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Author Topic: River Queen - Vic Smeed  (Read 662 times)

colin-stevens

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River Queen - Vic Smeed
« on: September 18, 2020, 06:24:31 pm »

So, I have recently received the plans for River Queen and as this my first wooden hull in quite some time, and my first ever "planked" hull, I need help. Yes I know, gone in at the deep end, hey ho. The plans are for a Clinker hull. Can any one point in the direction of how to do this? Have a few ideas myself but some more informed advice would be good.


The plans show the moulds as being removable after planking, I was thinking of making them as frames and leaving them in situ,  so cutting out the inside but leaving a bar across the top for support and fixing to base board. Thoughts?


When planking a clinker hull, would you use the same techniques as discussed here
https://modelshipworldforum.com/resources/Framing_and_Planking/plankingprojectbeginners.pdf

Thinking further ahead, what's the best way to seal the hull? With a plank on frame I would have used a light cloth and resin. Pretty sure that wont be suitable for a clinker hull.


There will be loads more queries/help need further down the line but just these few queries are worth a few chapters of any one experience I'm sure.


Looking forward to any help


Many thanks


Colin.



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Jerry C

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Re: River Queen - Vic Smeed
« Reply #1 on: September 19, 2020, 12:41:33 am »

Hi Colin and welcome. I suggest you search the forum for Patternmaker- launch- Wide-A-Wake. This build was my guide for building, Jerry’s Steam Launch Wear which atm is near the top of the steam section on this site. I believe there are no shortcuts to a clinker built hull. The link you posted at first sight is specifically for carvel hull build hull (smooth) not clinker though a lot of its contents can be applied to clinker. I’ve only built clinker and not carvel so am ignorant when it comes to carvel.
The frames on clinker have to come out on completion of the planking on your build as it’s an open boat and all parts of the construction are “on show”.
For sealing the hull once built I just “ painted” inside with  epoxy resin (thin).
Study, study, and more study. Everything is on the plans one way or another. You’ve just got to find them. Don’t cut corners or try anything “different” or you’ll never get back on track. Don’t give up. If you come to a brick wall ask on here and you will be answered. Enjoy.
Jerry.

frazer heslop

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Re: River Queen - Vic Smeed
« Reply #2 on: September 19, 2020, 09:42:37 am »

Hi Colin,
            Iv made the River Queen and just finishing the River Princess. The frames do need to come out as already mentioned everything is on show. The ribs will add strength.
When I made the Queen I used 2 extra planks per side and had no problems. On the Princess I made her with 12planks per side as shown on the plan and had a load of problems turning the bilge nearly to the point of scrapping her .
When you start the build take time to make sure everything mounted to the building jig is true and square and on the centre line .It is the bed rock of the build even though it goes in the bin once she is planked.
cheers
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colin-stevens

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Re: River Queen - Vic Smeed
« Reply #3 on: September 19, 2020, 02:39:07 pm »

Thank you Jerry, found the build on RC Groups, came up blank on MBM. Think I will be referring to that quite a lot, beautiful.


Frazer, can the planks be straight, or do they need to be cut to shape?, and thank you.
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SailorGreg

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Re: River Queen - Vic Smeed
« Reply #4 on: September 19, 2020, 02:50:15 pm »

Good luck Colin.  I hesitate to add my two penn'th after the previous experienced builders, but like you I built River Queen as my first clinker hull, here.  I can only echo Jerry's and Fraser's advice - take it slowly, build carefully and precisely, and don't give up.  Especially don't give up.  There will be times you wonder how on earth you are going to make something fit properly, but persevere, and be ruthless in throwing out bits you have cut wrong, even by a tiny bit.  I think you can get some of my frustration from my build log, but it's worth it in the end, honestly!

(And Pattermaker's Wideawake log is here.)

Are going steam or electric?



Greg

frazer heslop

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Re: River Queen - Vic Smeed
« Reply #5 on: September 19, 2020, 03:03:56 pm »

On River Queen from memory the planks top edge was straight the lower curved
On Princess the planks are curved and If I had gone for 14 planks it would have been a doddle
As you build keep cleaning any excess glue of as its the devils own to get it clean enough to varnish once she is built. It must have been a bad job as I still remember struggling to get rid of glue marks on the Queen and she was built in the 1990s
As already mentioned dont glue any planks on that you are not fully happy with as it will bite you later
I tend to mark the frames for the number of planks and after gluing 4 planks on go back and remark the frames to get rid of accumulative error
As you can see in the pic I still had a few planks at the bow of different widths .
cheers
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colin-stevens

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Re: River Queen - Vic Smeed
« Reply #6 on: September 19, 2020, 04:20:51 pm »

Greg, thanks for that, and really hoping to go steam.. Also, where did you get that really useful  dinky little plane from? and what's it called? Thank you for the link, searches don't seem to work for me.
Many Thanks all, lots of really useful pointers here, hope I can get more.


Colin
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SailorGreg

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Re: River Queen - Vic Smeed
« Reply #7 on: September 19, 2020, 06:40:33 pm »

Yes, the search facility here on Mayhem leaves a little to be desired.  I had to hunt quite hard a while back now to find Patternmaker's build.

As for the plane, I am afraid I don't think I can help.  I came across it ages ago - it is intended as an insert to a small custom made wood plane, not really intended to be used on its own.  But where I got it from is now lost in the mists of time. I have tried a few searches but failed.  Sorry.  The nearest I could find were on Banggood, but I couldn't vouch for the quality.  The alternative if you are really flush is a plane like this.  That would be lovely, but is a bit rich for us I think!

