Topic: My new model launch (Read 7821 times)

JimW · « **on:** March 27, 2023, 08:48:47 pm »

Hi to you all from a long retired and disabled model enthusiast having built many, many model aircraft and boats, Model aircraft NO MORE due to having. A prescribed ‘half heart’ now being unable to walk more than 25’ before collapsing at the young age of 86! Today I’ve just had delivery of my recently bought Windermere 49” x 8” steam launch in 99% built condition complete with Cheddar boiler and I believe engine, the chap I bought it from on eBay said he got it as a Deceased Effects item but didn’t know much about it or boats in general so I’ve a few problems to solve. The boat is quite heavy, at least for me with my condition but from a superficial examination it requires a set of vintage figures to man it, also needs handrails, helm, flag staff and ensign and possibly lighting - all of which I’ve already got.

O
The engine’s cylinders have got some feint writing on them so also have to have a look-see here. In [size=78%]all there’s quite a bit of work to do and bigger decisions have to be made re getting rid of our two N gauge railway layouts as they have taken over the house

Hopefully, here are some pics…. If anyone has any ideas of the hull’s design, age or anything else I welcome your input.

Jim

ballastanksian · « **Reply #1 on:** March 27, 2023, 09:13:56 pm »

Hi Jim,

Sadly we cannot see the images. It can be an onerous thing uploading images. I think there is an uploader special to this forum that the Moderators might be able to help with. If you can add links to your images on a reply, I might be able to upload them via my hosting thing.

If you got all the way to eighty six before half your heart retired (how rude of it!) then you have done well Sir.

TheLongBuild · « **Reply #2 on:** March 27, 2023, 09:16:31 pm »

never understand why people think it is hard to load up pictures, just use Pixresizer on your pc to resize 1-1000+ at a time.

http://bluefive.pair.com/

Baldrick · « **Reply #3 on:** March 28, 2023, 12:41:28 am »

Do we still have a situation where the site requires a new member to have a certain number of posts before it will allow them to upload images ?

PS if the engine has a name plate on top it could be a "Proteus" (jackpot)

Martin (Admin) · « **Reply #4 on:** March 28, 2023, 04:45:12 am »

Several options to add photos here: https://www.modelboatmayhem.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,61103.0.html

( Jim, you can email me the pictures, i'll add them for you )

Martin (Admin) · « **Reply #5 on:** March 28, 2023, 04:45:50 pm »

Jim's photos:

Geoff · « **Reply #6 on:** March 28, 2023, 04:57:59 pm »

Very nice, its a Cheddar Models Puffin unit with their horizontal mk 2 boiler with a gas-or gauze burner so it can be lit from the funnel top. Unless you are racing along you should get a good 25 to 30 mins sailing with her.

The mk 1 boiler was return flue whereas the mk 2 is straight through and up so contains about 40% more water than the mk 1. I have both in different models and always get 25 to 30 mins sailing.

As a suggested modification from Clevedon Steam for about £20 you can get a gas cut off valve and piping so you can remotely put the burner out if you catch weed or debris.

These are excellent units and are very reliable and work for decades!!

Good luck, you can't beat steam, the smell of steam, hot oil and burnt fingers!!

Cheers

Geoff

Geoff · « **Reply #7 on:** March 28, 2023, 04:59:25 pm »

I meant to add, a very nice model!

G

JimW · « **Reply #8 on:** March 29, 2023, 02:24:20 pm »

Hi all, not yet into the launch, well just about - yesterday while looking through on- board gear I removed the r/c gear pn which was marked 27mhz - so as thats been gone for years Im assuming the boat to be at least ten years old.

I’ve read much in ‘mayhem about peoples views on fitting a Gas Attenuator, mostly views against - but I want to fit one and cant get one, Forrest Classics don't sell them any longer saying that their website is old and has been replaced many times but still the advert keeps coming up? my preference is for the simple type which seems to resemble a brass block - anyone with knowledge of where to get one from would be gratefully received.

As there is no paperwork with the boat the boiler will need testing and providing with a certificate so as soon as my body has come to terms of being alive I’ll be removing same to hopefully post it off because I cant drive in my current condition, as for the rest, well I’m slowly learning….. I want to keep in touch with all you wonderful welcoming guys because you are keeking me going!
Oh, and before I can post I’ve got to complete the verification rubbish each time (which is a first for me).

Jim

Geoff · « **Reply #9 on:** March 29, 2023, 03:37:09 pm »

Jim,

Much depends on exactly what you mean by a gas attenuator. Some boilers have a complex system which measures both water kevel and boiler temperature so it shuts the flame down to a pilot light until needed. So on a practical basis you can sail the model for say 20 mins then stop and the flame will reduced to a pilot light so no steam is lost. Once you have finished chatting you can then sail some more.

These are complex systems and are the ideal but in practice most of us just sail and experience tells us how long we can sail before before we run out of water or gas. Ideally the gas should run out first.

