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Author Topic: What would you rather bee or a wasp?  (Read 20577 times)

Andy M

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What would you rather bee or a wasp?
« on: February 08, 2020, 03:07:25 pm »

Here is my next attempt at a bodyshell, I was looking for something a bit different, think this might qualify. My intention was to make up this papercraft hornet, then measure it all and make a balsa version that would take my rotors. Having made the papercraft version, apart from attaching its wings, I decided to weigh it..... 62g without wings. Very respectable, but that's about 8 or 9 of my 1/32 x 4 x 18 inch balsa sheets. I might be able to build to same kind of weight, and with strength built where I need it to be. Needs strong enough legs to land on. Could manage with 2 strong legs and have its posterior as the 3rd point of contact or go for 4 strong legs with a dangly wavy pair in the middle. I also fancied clear plastic sheet wings to vibrate in the airstream. I will look and see if I have some suitable plastic. I don't know whether it's worth adding the weight of a balsa load bearing structure to the paper model, which would be hard to do now its all glued together or just incorporate it from the start as I draw my plans for the balsa model.
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Capt Podge

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Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
« Reply #1 on: February 08, 2020, 03:16:41 pm »

Well, that's something different!
The body shape suggests it's a wasp :-)


Regards,
Ray.
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Andy M

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Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
« Reply #2 on: February 08, 2020, 03:44:59 pm »

I have to give some credit to RST and his paper boat,  it got me thinking of looking in papercraft for a cobra helicopter pattern to get ideas from. I don't know when I got sidetracked, but  I spent a while looking for a decent looking wasp one with no joy, then spotted this giant asian hornet one. For some reason the pdf files wouldn't open on my old laptop so I took screenshots on my phone and spliced them together in photo shop and scaled them up to size you see. Traced all parts off the screen and transferred to 180gsm paper by flipping tracing paper over and going back over all the lines. Here is a photo with the paper wings taped on.
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Andy M

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Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
« Reply #3 on: February 08, 2020, 03:49:38 pm »

There is more than enough room in its thorax (leggy wingy bit) to take the rotors, control board and the battery. I may just make a balsa reinforced one of these and use paper stingy bit and head. Never built a hornet before. Lol. The legs will be a bit of a task.
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Capt Podge

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Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
« Reply #4 on: February 08, 2020, 04:10:08 pm »

That's a helluva challenge you're taking on Andy - wish you well with it.  :-))


Regards,
Ray.
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Andy M

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Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
« Reply #5 on: February 08, 2020, 04:19:22 pm »

Cheers Ray, I managed the Seaknight and Jetranger, they were good training for attempting this beastie! I noticed the photo shows a gap I ended up with at the front upper left corner of the thorax bit, right where I would be thinking of putting the rotor arms. Perfect. However, making this out of balsa will be a challenge, here is the pattern for the paper one, which although fiddly, actually went together really well. It is my first go at papercraft, and I made it big. I am quite happy with the result. It weighs 72g with paper wings and no structure. I can still add about 130g to it and it will still fly. A good test for my balsa skills to try and get even one section of it out of balsa.
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Andy M

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Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
« Reply #6 on: February 08, 2020, 06:24:13 pm »

A bit more thought on how I am going to proceed, in paper, the stingy pod at the back is 40 g, assuming I can match this with a balsa version, it will be 40g extending way back of the rotors compared to the head up front, which in paper is 7g and close to the centre. I will probably put my 40g battery in the head, or close. This should be enough to avoid the tailslide tendency of the jetranger. I will obviously build as light as I can, but it has to be strong enough to survive some 'heavy landings' as I like to call them. I am going to have a go at painting the paper hornet, only I am going to do it more of a wasp yellow colour scheme, the real giant hornet is a kind of plain reddish brown and black. I have fair bit of yellow leftover from jetranger that will do my balsa version. Painting the paper one will spur me on to work on the balsa one.
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Umi_Ryuzuki

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Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
« Reply #7 on: February 08, 2020, 07:35:34 pm »

Paper modeling is not easy...  %)

Andy M

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Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
« Reply #8 on: February 08, 2020, 09:00:33 pm »

A bit of yellow. My jetranger paint is gloss enamel, the paper model is painted with poster paint. Dries much faster.
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Capt Podge

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Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
« Reply #9 on: February 08, 2020, 09:07:00 pm »

The more I see of this, the more I'm liking it - not something I could have a go at though - hands are too shaky for delicate work - good to follow your progress though.  O0


Regards,
Ray.
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Andy M

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Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
« Reply #10 on: February 08, 2020, 10:01:18 pm »

Some black makes a difference, still got to do the legs obviously. The small white patches on the thorax are for wing attachment.
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Andy M

