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Author Topic: Endeavour UK Challenger 1934  (Read 707 times)

dlancast

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Endeavour UK Challenger 1934
« on: July 05, 2020, 10:40:47 PM »

Dear Folks,


I have started the build of Amati's kit of the Endeavour "J" racing yacht.  The 1934 UK cup challenger at a scale of 1:35. This will be a static build, as I am looking for a large sailboat model to act as a visual divider between my living and family rooms.  Currently, I have a tramp steamer model on display at that location.  With a hull length of 48", beam of over 9" and mast height from deck to top of mast of 5ft.  The kit provides very good details in wood, brass PE, brittania metal fittings and full set of sails.  She should be an impressive model providing that I can do justice to the build.  The frames, keelsons, deck beams, etc. are computer laser cut from 1/4" thick sheets of birtch ply.  I have started the build with the bow, or stem section of the hull, mounting and gluing bulkhead frames to keel.  The hull will be assembled in 3 sections and then joined, primarily with deck beams.  Then the hull will be double planked with lime wood, then mahogany as final layer.  I have just finished the bow section, finding the fit to be very tight, which required a long process of sanding and fitting.  The laser cutting is very precise and the frame goes together tight and straight.  I must decide if I want to install balsa backing between the frames to provide a better platform for laying down planks and sanding the frame edges true to the proper hull curve.  I see many hours of work ahead of me, but it is nothing I haven't done before and sure love the process of a build like this.  I am really enjoying working with a large scale model and its a nice break from small scale work that I am more used to.  Well, enough blab, I do hope you folks will enjoy this build as much as I'm hoping to.  Regards,  Dennis
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dlancast

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Re: Endeavour UK Challenger 1934
« Reply #1 on: July 05, 2020, 10:41:18 PM »

more.
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SailorGreg

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Re: Endeavour UK Challenger 1934
« Reply #2 on: July 06, 2020, 04:59:13 PM »

I'm looking forward to this Dennis.  I am sure we will all enjoy the build, but probably not quite as much as you will!  (In case you don't know, there are a couple of build logs of this kit over on Model Ship World which might prove helpful.)

Greg

dlancast

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Re: Endeavour UK Challenger 1934
« Reply #3 on: July 06, 2020, 08:52:54 PM »

Thankyou Greg, yes, I have been referencing another on-line build that has given some very good suggestions from both the builder and members of the forum, that I am finding very helpful.  I have built "many" planked models over the years, so am used to this kind of thing.  This kit will give me a nice challenge and is just what I was looking for to display in my home.  I got a personal msg. from Roy and for some reason I can't send a response to him, so I'll respond here......   Interesting about the sail fabric supplied in the kit.  Instructions do say to "size" the fabric with a solution of white glue and water, let dry.. should give some stiffness to the sail to help eliminate sagging that you mentioned.  What I am considering doing as well, is to install wood backing as a filler between the frames to help with hull stability and provide a solid bed for planking.. you pretty much wind up with a solid hull to plank.  I did this with another planked model and it really helped to keep things solid and stable.  As I assemble the bow section, I have noticed that the fit is very tight and square and straight, but does require some sanding to allow an easier slide fit in the notches.  I have done some RC sailing, but never really got into it at a serious level.  I enjoy making a static model and try to bring in as much detail as I can.   Thanks for the kind responses, I know that I will enjoy this build... its not like I don't have alot of time on my hands... but, at 75 yrs old, time seems to be of essence.  Be well and be safe folks,  Dennis
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dlancast

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Re: Endeavour UK Challenger 1934
« Reply #4 on: July 13, 2020, 10:36:45 PM »

Framing is complete and ready for backing, then planking.  I don't know who that old fart is holding my model %%   Dennis
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dlancast

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Re: Endeavour UK Challenger 1934
« Reply #5 on: July 14, 2020, 06:16:32 AM »

The hull backing between frames has started.  its going to take alot of 3/8"x1/2"x36" sticks to fill the space required.  I have started emptying all the craft and hobby stores in town of their balsa supply, then I will go on-line.  It is not cheap, but the reward will be worth the cost.  This will take some time.  Dennis
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roycv

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Re: Endeavour UK Challenger 1934
« Reply #6 on: July 14, 2020, 11:05:03 AM »

Hi, having to produce a sailing version, I used 3mm liteply planking  to increase the total thickness of the planking which gave a nice base to plank on, then I diagonally planked the hull with the supplied lime (I think) wood. 
The hull is so nicely curved that it accepts the planking easily and where there are gaps they are all triangles and simple to cut from the planking.  I did not have to specailly fashion any 'stealers' at all.  Everything was straight cut short or long triangles.  Never seen that before.

