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Author Topic: Lights - advice please  (Read 1696 times)

leachim

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Lights - advice please
« on: October 24, 2019, 04:59:47 PM »

Still working through my Occre Ulyses Steam Tug kit making steady progress and am looking to add working lights. The illustration with the kit shows a light at the top of the mast (anchor light I presume) then 3 lamps facing forward (one white mast head light and two white towing lights I think). Now here is where I have a query. The illustration with the kit show a single lamp facing rearwards would this be the yellow rear towing light? If so where would the white stern light be? as there is no indication on the kit plans of any lighting aft of the mast other than the red and green navigation lamps on the cabin roof.


Hope someone can help as it's doing my head in!


Mike
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Skimmer Fan

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Re: Lights - advice please
« Reply #1 on: October 24, 2019, 05:11:49 PM »


I do not know if this link will help you.
www.bosunsmate.org/seamanship/lights.php


 Found this on another web site.
The Amber stern facing towing light was not accepted internationally until some time in the late 70's or early 80's (I believe) so your photos may not show it.
 
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Stan

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Re: Lights - advice please
« Reply #2 on: October 24, 2019, 05:15:35 PM »

HI look for butts on mayhem and send him a pm.

Stan. :-)) :-)) :-)) :-)) :-)) :-))
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Akira

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Re: Lights - advice please
« Reply #3 on: October 24, 2019, 06:43:56 PM »

I believe, and don't bet me too hard if i get this wrong, that There should be one mast head light showing 360 degrees, the three white towing lights showing 135 degrees, the two colored nav lights, and the rear facing white light should show 180 degrees as it is a nav light. This can vary depending on which set of lighting regulations are used, but I think that that is the international set up.
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T888

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Re: Lights - advice please
« Reply #4 on: October 25, 2019, 06:20:10 AM »

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leachim

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Re: Lights - advice please
« Reply #5 on: October 25, 2019, 12:21:13 PM »

Many thanks for the replies. I have followed the links and they have been very helpful however I have the problem of locating where on my boat to place the lights.
 I bought a lighting kit from Mobile Marine Models and have been referring to their schematic that shows an anchor light at the top of the mast, a masthead light and two towing lights facing forward, red and green nav lights then a white stern light and a yellow towing light.


I attach a photo of the picture on the box and have marked up where I thing the various lights should be. I am still a little confused as to where I should place the stern light, would it have been on the rear of the mast or further aft in which case where would it have been located typically? Also I cannot decide where the yellow towing light should be on my boat. Surely it must have been forward of the towing hook or it could have been taken out by the tow rope.


Any ideas?


Mike
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Colin Bishop

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Re: Lights - advice please
« Reply #6 on: October 25, 2019, 01:07:14 PM »

Have a look at Section 4.6.2.1 here:

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/291901/00_-_msis_10_rev_4.0_draft_v2.pdf

It covers the problem of not being able to mount stern lights right aft on towing vessels and suggests the end of the accommodation instead. For example, above the towing hook.

Colin
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Skimmer Fan

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Re: Lights - advice please
« Reply #7 on: October 25, 2019, 01:19:16 PM »

Just came across the positioning of the rear facing navigation light the Brocklebank in Liverpool.
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Akira

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Re: Lights - advice please
« Reply #8 on: October 25, 2019, 01:21:07 PM »

I would tend to agree with Colin. Mounting the stern light on the mast, even a bit lower than the mast light, would, at a distance, appear as an anchor light. Do you have access to photos of the real boat?
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leachim

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Re: Lights - advice please
« Reply #9 on: October 26, 2019, 12:13:34 PM »

There is room on the mast at the rear of the accommodation block although the plans show no lights there I may just fabricate something as it looks right. I'm still at a loss to understand quite what the lamp on the rear of the mast is for as I'm sure that there is a need for separation between the forward lights and the stern light to give an impression of the boats length in the dark. Would the white stern light and the yellow towing light be placed together?


As far as photographs are concerned I've not found anything and can only assume that the kit is a typical 1960's ocean going steam tug and not a specific boat. I know there are a couple of Ulyses builders on Mayhem, what did you do regarding lights?


Mike
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Netleyned

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Re: Lights - advice please
« Reply #10 on: October 26, 2019, 02:17:05 PM »

Masthead lights signify the vessel's length.
The running lights should be off when the
vessel is at anchor with just the anchor light
and perhaps some upperdeck lighting on.


Ned
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Umi_Ryuzuki

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Re: Lights - advice please
« Reply #11 on: October 26, 2019, 07:14:09 PM »

There is room on the mast at the rear of the accommodation block although the plans show no lights there I may just fabricate something as it looks right. I'm still at a loss to understand quite what the lamp on the rear of the mast is for as I'm sure that there is a need for separation between the forward lights and the stern light to give an impression of the boats length in the dark. Would the white stern light and the yellow towing light be placed together?