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Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
« Reply #11 on: February 08, 2020, 11:22:15 pm »

I noticed that there is nothing in the photos to show its size yet, so here it is, a 17 1/2 inch giant Asian hornet disguised as a wasp. Thickest part of its body is the fat end of the stingy bit at  6 1/2 inches wide. I may modify bits of it to make it more wasp like, like a longer pointier abdomen and a pointier face but I dont know yet. I would probably be starting with the sting end so that I can overlap my skins to look like the plates of the real one. Anyone got wasp 3 views? And I don't mean the westland helicopter. I have even thought about making the end of the tail as a balanced bit that hung on a hook inside the fixed body so it could swing about a certain amount like a nodding dog type affair. I can limit its movement so it doesn't flail about or drop off. It's just an idea but I need to keep going over all the ideas to see if and how I am going to use them. The undercarriage will be hardest to do I think, it has to be spindly, strong and light. A real set would be awesome but they don't come in this size. Lol. I have a few grams extra to play with this time, jetranger landing gear was 30g, that was two lengths of knitting needle, and 2 bits of marshmallow stick, I expect the hornet landing gear to be heavier than that. If I don't want it crumpling on landing anyway. I have a pointed end off of one of the knitting needles, this will probably be the sting, and will be used for landing on, along with the two front legs. It probably only weighs a few grams, leaving the rest of the estimated 30g for making the front legs. The 2 pairs of rear legs can be lightweight as they won't be load bearing. I am getting into this project now, we have a storm happening here just now, so seems like right time to be drawing my plans up. Or some of them at least. Just realised it will be difficult to have its rear end nodding and be strong enough to land on. Ah well, less complex doing it fixed. And lighter.
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Capt Podge

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Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
« Reply #12 on: February 08, 2020, 11:43:58 pm »

Hi Andy, been thinking about the legs - have you considered the strands from a metal whisk? they are usually strong and springy which should be good for landing on... Oh, and the stingy end is simply known as the Abdomen  :-))


Regards,
Ray.
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Andy M

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Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
« Reply #13 on: February 08, 2020, 11:56:01 pm »

That might work, but metal is heavy, so will keep that idea till I see what weight I can have. I already wrote about doing a more pointy abdomen to make it more wasp like. I was thinking about the landing gear and weirdly thought about using crab legs......
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Andy M

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Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
« Reply #14 on: February 09, 2020, 01:47:08 pm »

Still not painted the legs. It's fairly pale painted with poster paint but shows me what I can expect when I paint balsa version with gloss enamels. I am probably going to pointify the abdomen, this will add a couple of inches to the overall length, I was also going to make the head a bit better, the paper version is basically flat with curved back edges. I really want the head to be more 3d, hopefully with enough room to take my battery and help balance the weight of its abdomen. If I can find another pair of knitting needles, I will probably use them for the front legs. They proved to be pretty strong on the jetranger. I haven't drawn any plans yet but I am working out how things are going to go together. Should be an interesting build. I took a note of how much the paper version's sub-assemblies weighed before I glued them together.Head 7g Legs 15g Body 40g Wings 10g Total 72g   It will be interesting to see how much the balsa version weighs, the paper version is just too flimsy to take flight and landing loads, even reinforced with balsa. And painting it with poster paint soggied it up in places where it dried to nice undulating shape.  I don't know what shape its legs will be after painting. All helpful though, I was considering a balsa reinforced paper version, but not now, it has to be balsa. The paper version has dried now and stiffened up a bit, enough to get measurements from. I might try a paper abdomen extension to see how it looks. Hopefully get some drawing done later.
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Andy M

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Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
« Reply #15 on: February 09, 2020, 05:02:58 pm »

Oooh he doesn't like the jetranger! Or being taped to a box for measuring. And said dimensions jotted down ready to be used when I draw my plan.
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Capt Podge

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Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
« Reply #16 on: February 09, 2020, 05:12:25 pm »

It's looking meaner with every new update  :o
You're getting nearer to the starting line for the balsa job now Andy...