The above with also doubling the width of the keel increased the displacement to 5Kgrms and still kept the waterline correct.  You might note the extended keel.
If I remember the deck planking is 2mm wide strip wood as it has to curve rather than steam it I found the PVA glue if left for a few seconds on the plank did the job just as well.
I chickened out when it came to the mast and used purpose made extruded aluminium mast  (11.1 mm dia,) with a luff groove, my sails were made from a melamine drawing office material had half inch lengths of plastic tubing attached with adhesive sail cloth.  The plastic tubes sliding down inside the luff groove.  The boom has about 80 tiny rings attaching the sail and I soldered these in place using lots of wet tissue to stop the sail material over heating.  Eyesight would stop me now!

I attach a picture I found of her at a Model Engineering exhibition where she had a bronze medal, very much to my surprise.
She sails very well but I did attach a string bumper to protect the finely pointed bow.
regards
Roy



 
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roycv

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Re: Endeavour UK Challenger 1934
« Reply #7 on: July 14, 2020, 11:25:13 AM »

Hi again I forgot I had a crew on board!  Looking at contemporary film of these craft sailing there were the Officers and the crew., mainly distinguished by their hats.
 
The officers wore peak caps but the crew all had my favourite (Rupert the Bear) sun hats.  I had some suitable size plastic figures and fashioned little plastic 'washers' to go on their heads to look like floppy hats.  My wife refuses to go out with me if I wear mine!
regards
Roy
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dlancast

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Re: Endeavour UK Challenger 1934
« Reply #8 on: July 14, 2020, 05:11:57 PM »

Thanks for sharing sir, she is a beautiful model and I am certain is quite a sight out on the pond.  Gads, she has a tall mast.  Yes, i have seen the planking method you describe done on another build, it is very effective.  I know that this hull will lend itself very well for planking, of which I have alot of experience from many plank on frame models over the years.  I really enjoy the process.  Amati requires that the builder double plank the model, starting with lime wood and finish with thin mahogany strips.  This makes for a beautiful wood hull if finished bright.  Such a shame to have to paint over such beauty.  They do suggest that you leave the bottom from waterline down bright and paint the rest blue.  I am giving this much thought as my model will be static and as a major display piece in my living room, I may just choose to show off all that lovely planking, with those beautiful hull lines, she should make a real statement.   After all, the original Endeavour had a hull of aluminum I have heard.   :-) Dennis
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roycv

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Re: Endeavour UK Challenger 1934
« Reply #9 on: July 14, 2020, 05:15:28 PM »

Hi don't forget the original is a metal hull, not wood.Roy
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roycv

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Re: Endeavour UK Challenger 1934
« Reply #10 on: July 14, 2020, 05:54:47 PM »

Hi I never used the thin mahogany planking to be honest it was not of the same quality as the Lime wood and 2 lots of planking achieved my requirements.  However it is currently being used as deck planking on a small fishing boat this minute.

My Yacht stand is probably more substantial then you would want as it was there to stop the yacht blowing over. 

The mast is the correct length and has 2 crosstrees the upper part is actually stressed with plastic covered wire to keep it from flexing. 
For travelling the whole of the mast and sails remove to fit into a specially made carrying case otherwise they would be easily damaged.  Your sails will be larger in area as I cut back the length of the main boom to enable a backstay to be mounted.

I had to double up the rudder area and even then the sails can overcome the rudder.  It was quite a game getting the tiller to operate at that angle.

I could take a photo of the shrouds location and fitting at deck level, this was taken from the film of her on return to the UK when the newsreels showed the construction close up.  This is different from the kit etched parts, up to you.  Also quite different from when she was launched.