However we can't always guarantee that so maximum downside is as follows:

Boiler runs out of water before gas - this can be caused by fouling weed and you cant get to the model. Generally no damage done to the boiler albeit it overheats. Cheddar models confirmed this to me when it happened, but in a practical sense the lagging on the boiler will charcoal and possible catch fire and set fire to the model. A single burner cannot generate enough heat to un silver solder a boiler, full stop.

Okay the next step could be the model burns and reaches the gas tank which could possibly explode albeit I think the model would sink before this happens.

Either way its generally sound practice to find a way to remotely turn the burner off. This can be done in a number of ways - firstly with a servo operated gas control valve so if you get stuck you just turn the gas off. The second way (depending on the burner, blow lamp or ceramic) is to use a water jet to put the burner out - not wise with ceramic as it will destroy the burner but better than loosing the model.

Having said all this these circumstances rarely happen so do just enjoy the sailing.

Cheers

Geoff

DocMartin · « **Reply #10 on:** March 29, 2023, 04:24:05 pm »

Geoff's advice is sound.
Perhaps the simplest method of boiler protection is to use a servo-controlled gas valve. Inexpensive to purchase and technically easier to install and operate.

Check out Clevedon Steam. Jerry can get you sorted.
A model stuck in the middle of a pond (engine problems, weeds, etc) with an active boiler can present a costly problem when the boiler runs dry.
DM

rhavrane · « **Reply #11 on:** March 29, 2023, 05:30:52 pm »

Bonjour Jim,
Perhaps a question of translation but I can tell you that all my fleet have a gas regulator (also called attenuator) = "régulateur" in French and several have also a gas attenuator (also called regulator) = "détendeur" in French.

Before sharing my videos (sorry again in French), my wording, possibly incorrect, please forgive me in advance :
Regulator : puts the gas at an idle level for a predefined pressure (for me 2 bar - 30 PSI). I much prefer double diaphrams ones.
Attenuator : gives an output constant gas pressure regardless of inlet pressure

Examples :

Different models : https://youtu.be/2tK4TV4wb44

JMC regulator : https://youtu.be/V8ybmqgcNak ==> https://youtu.be/Xk3sH4L2l_A if you say you are a friend of mine, you could negociate a correct refund

Chinese Microcosm regulator : https://youtu.be/Wzb2Y0TZU1U much lrager than the large JMC one : https://youtu.be/FDF7jQmvvRo

JPB attenuator : https://youtu.be/arL10A6wsNo

Combo (Malcolm Beak's plan) : https://youtu.be/48DYwXeRe8c

Of course, I also have RC safety shut off gas valves : https://youtu.be/zCgLBAxieNU or https://youtu.be/mA6uC5dgoiM or https://youtu.be/bvBf1c-lOS0

JimW · « **Reply #12 on:** March 29, 2023, 06:52:42 pm »

Looking at 2.4 Combo deals is getting expensive, just thrown away a so called 4ch combo set as it screamed China and cost about £28! …..
So what do others use bearing in mind extra channels needed for gas attenuator etc..?

Got that wretched Verification to get through again, its the only thing that spoils the wonderful site.

Jim

JimW · « **Reply #13 on:** March 29, 2023, 07:35:58 pm »

Rhavrane, Bonjour to you, its interesting that you use attenuators on all your boats, it seems to me to be the safest way - to come home with a boat instead of a burnt out boat.
I’m still investigating with an open mind.

Jim

JimW · « **Reply #14 on:** March 29, 2023, 07:55:25 pm »

Often I worry that when the time comes to visit my local pond and (heavily guarded by the area’s model Yacht Club) I may be too old to participate fully as I used to many years ago but we wait and see.

Do most of you use dry batteries in your radios or Lipos like I used in my airoplanes before having to give them up besause of my medical condition?

My boat/Launch has been so carefully built that I dread to alter it in any way, but to get the success one hopes to one sometimes has to ‘bite the bullit’ and do just that, as soon as I can get rid of our N gauge model railways I’ll have more room th fully investigate the whole situation thoroughly.

Jim

JimG · « **Reply #15 on:** March 29, 2023, 09:20:34 pm »

Hi Jim
don't get put off by the verification, it's only for I think 10 posts when it stops, so you're halfway there. The initial verification does stop bots from accessing the forum causing havoc.Jim

JimW · « **Reply #16 on:** March 30, 2023, 09:37:16 am »

I worry about the state of the R/C market today, years back 2.4 sets cost a LOT of money! Today the market has been swamped by unbranded sets and other goods from China, Yesterday I had delivered a 2.4Ghz 4ch Combo set with singlehanded pistol grip that when opened had no manufacturers details and very sparse instructions for use that cost IRO £29, which was to my mind a ridiculously cheap offering.

From the instructions is said: ch1 steering servo, ch2 throttle, ch4 to external battery, ch3 servo to ch3. To my mind that appeared to be a two channel set rather than four channel, Its not a bit like my older Futaba units so I junked it right then.

