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[warspite]

I am no scratch builder - in fact the only scratch build is currently stalled, and the most I build are normal plastic kits designed for static display converted i.e. Airfix, Matchbox, Revell etc, and even then after 30 years I have only completed 5 and one on the slipway.

[ChrisF]

My area of drawing expertise comes from building, initially as an architectural technician and then through my many years as a building surveyor and project manager. In the days of drawing by hand I saw some really poor examples of draughtsmanship (sometimes by architectural consultants/companies) and when CAD became the norm many drawings were "flat" as different line thicknesses etc. weren't being used.

I'm not using CAD at the moment, but will do at some point - still got to decide on the software. I'm using Microsoft Visio, and know exactly what you mean about the skill and time required to produce good quality drawings. I think that it will be a natural progression for me to get into 3D printing as I have always really enjoyed the design and drawing side of things, whether buildings or model boats.

Chris

[DaveM]

Around 20 years ago I was sponsored to go to night-school (remember those?) to take a C&G course in 2D AutoCAD so that I could draw Model Slipway's plans and instructions and use the parts shapes generated as cutting/printing files. Lawrie reckoned it was the best hundred quid he ever spent. My old XP machine died recently and without it I couldn't use my venerable copy of R14, so I bought a copy of AutoCAD 2014 on 'Tinternet to run on Windows 7. Having already used R14 I find ACad 2014 quite intuitive as many of the icons and commands are the same. I'd recommend it to anyone who wants a serious CAD program without the eye-watering expense of leasing the very latest version from Autodesk. Naturally as the industry standard CAD software it is fully 3D-capable, although a combination of indolence and cowardice has so far stopped me from venturing into that world! I did also once buy a copy of TurboCAD but I never got round to trying it.

As far as using a PC to draw plans and parts I don't see any philosophical difference between that and using Rotring pens and a huge drawing board. It's still 'all my own work' and it has many advantages over the old ways. Similarly where's the huge leap of logic from tracing a shape onto a sheet of ply and cutting the part out by hand with a fretsaw to plotting the same shape on a computer for a machine to cut it out for you? It's only the same guy using a different set of skills - it's not intrinsically 'cheating'. After all, no-one can reasonably claim that AutoCAD is easier to use than a pencil... 

DaveM

[Subculture]

I use fusion 360 which is an autodesk product. It’s freely licensed for hobby use, and exceedingly powerful. It’s very easy to go from a design to make stage in 3D or cnc. Being highly integrated it gets around a pet hate of mine with software- having to learn two or three separate packages to get the job done. I think if you need more features, then you must be doing something exceedingly advanced.

[grendel]

as a fully fledged draughtsman I find fusion frustratingly limited in what it can do, i get to a point and think, I want to do this here and cant so i get incredibly frustrated.
I do use the student version of full autocad (free if you sign up as a student or mentor) and am currently running 3 different versions of CAD in the 2019 versions Plain autocad, autocad map 3d and autocad civil, I still prefer microstation for 3d work, but my home use licence finally expired about 9 months back

[warspite]

I too used R14 autocad when I worked at a previous company (sadly now closed - best ever company I ever worked for), I regularly used to astound the MD with the 3D visualisations I created with the solids element of clients building layouts with our equipment inside, I used to only have the walls go a metre above the floor so you could see the equipment and where it went from and to, if there was a beam that went above the ducting - that would be shown to indicate that we had accounted for the obstruction, in fact, I even drew the several floor levels above each other and the duct run for a project in a IRAQ bank, where the main equipment we supplied was in the underground car park and the staff equipment was on the ground floor, but I indicated the structural problem that had occurred under the first floor where the duct was to run, and the open atrium that they expected the duct to cross.


Sadly my youngest wiped the program from my home computer in his zeal to change the motherboard, he could not get it to work with the hard drive and the win 7 installed - so instead of using the spare hard drive in the pc, wiped the main hard drive - idiot.

[Subculture]

Can't say Fusion has restricted me in any way so far. If there are things I can't do with it, it isn't the package, as I've seen what others achieve, so it's my own skill level that's the bottleneck.

There are also loads of online tutorials which are of enormous help.

I guess if CAD is your stock and trade and you're fluent in a few packages, then Fusion might seem to be a bit of a toy, but I personally don't like things too complicated, a I believe it can hinder rather help creativity.

[Kenhsilver]

As a beginner in model boat building but having some experience in garden steam rail models, I am finding this discussion really interesting.
In the past I have designed and printed 3D parts where commercial equivalents were too expensive or unavailable. Not being a draftsman I  learnt a simple 3D modelling drawing program from scratch. After a lot of mistakes (experience?), I have now a whole range of parts that are to scale and quite true to the prototype.
Modelling requires us all to learn or brush up on in lots of areas. For my own part on playing with live steam and building an outside track, I have had to relearn how to silver solder, cut and shape wood, plastic and metal, use a lathe, program an 8 bit microprocessor and a ton of other workshop skills. All that help me enjoy producing models that I can feel proud of. 
3D printing is a new technology but still a skill that fabricates a part that is original. Therefore it is compatible of taking a block of wood and turning it into a item of use in a model. Both start with imagination and possibly drawings if you are lucky.


Started kit bashing with the Aeronaut Queen but already mystified by lots of areas that most boat builders understand and take for granted. I can already see the option of 3D printing some fittings. Still fighting with the resin or lacquer inside decision but will get there in the end.
This is a great forum, thank you.

[RST]

I hve been modelling for 35+ years.  I am a recent convert to things like 3-D printing, in fact I resisted for many years but embrace the tech now.

...I am at the point of printing small hulls for real now.  I printed 2 or 3 so far and my goodness from what I have been through I expect a purist to not only produce their only pencil and paper, following a plan is a cheat, the fact I produce from cad -pff, I've had to learn, CAD isn't a cheat anyway!  To print something it may seem easy, but I spend ages on trials and failed prints.  I have to learn how to print a part based on experience and usually aftwrwards I spend allot of time sanding and making things fit.  To this end I would claim somoeone making a mould from scratch and casting duplicates faling foul of scratchbuilding also!!!!!

I am guilty of using off the shelf fittings.  I modify almost every single one into a custom part.  I would never normally claim entirely scratch built but I must object when it comes to 3-D printing these days.  As long as you're not just arbitrarily using 3-d files.  Least for me, it has just become  new tool, and the fact I have to build my new printer, I ask whether you pure "scratch" builders consider yourself different compared to us who built our own printer in the first place.  The world / tech. moves on.

Even the roughest "draughtsman" can produce a perfect part, so you don't even have to be able to draw well.

...LoL LoL LoL not true but so true many draughtmen can't draw!!!!!  Even my drawing office managers over the years take offence someone could draw, nevermind produce a rendered sketch. I have had so much "guff" produced by draughtsmen over many years I find it very difficult to manage these days.