Have you seen the Nauticalia video of Sailing in the 1920's?  Part of it covers building the of the Endeavour and launch plus there is a fleeting glimpse of more fittings at the bow.
I agree the planking was very pleasant.
Regards
Roy




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dlancast

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Re: Endeavour UK Challenger 1934
« Reply #11 on: July 14, 2020, 08:36:22 PM »

Tks again for the info.  I haven't researched the history of the Endeavour and I really should.  My thoughts are that originally, all I wanted was a "pond boat" model that was large and would fit in my living room on top of a short wall.  I have vaulted ceilings, so I can handle a pretty tall mast.  I wanted the model to make a statement as a display piece.  I could buy one ready made, but they tend to be very simplistic in detail, being mass produced, usually in China.  When I found this Amati kit, I was very impressed.  They are not 100% perfect in detail accuracy, but pretty close.  I'm just not going to attempt to make this a perfect museum model and this kit will produce a true enough representation of the Endeavour, that I would feel uncomfortable about telling my guests that this is a representation of the Endeavour and still be able to achieve what I started to obtain... plus, I can apply my own handywork, which just adds to the whole thing.  I'm serious, my home is really starting to look like a maritime museum, I have so many ship models in glass cases in several rooms of my home.  Thankfully, I have a very understanding and supportive wife.  I so love building models.  I have sold some and given others away to friends.. still, I'm running out of room and just can't afford to buy a bigger home.  I've often wondered what other model makers around the world have done about this issue.. its not just unique to me. {:-{   Dennis
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roycv

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Re: Endeavour UK Challenger 1934
« Reply #12 on: July 14, 2020, 11:14:53 PM »

Hi Dennis, I went down the other route I just do working models.  All have radio control I like to see them sailing.  I have crewed on a few yachts with friends but more often with my son mainly on 40 foot yachts.  Even though you are on the yacht you can't see the picture it makes going through the water.  I do enjoy having a big wheel in my hands and watching the sails and compass, my son's latest acquisition almost sails itself which is how I found out I can get a bit seasick!  The main thing is you get to know what everything does on a yacht and you get to see the detail.

 I think I have 10 yachts/sailboats including a lovely schooner pond yacht about 4' 6" loa.  Then there are an assorted collection of another 30 or so model boats with another 8 - 10 in-build. In the main all packed away or in boxes I am allowed a bedroom and a large cupboard.  Mostly all built by myself but there are a few I have taken in and restored and sail when I can.

I have one rather novel 'saved from the skip' clockwork boat which I have fitted out with RC to steer and turn the motor on and off.  Do not know who constructed her from wood but probably over 80 years old now but she restored nicely and the clockwork is great.
Had to sell a few for space reasons but I still do occasional restorations, so get the pleasure without having to find another space.

Sorry, rather gone off topic.
Best regards
Roy
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dlancast

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Re: Endeavour UK Challenger 1934
« Reply #13 on: July 20, 2020, 07:37:48 PM »

Backing continues, stbd side done, onto port side.  Very slow process and lots of balsa sticks.  I know this will be well worth the effort, as it will provide a good solid base for the inner limewood planks.  Those old "J" boats had beautiful and sleek hull lines.  Dennis
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dlancast

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Re: Endeavour UK Challenger 1934
« Reply #14 on: July 20, 2020, 07:38:15 PM »

more.
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roycv

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Re: Endeavour UK Challenger 1934
« Reply #15 on: July 27, 2020, 12:34:10 PM »

Hi nice to see your progress, you also mention research.  There is a web site for the J Class owners etc.  All of them have been rebuilt and in the case of Endeavour the deck layout was revised with modern machinery and probably to make her legal as well.  When found in the mud she was too fragile to move and the lead keel was gone.  This had been removed to make amunition during WW2.
 
Do note that all photos of the restored Endeavour have a waterline 12 inches (300mm) higher up than when originally launched.  This is because when racing in 1934 down below was a crude space for storage and maybe a cot but that was all.  Now Endeavour is fitted out with marble etc and has appropriate luxury accomodation.  The last asking price I have seen was 19M Euros.

The displacement is 143 tons. I think this is the current one with a glass fibre mast and most other things money can buy.  But the passenger accomodation and engine as installed now must have been an extra 25 tons at least, just my guess.  She also has a quite sizeable propellor which intrudes into the rudder area.
I do recommennd the Nauticalia video I mentioned, it will give you a feel for deck layout and rope storage etc.  It is too easy to do ropes up nicely and hang them in the wrong place.  You also get glaring errors like hanging fenders from cleats and still hanging there when sailing.  Highly frowned upon!
A book worth reading is Passage East by American Carlton Mitchel sailing a slightly smaller yacht from USA to UK with several photos of life on board but around the same time period.  His yacht was Carribee a plan which is in the Sarik archives.  The main thing wrong with that plan is that it has been collapsed in length but otherwise very good on detail. 