What do you chaps use (2.4 of course) & how many channels above 2? depending on services needed. I know I'm getting old but my recognition of circuits is not that bad!

One of the things I would like to attach is a ships bell (connected via servo) that sounds when throttle changes are made - rather like the Chadburns Telegraph used when I was at sea.

Have been looking for a low voltage type bell the smallest i’ve found so far is the 2-1/2” dia older type Gents door bell that runs from 3v - 4.5v but until the TX situation is resolved I can’t go much further. Of course I also have to recognise WEIGHT addition but will have to see. Ding Ding! “Finish with Engines”.

Jim

JimW · « **Reply #17 on:** March 30, 2023, 10:04:46 am »

Jim G, thanks for the advice the problem appears to have stopped after 5 posts, what a relief.

Jim

DocMartin · « **Reply #18 on:** March 30, 2023, 10:48:48 am »

JimW
In regards to your 2.4 GHz 4 channel combo purchase, the receiver is likely set up similar to older Futaba 8 channel receivers.

Old school (pre-2.4 GHz) Futaba 8 channel receivers shared the external power supply (BATT) connection with the channel 8 servo. In order to use the #8 channel, a Y harness needed to be inserted before connecting the battery and servo. The battery doesn't have a signal wire (white) and thus does not interfere with the control of the servo (as done via the white wire).
Therefore, I believe your generic 2.4 GHz combo purchase is truly a 4-channel set.

Channel 4 works by adding a Y-harness to the receiver followed by the battery and servo to the dual arm connections, respectively.

FWIW

DocMartin · « **Reply #19 on:** March 30, 2023, 10:56:17 am »

Photo explanation in the attached files.

DM

Geoff · « **Reply #20 on:** March 30, 2023, 11:36:47 am »

Jim,

I still use some of my models on 27 because virtually nobody else does. A few sets of crystals means you can change frequency at the pond side so there is rarely a problem on a practicable basis.

2.4 is superior because there is no clash but in my experience they are a little more complex to set up. Essentially you are now dealing with a computer rather than just a radio transmitter!!

I tend to use dry cells for most of my model receivers or a separate lead acid if I can take the weight and never use a BEC (Battery Eliminator Circuit) because if the voltage should drop too low then the radio shuts off as well. Now if you are using lipo's for motive and BEC because the operating voltage tends to be higher you should be ok but again if used with brushless if the lip voltage drops too low then the speed controller will shut it all down to avoid over discharging the lipo and damaging it.

Nicad rechargeable or the equivalent are also fine for receiver batteries albeit you typically need 5 because they are at 1.4 volts and not 1.5 volts.

Cheers

Geoff

JimG · « **Reply #21 on:** March 30, 2023, 12:24:52 pm »

Jim, from the sound of it you bought a set that may have originaly been intended for a ready to run buggy, as such it has the minimum of channels and instructions as they are intended to be pre setup in the model. Also at he price and source I suspect you were buying from E-BAy or the Chinese equivalent, much better to deal with a UK model shop where you have more chance of finding a suitable set, they may be a bit more expensive but you can talk with the person in the shop.Check out Cornwall Model Boats or Steve Webb Models both of whom I have dealt with with good results, you may have a local shop although they are getting rare. Others might be able to suggest other good supliers.
I personaly dislike the pistol grip type of transmitter as they are more limited in the number of channels offered due to their intended use, the twin joystick boxes are available with from 2 channels upwards at reasonable prices, no need to use the big names such as Spectrum or Futaba. Common makes used by boaters include, Radiolink, Planet and FlySky who all produce decent low cost sets.Basically don't just go for the cheapest, as you found out they tend to be extremely limited.
Jim

rhavrane · « **Reply #22 on:** March 30, 2023, 01:47:54 pm »

Bonjour,
Personnaly I have several Spektrum DX6 / DX6I and Flysky/Turnigy 9X like this one :
https://hobbyking.com/fr_fr/turnigy-9x-9ch-mode-2-transmitter-w-module-ia8-receiver-afhds-2a-system.html

JimW · « **Reply #23 on:** March 30, 2023, 02:42:13 pm »

Hi Rhavrane, you're on the same lines as I am because I’m now thinking about a Spectrum DX5Combo, I’m thinking of 5 ch to give me room for additions - not that they will all be used but better to have too many than not enough.

Jim

rhavrane · « **Reply #24 on:** March 30, 2023, 06:58:36 pm »

Bonjour Jim,
Before buying a radio, I would kindly suggest you to define previously your requirements especially if you have several boats because a 5-channels radio has 4 proportional by the sleeves and one all or nothing by a switch, this is why I prefer the chinese 9-channels ones that I can program as I use a minimum of 5/6 channels on my steam boats including the safety gas valve and... the whistle

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Author Topic: My new model launch (Read 7821 times)