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Author Topic: HMS Kent WW1 cruiser decking  (Read 752 times)

ether823

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HMS Kent WW1 cruiser decking
« on: June 13, 2022, 08:18:48 pm »

Hi I am currently building HMS Kent 1/96 scale WW1 cruiser. She is going to be in wartime grey and I am not sure what colour the decks were ie. teak or painted grey. Any idea`s please.
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derekwarner

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Re: HMS Kent WW1 cruiser decking
« Reply #1 on: June 14, 2022, 01:13:40 am »


It appears that a waterline model of HMS Kent, [a Monmouth Class] armoured cruiser, in a scale of 1/192 in the Imperial War Museum ....... this model was made by Julian Glossop and acquired by the Museum in 1939.

https://www.iwm.org.uk/collections/item/object/30018092

Images of the model of HMS Kent from this site confirms timber decking......however Wikipedia notes "The protective deck armour ranged in thickness from 0.75Ė2 inches (19Ė51 mm)"

Could be worth a trip to London with a camera......or are they banned at the IWM?


Derek
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BrianB6

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Re: HMS Kent WW1 cruiser decking
« Reply #2 on: June 14, 2022, 02:28:36 am »

Several photos of HMS York on the Task Force 72 website  Deck is timber
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mudway

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Re: HMS Kent WW1 cruiser decking
« Reply #3 on: June 14, 2022, 03:37:11 am »

York's deck is "natural" timber as Al, having carefully planked the deck, refused to paint it grey. ok2   [size=78%]York is in WW2 colours too not WW1. [/size]


The photo shown is a post WW1 County Class cruiser.  Kent in WW1 was a dark grey.


https://www.sovereignhobbies.co.uk/collections/royal-navy/products/colourcoats-narn03-august-1902-november-1914-dark-grey-507

Being coal powered, you would think her decks would be a shade of grey or black as there would be less time during the war to keep the decks spotless.
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raflaunches

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Re: HMS Kent WW1 cruiser decking
« Reply #4 on: June 14, 2022, 06:03:35 am »

I donít believe any wooden deck was painted in WW1. During the Falklands battle in 1914 there is references to the crew of HMS Kent ripping up the decking to use in the boiler rooms as they were running out of coal during the infamous SMS Nurnberg chase. I think that itís mentioned in the book They Fought Splendidly they say that the crew ripped up their polished decks to get the extra speed to catch up (which they did exceeding the maximum speed ever designed for the Monmouth class cruisers!). Youíve got to remember at the time aircraft were only just becoming a thing so disguising a ship from above wasnít really needed as much as from the sides.
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Geoff

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Re: HMS Kent WW1 cruiser decking
« Reply #5 on: June 14, 2022, 01:26:58 pm »

I believe in general teak was the main wood used for planking decks. There was a degree of holly-stoning the decks as well which gave the light beige finish we see on most models but I strongly suspect that in the real world in wartime that practice ceased.


I've not come across anything conclusive about painted decks in ww1 and suspect the teak just went grey (like a park bench)



In my opinion for the model to look nicer go with the beige but if you want it more realistic use a light teak stain. 


The good thing about making models of this era is that there is no one alive to say, "that's not right!"


There are very few pictures which show deck (or any colour) clearly from this period as most pictures were black and white and taken from low down, also colour pigmentation from the original negatives deteriorates over time so there is no guarantee the print reflects reality.
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ether823

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Re: HMS Kent WW1 cruiser decking
« Reply #6 on: June 14, 2022, 03:30:08 pm »

Thanks gents, unpainted teak it is then.
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John W E

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Re: HMS Kent WW1 cruiser decking
« Reply #7 on: June 14, 2022, 04:53:16 pm »

hi there


I have been reading through a couple of books - and one of them which I have had for a few years is 'Practical construction of warships' by R.N. Newton and this book gives great detail of wooden deck construction on warships.   It says on cruisers deck plank widths vary between 7 inches and 9 inches - and between 15 to 20 feet long.  Some areas of the decks the planking is covered with linoleum where there is heavy usage.  The two types of linoleum are in general use.  Corticene made from a mixture of powdered cork and linseed oil which is applied to the canvas backing under pressure and allowed to harden by oxidation of the linseed oil, is laid in lobbies and passages in way of the crew's quarters & so forth.  ........ the book describes other various coverings on the weather decks as well.


I know when I built HMS Exeter there are several parts of the upper deck which I had to paint reddy-brown to assimilate this deck covering.   So, I should imagine HMS Kent would have a similar deck covering in various areas of her decks - especially where the coal chutes and ash rail runs were.


So definitely a teak deck :-)


John

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ether823

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Re: HMS Kent WW1 cruiser decking
« Reply #8 on: June 14, 2022, 05:12:08 pm »

I built a 1/48 model of HMS Velox and most of the deck was painted a reddy brown to look like Corticene
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Colin Bishop

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Re: HMS Kent WW1 cruiser decking
« Reply #9 on: June 14, 2022, 05:31:40 pm »

There is a photo of damage to Kent after the Falklands battle. Taken on the upper deck. It is difficult to make out what the deck surface is but the lines and what looks like splintering suggest it might be wood. If so it does rather look as if it might have been painted or alternatively it might be charred from the shell explosion

https://www.alamy.com/hms-kent-british-armoured-cruiser-ww1-image66157990.html

Colin
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mudway

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Re: HMS Kent WW1 cruiser decking
« Reply #10 on: June 15, 2022, 12:03:54 am »