But do keep asking - there's always an answer (or 10) to your questions here on Mayhem!

Greg

frazer heslop

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Re: River Queen - Vic Smeed
« Reply #8 on: September 19, 2020, 09:58:54 pm »

Shoulder plane to gut the geralding even Amazon has some cheap ones although a sharp chisel can do just as good a job with a bit of care
Block plane for thinning the planks
Didna realise I had a collectors item :-)
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Jerry C

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Re: River Queen - Vic Smeed
« Reply #9 on: September 20, 2020, 12:46:08 am »

I bought a set of three Rolson planes. Cheap as chips. Once I properly sharpened the blades and set them up correctly they turned out brilliant. Mainly used for putting the chamfer on the top edge of the last plank laid. I made a jig to set the correct angle. Should be a pic of it in use on my Wear build.
If memory serves the only planks that are straight on both sides are the garboards. ALL the rest have shape top and bottom. The stock required gets progressively wider as you progress towards the gunwales. Having a straight top may be the reason peeps have had problems getting the planks to lie correctly on the forms. Wear was slightly different to other boats in that the shearstrake widens aft for aesthetic reasons only. My stock planks were a max width of 2” but the top to planks needed 3 1/2” width stock due to the final shape. I ended up having to put scarfs in the middle to make it possible. Also mentioned in the build. I’ve just looked at a picture of the real boat and they’re scarfed too.
Jerry.

colin-stevens

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Re: River Queen - Vic Smeed
« Reply #10 on: September 20, 2020, 04:46:20 pm »

Now we are talking, thanks all, really useful hints and pointers.
Jerry C, can you post a link to the build you are referring to please. You have a lot of good stuff here but couldn't find the one referred to. Oh, and thank for the hints on plank sizes. Not sure what wood I will use yet but Mahogany looks likely as that seems to be all I can find at the lengths required, wanted a hard wood any way. Probably use a paler wood for the rest of the structure.
Never had much success at sharpening pencils, let alone chisel and planes, but have recently bought a Trend Fast Track sharpening guide, much better, not quite at hairs on forearm removal yet, but better than I have ever achieved before.
Just found a Mini plane on Ebay, no idea such things existed, every day is a skool day.


As an aside, if you like real wood boats look up Tally Ho on You Tube. Truly inspirational.
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Jerry C

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Re: River Queen - Vic Smeed
« Reply #11 on: September 21, 2020, 01:13:06 am »

colin-stevens

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Re: River Queen - Vic Smeed
« Reply #12 on: September 24, 2020, 04:40:35 pm »

So, been doing just a little planing this afternoon. Scouring the internet for wood and came up with one that fits my needs as I see them. Not being a carpenter, by any stretch, going to make the keel out of two Mahogany strips, the "base" at 9.5 x 9.5mm and the gluing a "spacer" at 6.5 x 2.5mm o top. With the "hog" then glued to this that will create a slot down both sides for the planks.


One big sheet of Mahogany for the "bits" to create bow & stern.


Thinking of 2.5 Spruce for the planks, think the colour contrast will look good.


Maybe Mahogany for the Timbers and Stringers.


I do need to work with "off the shelf" supplies as I think (know) the missus would through a right wobbly if I were to go and buy more wood working tools. Might get away with a Band saw, providing I can use it to cut thicker wood ( for furniture ect)


Thanks again for the previous hints/links. More suggestions/hints/tips gratefully received.
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SailorGreg

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Re: River Queen - Vic Smeed
« Reply #13 on: September 24, 2020, 04:53:10 pm »

Good for you, looks like you're enjoying yourself already!  Just a word of advice - mahogany-like timbers aren't the best for steaming/bending.  The "blond" timbers are better here, such as ash, spruce, lime, douglas fir...  and so on.  The relatively gentle curves of the gunwales/inwales and stringers will be OK, but the timbers/ribs need some fairly tight curves, particularly towards the stern.  I would go with one of those mentioned, stained (after bending) if you really want the contrast.

Have fun!


Greg

colin-stevens

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Re: River Queen - Vic Smeed
« Reply #14 on: September 24, 2020, 05:59:10 pm »

Thank you for that, was wondering. This is just the kind of guidance I need.


I plan on using thinned resin on the inside, but varnish on the exterior. Can you resin over stained wood?


PS, never been the most patient of people, just started cutting out half moulds in card. Blew the dust of my french curves, not one of them is what I want. Typicall.


Looking out as always for guidance.


Many thanks
Colin
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SailorGreg

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Re: River Queen - Vic Smeed
« Reply #15 on: September 24, 2020, 06:25:44 pm »

Yes, you can put resin over stained wood (just wait for the stain to dry thoroughly).  You can also varnish over resin if you want to do the outside as well.  A coat of resin will give a nice smooth base for varnish.  Depending on the resin you use, you shouldn't need to thin it much if at all.  (I am talking epoxy rather than polyester resin now).  Go for coating or laminating resin rather than the stuff intended as an adhesive.

Greg

colin-stevens

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Re: River Queen - Vic Smeed
« Reply #16 on: October 27, 2020, 06:58:05 pm »

Hi all, does any one know if a   Graham VR1A is a suitable plant for a Africa Queen, and id so is sourcing a boiler easy enough?
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