As far as photographs are concerned I've not found anything and can only assume that the kit is a typical 1960's ocean going steam tug and not a specific boat. I know there are a couple of Ulyses builders on Mayhem, what did you do regarding lights?


Mike

The single white on the back of the mast would all a mariner would need to see to know that they are behind another vessel.
Sailing to either side of that lamp would eventually bring into view either of the colored side marking lamps, when overtaking.

On a model however, when sailing at night, there is a bit of pleasure in setting the white stern mast light father aft, and
also making it 360 visible.  By setting it up this way, you can watch the two white mast lamps align, or swing apart as
the model turns. Then verify your sailing left or right by the color, red or green, marking lamp that appears.

Sailing directly away will show only the two white lamps in alignment.
Sailing directly toward will show the two colored marking lamps, and the white lamps in alignment..

May not be accurate to maritime regulations, but sincerely a pleasure in the dark to know the model's heading.
 :-))

leachim

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Re: Lights - advice please
« Reply #12 on: October 29, 2019, 05:45:38 PM »

OK now a problem has emerged. I have three white LED's wired in parallel on my mast they work fine when connected via a resistor to the battery. I have this afternoon added a yellow LED attached also in parallel with the same resistor but when I connect to the battery the yellow one lights up but the others don't. Polarity must be correct or it wouldn't light up. Any suggestions why it does this?
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cos918

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Re: Lights - advice please
« Reply #13 on: October 29, 2019, 06:32:46 PM »

The yellow LED needs less current to run . The resistor can only run so many LED. You maxed it out with 3 whites. Now you added a yellow. It can not diliver enough current to light up all 4 leds. You will need to run the yellow LED on its own resitor and wire.

John
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leachim

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Re: Lights - advice please
« Reply #14 on: October 29, 2019, 06:38:03 PM »

Thanks John. I did wonder if that might be the case. I will need to run another positive up the mast.

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leachim

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Re: Lights - advice please
« Reply #15 on: November 07, 2019, 12:16:56 PM »

Ok stupid question time


I have run a separate positive feed up the mast to my yellow LED connecting the negative to a common with the rest of the lights there. It is lighting up but is very dim. Does this mean that I have to large a resistor or does it need its own negative? The resistor I'm using was supplied with the LED so I have to assume it's correct. I'm sure it lit up more brightly before so can't quite understand what's happening. You will have guessed that I'm a novice when it comes to electronics.


Mike
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grendel

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Re: Lights - advice please
« Reply #16 on: November 07, 2019, 03:14:27 PM »

different colour LED's may have different resistors required
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C-3PO

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C-3PO

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Re: Lights - advice please
« Reply #18 on: November 07, 2019, 05:08:23 PM »

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leachim

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Re: Lights - advice please
« Reply #19 on: November 07, 2019, 05:31:05 PM »

6 volt


brown / black / red / gold (according to my wife whose colour vision is much better than mine)









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C-3PO

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Re: Lights - advice please
« Reply #20 on: November 07, 2019, 05:59:37 PM »

Hi Mike

Here is an online resistor calculator

https://www.digikey.co.uk/en/resources/conversion-calculators/conversion-calculator-resistor-color-code-4-band

And here is a generic LED resistor calculator

https://www.kitronik.co.uk/blog/led-resistor-value-calculator/

Your brown/black/red/gold = 1k Ohms 5% which is about 5 times too much resistance!! hence a dim LED

Typically a Yellow LED @ 6v needs something more like 220 ohms (red/red/brown) or possibly 180 ohm (brown/grey/brown)

Doing this from memory which is always dangerous! - sure someone will correct me if I am wrong...

C-3PO
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Stan

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Re: Lights - advice please
« Reply #21 on: November 08, 2019, 06:01:37 PM »

Hi sent you pm did you receive?

Stan.
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leachim

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Re: Lights - advice please
« Reply #22 on: November 08, 2019, 11:10:15 PM »

PM replied to, Thanks Stan


Mike
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Stan

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Re: Lights - advice please
« Reply #23 on: November 11, 2019, 07:50:59 AM »

Hi Mike use the formula in the back of the Component Shop book for either parallel or in series it makes the use of this type lighting simple all the best.




Stan
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meechingman

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Re: Lights - advice please
« Reply #24 on: November 12, 2019, 09:10:15 AM »

Or you could just make up a simple 'power supply' for all your LEDs and do away with the need for any resistors. If I assume that your LEDs all require 3v, then a small piece of breadboard with a 3V voltage regulator would suffice. That's what I've done on all of mine. On the largest model with a mix of LED and 3V GOW illumination, I've started with a 5V regulator and put a set of miniature pots on the board. So I have 3V for the LEDs and several variable voltages for the GOW (bright for exterior, dimmer for interior).
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