Regards,
Ray.
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Andy M

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Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
« Reply #17 on: February 09, 2020, 05:34:21 pm »

Some drawing and hunting through my scraps boxes for suitable balsa for formers. I have already ordered a batch of 1/32 balsa for skinning. I have some 18 inch sheets leftover after building jetranger. I need to keep 2 sheets of it for my jetranger dummy rotor blades.
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Andy M

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Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
« Reply #18 on: February 09, 2020, 05:39:26 pm »

Because I am going to be fitting the quad pods in an x formation rather than sticking straight out sideways, as in jetranger and seaknight, I have to move motors out further to save downwash hitting body. I have correct size carbon square section in stock so not a problem.
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Andy M

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Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
« Reply #19 on: February 10, 2020, 03:13:28 pm »

Thought I would put on a couple of photos of the real beastie. Not as scary colour scheme as a wasp. It sure is a mean beast, I watched a couple of videos on them, one video shows the hornet getting the better of a praying mantis, another shows the mantis winning. I also read a guy got stung and said it was like a hot nail being driven into his leg. Maybe our wee wasps aren't so bad after all, at least they don't get to that size.
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Andy M

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Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
« Reply #20 on: February 10, 2020, 05:32:43 pm »

Think I may have just found some menacing wobbly antenna(e?) And recycled some old stained fuel tubing at the same time, I knew it would come in handy some day. I sold all my engines years ago and bought electric setups with the money, thinking electric would be safer for my children to use......but they haven't any interest in it. Ah well.I hope to get pencil to paper and get a plan happening. I will probably have to    check what balsa I have in my scraps boxes as I draw it. I only have 3 spare 1/32 x 18 x 4 inch sheets and a 12 x 4 inch bit of hard 3/16. And about 10 scraps boxes. Having built well over 100 planes, and kept all the scraps, I have a few kg of scraps! All weird shapes though. I have built a few planes entirely from my scraps boxes but prefer nice new wood. I did a small tug once where I built the Hull up in layers of crazy paving style scraps, once it was sanded and painted it looked pretty good, some of the glue lines showed up but looked like plating.Anyway, hope to get drawing later, wife bought me a nice A2 pad, so I have no excuse. I usually draw on tracing paper so I can check sizes of parts easily from plan to side or front views. I am still deciding whether to do a hornet or a wasp head on it. Wasp head is a bit more pointy. I am definitely extending the abdomen as in my sketch, it's going to be best solution, it was almost at the ground anyway. Also uses up pointy end of one of the knitting needles I made the jetranger landing gear from. I need to hunt for another two now for the front legs on what I am now calling my "xxxxx" giant hornet wasp.The second photo is what I am aiming for/using as a guide, its the only view I have of this particular one. I might do the head slightly larger for effect and also to balance the weight of the abdomen and it would make it easier to get my battery in there, the perfect outcome would be that I get my overall weight low enough to use my 2500mah battery.
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Andy M

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Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
« Reply #21 on: February 10, 2020, 11:04:20 pm »

Made a start on the plan, head is going to be difficult to replicate while still keeping it light, though I probably will need to balance the tail weight, depends how heavy the abdomen ends up
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Andy M

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Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
« Reply #22 on: February 12, 2020, 06:28:51 pm »

I have been working on my jet ranger recently  but I have been thinking about my Japanese hornet wasp, I have even cut new 5mm square carbon motor pod arms to 200 mm. I have been looking at my drawing, still not that sure on the dimensions and proportions, I want to try extending the thorax forward a bit while keeping the front rotors where I had planned, adding structure forward of the balance point. Also the head, front legs and wings will be forward a bit too. I think the head looks too small in my drawing, anyone else think I should make it bigger?
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Andy M

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Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
« Reply #23 on: February 19, 2020, 09:59:35 pm »

I have been thinking about the hornet, although I modified it from the original papercraft plan/model, I am still not happy enough with my plan of it to start making it yet. The picture above the plan is what I am aiming for, maybe a bit ambitious but if I get halfway between the paper version and that photo, I will be well happy. I have sourced my front landing gear/legs. A small selection of knitting needles in various thicknesses. Perfect. I am impressed with how well the ones on my jetranger have handled heavier landings. Anyway, I am hoping to redraw my plans soon and try to get the shape a bit better. I was thinking of some kind of thin foam tubing to thicken up the front (knitting needle) legs, and also use that for back legs. Just waving about. I actually dont like wasps, dont really know why I picked this as a project but I am determined to have a nice shiny giant hornet (wasp) in my flying collection. One of the things I wanted to do when I redraw my plans is to make it slightly bigger, it is a bit smaller than I wanted really, when I did the card model, I scaled it to fit biggest paper I had. It let me see a 3d version tho. Another 3 to 4 inches would probably be a decent increase, while the structure I was planning should remain much the same........ Overengineered. Lol. My structures could be much lighter, but they have to stand up to sanding, sheeting and handling.... Then usually some kind of heavy landings for whatever reason, usually pilot error.
 I have attached a diagram of a wasp I found while researching.
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Capt Podge

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Re: What would you rather bee or a wasp?
« Reply #24 on: February 19, 2020, 10:19:24 pm »

 {-) {-) {-)


I particularly like the label for the 'dagger'.


Hope your idea takes off (and lands) %) ...


Regards,
Ray.
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