I donít believe any wooden deck was painted in WW1. During the Falklands battle in 1914 there is references to the crew of HMS Kent ripping up the decking to use in the boiler rooms as they were running out of coal during the infamous SMS Nurnberg chase. I think that itís mentioned in the book They Fought Splendidly they say that the crew ripped up their polished decks to get the extra speed to catch up (which they did exceeding the maximum speed ever designed for the Monmouth class cruisers!). Youíve got to remember at the time aircraft were only just becoming a thing so disguising a ship from above wasnít really needed as much as from the sides.
I agree not painted but think they would be dirty from coal dust, ash and general war and tar, not the pristine timber seen on models.
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ether823

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Re: HMS Kent WW1 cruiser decking
« Reply #11 on: June 15, 2022, 04:38:28 pm »

Many thanks for the picture
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Geoff

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Re: HMS Kent WW1 cruiser decking
« Reply #12 on: June 16, 2022, 02:57:40 pm »

I believe with corticene this was glued down in panels with brass strips being riveted to the deck then hammered over the edges to hold all in place. If you paint in the red/brown color then use very thing gold pinstripe and matt varnish over the whole it comes out well.


Cheers


Geoff
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Akira

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Re: HMS Kent WW1 cruiser decking
« Reply #13 on: June 16, 2022, 09:45:56 pm »

I do not think that Colin's photto is showing a wood deck. There are disconcernable lines that would be far too wide for planking. Perhaps a laminate. The other question I would have is which deck is shown in the photo?

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Colin Bishop

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Re: HMS Kent WW1 cruiser decking
« Reply #14 on: June 16, 2022, 09:53:31 pm »

Deck is the upper (weather) deck.  At the time Kent was built plank widths were typically nine inches. Later on, timber in that width became more difficult to source so widths were reduced.

It is obviously difficult to definitively work out from te photo just what is being shown though.

Colin
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Akira

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Re: HMS Kent WW1 cruiser decking
« Reply #15 on: June 17, 2022, 12:36:28 am »

Understood Colin. I was thinking that it might be the upper deck and a corticene covering. The main deck I can certainly see being planked.
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tonyH

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Re: HMS Kent WW1 cruiser decking
« Reply #16 on: June 17, 2022, 10:32:08 am »

Apparently Jackie Fisher proposed the use of corticene, which I think was only made in 2ft width at that time, for the upper decks and bridge of Dreadnought.I also found this and Andrew will certainly know what he's on about. https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=rt0mEAAAQBAJ&pg=PT107&lpg=PT107&dq=corticene+decking&source=bl&ots=strzRMppZi&sig=ACfU3U3EuOyhsmRos-xjmax-ibA9hvBRUA&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwigsrbslbT4AhVTlFwKHYbeCpQQ6AF6BAgcEAM#v=onepage&q=corticene%20decking&f=false
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Colin Bishop

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Re: HMS Kent WW1 cruiser decking
« Reply #17 on: June 17, 2022, 10:41:40 am »

Looks a fascinating book Tony, I think I might buy that. I have met Andrew at Woolwich a couple of times, most recently when researching my Miltiades liner project. He is a really nice guy and incredibly knowledgeable and helpful too.

Colin
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tonyH

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Re: HMS Kent WW1 cruiser decking
« Reply #18 on: June 17, 2022, 04:25:57 pm »

Absolutely agreed Colin and he does love oddities which I found out when I was sorting out my ill-fated Thornycroft hydraulic-propulsion Torpedo Boat and he came up with the working drawings.
Tony
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Colin Bishop

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Re: HMS Kent WW1 cruiser decking
« Reply #19 on: June 17, 2022, 05:37:23 pm »

I've ordered the book now!

I do like poring over all that technical design stuff and the efforts to strike a balance between speed, armour and armament. I have Friedman's book on Edwardian Armoured Cruisers.

Colin
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John W E

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Re: HMS Kent WW1 cruiser decking
« Reply #20 on: June 21, 2022, 04:50:18 pm »

Hi, here are a couple of photographs which I have acquired from the Web.   So, if they belong to anyone on here - or - you know who they belong to - inform them I only use them as reference and I am sorry - however - here they are.   I was looking for another image on a post on here - nothing to do with HMS Kent - it is amazing what you can find :-) .


HMS Kent - and - they may help you with the decking and your model.   


John



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ether823

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Re: HMS Kent WW1 cruiser decking
« Reply #21 on: June 21, 2022, 06:03:01 pm »

Many thanks for the photos John, my model will be in wartime grey.
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ballastanksian

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Re: HMS Kent WW1 cruiser decking
« Reply #22 on: June 22, 2022, 02:46:57 pm »

I reckon that both dirty and clean are acceptable depending on whether the ship was on patrol/exercise or in harbour for a period and men need occupying. Your model would look finest holystoned to a light beige  :-))
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Geoff

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Re: HMS Kent WW1 cruiser decking
« Reply #23 on: June 22, 2022, 04:19:24 pm »

Remember if you are going to plank the deck there are rules for the but joints - either three of five (every three or five planks the butts align). Also you need to do the margin planks about 1.5 times the width of the individual planks if you are going to joggle because as otherwise when you cut to joggle the deck planks the margin plank comes out too narrow.


Also joggling is not done if the snape is less than 1.5 times the width of the actual plank, it all depends on how it abuts the superstructure. Its really not as hard as it seems. I use electricians black tape as the caulking. You make up a batch of planks at the same time then cut between them.


Cheers


Geoff
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John W E

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Re: HMS Kent WW1 cruiser decking
« Reply #24 on: June 22, 2022, 04:58:59 pm »

Here is an image of the deck being planked on HMS Exeter and you can see the butt joints.


Also, I used 0.5 thickness planking x 6mm wide - therefore electrician's tape wasn't any use to me to assimilate the caulking between the planks.    I used a black ball point pen on the edge of the plank after it had been glued down.  Then I glued the plank next in line alongside.   There is a sequence build of the planking on HMS Exeter topic on here.


Aye, John



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