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[Martin (Admin)]

 
Anyone got any old Model Boat Magazines in the Peterborough area I could borrow?

I would like to scan in some old articles and adverts for a trip down memory lane for us .... 😁

[Colin Bishop]

Be careful about copyright Martin.

Colin

[Martin (Admin)]

After 30 years?!

[Colin Bishop]

A lot of those articles included plans which are still listed by Sarik so maybe choose carefully.

Colin

[TheLongBuild]

I think that if you just contact MB and say what you are doing they will be fine and as long as it is not for commercial gain, they may want acknowledgement.
Else I do believe that you may use a percentage of any publication for research and publication as long as you reference the item.  ( Or maybe not)

[Dave_S.]

The exemption used to be for criticism & review (at least that was the case when I was working for BBC TV News) but various producers would insist on pushing the rules beyond breaking point, which on more than one occasion resulted in a 5 figure invoice landing on us.


I suspect that Sarik would be agreeable to the use of old articles if they were encouraging people to buy the plans - but get it in writing first!

[Tug Fanatic]

As I understand it copyright exists for 70-75 years. Whether anybody would enforce it is a different question.

I agree with theLongBuild that it is safest to ask the publishers for permission and offer to acknlwledge the source.

Making a build article available might even sell a few plans for them!

I suspect they would be unhappy about anything that is in their archive available to subsribers.

[TheLongBuild]

Martin never mentioned plans, just articles and old adverts, I could understand plans possibly being an issue but not the rest, we have articles on the convention site which have all been approved.


and as mentioned  above , that could result in a few sales which can only be a good thing.


As for Copyright the amount of sites on the web and FB where Copys of plans ( Not Originals ) can be obtained is huge so does C.R mean anything today ?.

[Colin Bishop]

In practice probably not in this context but see:

https://www.theguardian.com/music/2021/dec/17/eric-clapton-wins-legal-case-against-woman-selling-bootleg-live-cd-for-845

which proves copyright is still very much alive in some areas.

A lot of the older MB articles have full plans reproduced in high quality as in those days, copying and enlarging them was actually quite difficult. Some of these plans have been reproduced for sale on an unauthorised basis and my current build actually makes use of one purchased from Canada where a husband and wife team appear to be running a bit of a sideline!

It's probably quite safe for Martin to do this but on his own head be it!

Colin

[jaymac]

But is the definition of Scanning Not just reading rapidly in order to find specific facts

[Colin Bishop]

Only if you live in Scandinavia.....

[jaymac]

What's Scandinavia got to do with it

[Martin (Admin)]

Scans, scanning, Scandinavia ......... yeah, me too!   

[madwelshman]

I have quite a lot of Model maker & Model boats magazines from the late 50's to the late 60's that I have collected over the years. There is a lot of interesting information in those old mags, plus some lovely old plans too.


Will

[jaymac]

               

[warspite]

Scandinavia, is that between copyatainia and fotovania 

[TheLongBuild]

               

Love the downloaded book   

[Martin (Admin)]

Scandinavia, is that between copyatainia and fotovania 

      

[Martin (Admin)]

I have quite a lot of Model maker & Model boats magazines from the late 50's to the late 60's that I have collected over the years. There is a lot of interesting information in those old mags, plus some lovely old plans too.
Will

  Pembrokeshire, West Wales is a bit far for a lunchtime drive! .... Would you consider bundling a few up, and I pay for shipping?
 

 

[jaymac]

maybe    '' CopyCabana''

[GG]

I'll comment on Colin Bishop's post No 8.


I too spotted the Canadian people who sell copies of my plans and construction notes via the Internet.
At first I was annoyed at this blatant breach of copyright.  But, it was clear that the magazine publishers (who may believe they own the copyright) were doing absolutely nothing about it.


I then realized that these "evil Canuks" were actually doing a useful service in supplying material the the publisher is either unwilling or (probably more likely?) unable to do.  It has always puzzled me that the Plans Service has never offered a copy of the construction article that accompanied the magazine plan feature.


Equally puzzling is the absence of the "free plans" in the electronic version of the magazine.  I would not have thought that it would be too difficult to arrange for an electronic plan download to be arranged, probably limited to one copy per subscriber.  The possible objection that this might lead to someone making numerous copies doesn't seem realistic especially as the publisher doesn't seem too bothered about what is happening above the 49th Parallel!
Glynn Guest

[Dave_S.]

Interesting post, Glynn, so the magazines do not own the copyright on the plans they publish, they just pay for the right to publish them - which I assume means that you and other designers are able to sell the same plan to several different magazines, or do they purchase exclusive rights, either world-wide or within a specific territory? I also assume that the copyright remains with the designer, so any further publication without the agreement of the designer would be illegal.

[Colin Bishop]

The publishers certainly believe they have the right to republish the plans after they have bought them and indeed any other material published in the magazine. I used a lot of archival material in the series of Special Issues of Model Boats which I edited some years back. Going back even further, a whole series of Norman Ough drawings and plans were republished in the late 1960s/early 70s which had orriginally appeared in the 1950s. I'm told that some of the other MTM magazines are recycling archival material at the moment but don't have details of this. The Norman Ough plans are now held by the Great Britain Trust in the Brunel Institute having been donated as part of the David MacGregor collection. I assume he obtained them after Norman Ough's death. Quite what the copyright situation is I shudder to think! I published one plan on the basis that it had originally appeared in the magazine in the 1950s but of course the magazine had itself changed owners several times in the meantime. The assumption was that the previous rights were incorporated in the change of ownership.

Of course the reality is that only a few plans sell in significant numbers, most might achieve just one or two sales per year so going after plaigarists just isn't worth the bother plus many are actually in the public domain online anyway. I bought my plan from Canada as I was too lazy to have the original reproduction in the magazine reproduced at a larger scale. I have since discovered that the print is in fact distorted to some extent but as my model is near scale rather than yrue scale due to the need to incorporate the working paddle wheel mechanisms, it hasn't actually been a problem.

I don't know for certain but I think the plans of planes and boats etc. being sold by Sarik have been licensed to them by MyTimeMedia who still retain the publishing copyright. The 'X' plan range was licensed to John Cundell when he retired but subsequently brought back in house and now appear on the Sarik lists.

It's all a bit complicated!

Colin

[Martin (Admin)]

Topic renamed ....

[Circlip]

Sad fact of life is that when accountants become involved, dire consequences of help are considered heresy. Also sad that on two occasions to my knowledge, FREE help from enthusiasts to two differing model publications has been turned down to their detriment. Were it not for some "Outlaws" many of the old school plans would be a distant memory and in saying Outlaws, I don't include those doing it to rip off the unsuspecting on THAT site and others. To answer both questions raised by Glynn, reason for this is - - - accountants. Every last drop from the lemon squeezer. On another thread the question of information on a couple of kit designs, now obsolete, was raised and hopefully some "Squirrels" will be able to help.
  I wonder how many of todays "Modellers" even care about the preservation of the "Old" designs? I'll bet Vic would be glad to see that at least one designer seems to hold the same principles that he advocated. One of his designs however, although freely available, and originally a free givaway, later hit the plans service at 2/6d is now obtainable for £12.50, not bad for an A3 sheet. Wonder how much the present "Owners" would supply a 26" long version of the original 13" model?
 Wish wee'd had the capabilities of todays compewters and programmes years ago. glad to be of assistance, in the past, to some on this forum via on occasions the late mate FLJ.




  Regards  Ian.