hobby section. The show was huge and attracted many families. Part of the hobby area, in a posh cattle shed included a model boat section complete with a pool make of hay bales and waterproof sheet. It worked well, but then the people running the boat section decided that providing a pool was too much work and that the main organisers (an events company) should provide it for them instead. Not unreasonably, the company decided that they didn't have the knowledge or manpower to lay on a pond, so the model boats became a small subsidiary of the engineering hall. With no pool, the same people decided they didn't want to turn up any more.
Maybe I'm stupid, but I don't want to simply roll over and say the hobby will be dead in a few years and there is nothing that can be done about it. Look abroad and you find a far more vibrant hobby with shows the size of which the UK modeller can only dream of attending. At least one of those (Modelspoor) is put on by a group of committed amateurs. They may have the advantage of the peculiar local idea that exhibition venues should be rented at a modest price to these sort of events, but someone still has to organize the thing.

To be honest, I can still build boats and sail them. If the hobby is dead in a couple of years, that won't stop me. With the shows all gone, there won't be time spent listening to "modellers" grumbling about the event they are visiting (one recently moaned about having to go to a show in the same way you would moan about root canal work) and how things aren't as good as they used to be, while refusing to part with any money to the trade but expecting sellers to still turn up at events.

Model boating is an attractive hobby to lots of people. There are still shows, and an excellent magazine on the news stands. There is trade, including RTR models to get people started. Look at the Ally Pally ME show - loads of families wandering around. At Warwick there is a popular junior section each day. We just need to capitalise on this. Support shows, support Model Boats and support the trade and who knows what might happen?


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Colin Bishop

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Re: Model Boats magazine, other model magazines.... and shows!
« Reply #44 on: November 07, 2018, 06:45:40 PM »

Phil,
The hobby isn't going to die in a couple of years but we are in a period of managed decline purely due to the demographics. The number of shows is declining at a worrying rate because they are no longer financially viable. Venue costs are fixed or rising but trader participation and footfall is reducing. The recent Blackpool show was considered to be a success but still made a small loss.

In my view, over the last few years there have been too many shows when the sensible answer would have been to consolidate but each lot of organisers have insisted on their independence with the result that they have all become financially vulnerable.

It was obvious years ago that the two London shows. the MEX and the MEE could have merged to the benefit of both but now one is defunct and the other, despite what has been said on here and elsewhere, is declining. It could have been bolstered had it taken on board the  respected MEX gold standard competition.

Up North, we have Haydock and Blackpool close together geographically and timewise but still competing. Lots of people go to one or the other but not both.
Down South the wonderful Brighton multi modelling show has gone due to high venue costs. We still have Midhurst but that is more of a regional show although long may it prosper.

Beale Park near Reading has a fantastic venue but the owners tried to squeeze too much from participants and visitors and has died the death.
As far as model boating is concerned a successful show needs to have good trader representation, high footfall and ideally somewhere to float your boat. How many now achieve this?

Traders need to at least break even to make it worth attending and gate prices need to be pitched to attract footfall. Club stands should be free and actively encouraged. This traditional financial model appears to be breaking down, maybe due to high venue costs and declining footfall. There is no easy answer to this but it is interesting to note that Deans Marine and Mobile Marine Models are mutually supporting events on their own premises which appear to be quite successful in keeping costs down and promoting their products. In this sense they are responding to the realities of the situation.

Colin
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phil_parker

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Re: Model Boats magazine, other model magazines.... and shows!
« Reply #45 on: November 07, 2018, 06:59:02 PM »

Demographics aren't killing the hobby, there are still lots of people around as this graph from the ONS shows:
It's not lack of bodies that is hurting the hobby, but lack of new bodies coming in to the hobby. If we want new people in the hobby, the hobby has to go and grab them. Other hobbies manage it - I'm reliably told that craft-based digital TV channels are the most profitable on TV so people will take part in craft based pastimes.

I give up. I'm obviously stupid in wanting our hobby to survive. I'll go back to making things for me and accept that it's all over for the rest of the UK (not Europe as mentioned earlier).
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Colin Bishop

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Re: Model Boats magazine, other model magazines.... and shows!
« Reply #46 on: November 07, 2018, 07:15:49 PM »

Yes, but the young males who used to be the mainstay of model boating are now into other leisure interests which offer more immediate gratification such as video games, apps and social media etc. Plus these days people do prefer to buy things rather than make them. Just the way it is. Youngsters these days aren't terribly interested in sticking things together anymore. Can you blame them?

Looking at the model railway displays I have seen in recent years it is clear that the participants buy their engines and rolling stock etc. They don't make them and there is a big industry geared up to giving them what they want. Their creative abilities appear to be confined to scenery rather than the models themselves.

Colin
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Liverbudgie

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Re: Model Boats magazine, other model magazines.... and shows!
« Reply #47 on: November 07, 2018, 08:25:49 PM »

The Telford IPMS show is on this weekend as well, it will interesting to see what happens there. The age range is generally from around -5 to 90+, young persons are encouraged to build models as well, with the models, glues and paints being suppled by Airfix.

The entry cost this year are, I think £12 and parking is around £8 -£10 but, that doesn't put people off, far from it; a truly international affair.

LB

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KitS

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Re: Model Boats magazine, other model magazines.... and shows!
« Reply #48 on: November 07, 2018, 08:48:24 PM »

The Telford IPMS show, somewhat grandly entitled 'Scale Model World' these days, has been getting larger and larger ever since the event moved to Telford many years ago. I've been attending the annual 'IPMS Nationals', as it used to be called, since the mid '60s and it's grown steadily ever since those days.

Like all modelling hobbies the average age of IPMS modellers has steadily got older and older, but there are numbers of younger plastic modellers heavily into the hobby as well. Perhaps the fact that 'Airfix kits' as many people call them, are considerably cheaper to buy than model railway items, or model boats as well?
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Colin Bishop

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Re: Model Boats magazine, other model magazines.... and shows!
« Reply #49 on: November 07, 2018, 08:54:30 PM »

Yes, I would agree that plastic kits are more accessible and the range of subjects would seem to have more appeal to younger people than the sort of exhibits you will see at Warwick.
I did visit the show myself a couple of years ago and was impressed with the standards of painting and finish and in the imagination shown in the exhibits but it wasn't really my sort of modelling so perhaps that's where the problem lies! Us model boaters are too traditional!

Colin
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