Anyone building her should stretch the plan about 20% in length and then print that, then she looks right.  I have a nice letter from him as well and he included a photograph and dimensions of Carribee from his collection.  When he arrrived in the UK he entered the sailing competitions in the Solent and won just about everything.

regards
Roy


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dlancast

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Re: Endeavour UK Challenger 1934
« Reply #16 on: July 27, 2020, 04:08:53 PM »

Thank you so much Roy for the great historical input.  I will be building this model of the Endeavour as she appeared in 1934, or at least, I will be following the plans.  As i mentioned, this model will be fulfilling my desire to have a "Pond boat" to display in my home.  I am confident that this kit will provide a beautiful representation of a "J" class challenger.  I did some basic research and noted the historical changes that were made on this beautiful yacht.  Amazing, the amount of money that was spent on her and a real tribute.  Beautiful and fast under sail, in spite of her added weight.  I will do the best job I can at producing a model that is pleasing to the eye and should impress my guests that come to visit.  To date, I have completed filling in the "backing" on the port side with balsa and will be fairing the hull today in preparation for laying on of the inner limewood planking..... Yes, I'm planking a steel hulled yacht.  The beauty and grace of her lines lends very well to planking.  I know that I will be painting the hull from the waterline up, including the white waterline stripe, i have yet to decide if I will leave the keel "bright", instead of painting red, just to try to show off the rich mahogany planks that will be the second layer of planks on the hull.  Got plenty of time to think that one through.  Take care,   Dennis
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dlancast

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Re: Endeavour UK Challenger 1934
« Reply #17 on: July 29, 2020, 05:56:14 AM »

Backing is in and hull is faired to receive first layer of planking.  Sub deck is taped on to align mast.  Boat support cradle is mocked in, not glued yet.  Very ingenious of Amati, cradle is two anchor shapes that receive the keel very nicely and firmly.  Nice touch in my opinion  Dennis
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dlancast

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Re: Endeavour UK Challenger 1934
« Reply #18 on: August 01, 2020, 10:22:24 PM »

The sub-deck has been nailed down.  Sub planking with limewood strips will begin next, starting at the deck level and working down.  Dennis
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dlancast

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Re: Endeavour UK Challenger 1934
« Reply #19 on: August 03, 2020, 02:08:40 AM »

Sub planking going down now.  Limewood planks 1-1/2mm thick x 4mm wide, glued with grizzly construction glue and push pins going easily into balsa backing.  Stern planks will require some tapering.  I'm not worrying about campferring plank edges as they take a radius, results in some gaping, but this planking will be covered with thinner mahogany planks, so gaps will show.  Sanding and fairing again after this first layer goes down.  I really enjoy this stage of the build.  Dennis
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roycv

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Re: Endeavour UK Challenger 1934
« Reply #20 on: August 03, 2020, 07:55:54 AM »

Hi re the planking.  I did diagonal planking following the line of the rudder. 

There is no need to taper any planks! 

They lay beautifully and the spaces are all triangles.  It was the easiest planking I have ever done.
Roy
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dlancast

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Re: Endeavour UK Challenger 1934
« Reply #21 on: August 03, 2020, 06:48:44 PM »

Tks Roy, now you tell me.....hahahahaha %% ... oh well, steady as she goes.  Dennis
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roycv

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Re: Endeavour UK Challenger 1934
« Reply #22 on: August 03, 2020, 07:05:47 PM »

Hi Dennis, see reply6.Roy
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dlancast

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Re: Endeavour UK Challenger 1934
« Reply #23 on: August 07, 2020, 07:54:47 PM »

Sub planking continues at break-neck speed %% .  Dennis
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dlancast

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Re: Endeavour UK Challenger 1934
« Reply #24 on: Yesterday at 07:07:33 AM »

Slow process, today, a few more planks and I did manage to get the mast tapered and sanded.  52".  I can now begin drilling hardware holes and making the mast ready.  I do love this hobby.... sure takes me away from the woes of the world as it is today. Cheers! Dennis
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