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Author Topic: General Havelock  (Read 929 times)

Kentish John

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General Havelock
« on: August 10, 2018, 02:01:27 pm »

Hello fellow group members,

I am hoping that someone on here can help me, but, I may be a few years too late with my search for images of “Bryan Young's” scratch built model of the Steamer General Havelock.

I have read several comments referring to the model and photos on this forum but do not seem to be able to find any, then Bryan posted he was possibly selling the model due to his eyesight and not being able to construct models so easily.

The reason I would like to see an image is that at present I am writing the History of the Line of steamers from Sunderland named the General Havelock, there being four in total plus a sister ship Lady Havelock, his model I understand being based on the last one initially name Leona.

In a newspaper article written an published by The Scarborough News • in April 2014 (see below, if interested) I have seen an image of a model based on the “Genaeral Havelock” which I believe to be the same General Havelock (formerly, Leona) .

https://www.thescarboroughnews.co.uk/news/stricken-steam-coaster-ss-general-havelock-1-6577418

Unfortunateley, the story provided and the image of a model do not tie up… the storey is about the second steamer General Havelock, an original photos of that ship being built in the Laings collection (the ship builder)  archived at the Tyne and Wear Museum do not match the model in the paper …and by taking the proportions/ratios of length, width and depth they also do not match those of the ship depicted in the article.

I was wondering if the model they have a photo of (in the article) was Bryan Youngs' model, the model in the article does however replicate a vessel in a photo, held at the National Maritime Museum, of the steamerl formerly named Leona then General Havelock, which is the ship Bryan scratched built as a model.

I hope this post in not inappropiate for this forum and that hopefully spmeone may be able to help.

Regards, John


PS hope that was not too long winded and that you were able to follow it and my request
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dreadnought72

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Re: General Havelock
« Reply #1 on: August 10, 2018, 02:19:46 pm »

Hi John,


All the photos seem to be on the thread still: [size=78%]http://www.modelboatmayhem.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,5905.0.html[/size]


Cheers,


Andy
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Kentish John

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Re: General Havelock
« Reply #2 on: August 10, 2018, 03:11:07 pm »

Dreadnought72 thank you for your fast response…

That makes it even more interesting.

The plans are of the second steamer General Havelock of Sunderland, built 1868, not the Leona even though they are titled as such. So who got it wrong?
The author of the book "Coastal & Short Sea Liners" by C.V.Waine
Mr Laing the shipbuilder as the images from his album of the ship I have just mentioned above being built is the same ship as in the plans the model is based on…

Here is one of the images of the ship General Havelock 1868 (not the Leona)


The Leona is in the image below



Curious ?

— John
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Kentish John

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Re: General Havelock
« Reply #3 on: August 10, 2018, 05:18:57 pm »

I also want to add that it becomes more of a mistery with the dimensions, Bryan Young states for the General Havelock which are :—

201' x 29' x 13' — this are not the measurements for any of the steamers General Havelocks of Sunderland

The closet General Havelock to these would be the third one built 1895 and sold of and became the Kennet these were 210' x 28.2' x 13.7'

The first General Havelock was 185' x 24' x 14' Official No. 29,858
The second was 190' x 26.3' x 14.4' Official No. 62,496
The third one as above which became the Kennet 210' x 28.2' x 13.7' Official No. 104,354
Then the fourth one which started as the Leona 128' x 24.4' x 11.7' Official No. 67,843

So the plans/outline drawings from CV Waines books looks like the Second General Havelock, the measurements are like those of the third General Havelock and it is labelled as the Leona, which became the fourth and last General Havelock for that Sunderland Cargo/Passenger Line.

May need to by the book to see what is going on …!!!
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Colin Bishop

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Re: General Havelock
« Reply #4 on: August 10, 2018, 06:07:38 pm »

Very intriguing! As far as length is concerned figures quoted in contemporary documents are often BP - between perpendiculars - and do not include fore and oft overhangs such as, for example, a counter stern. Not sure if that helps any though!
Colin
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