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[red181]

Well I wasn't going to post anything, but the more I think about it, the more it annoys me , so I make no apologies for the tone of this message.

I was at a North West lake earlier this morning, with 2 friends, doing some testing, we had 3 boats onn the water. This is a lake that is used by a local well established club. We went early, as one one the boats was a fast electric scale boat, and we didnt want to disturb any other modellers who might arrive later with slower boats.

At about the time we where packing up, several people arrived with boats, and turned on their transmitters with a total disregard for us, and other people arriving. I had my boat that has just spent 7 months undergoing extensive refurbishment, you can imagine my annoyance that some fool could have caused it to crash if frequencies had clashed. One guy was even displaying the 2.4 pennant, and after conversation he was actually on 40mhz with no idea what crystals he had.

Turning your transmitter on without checking for a peg board, or enquiring what frequencies are turned on, is in breach of the rules and regulations set down by RC governing bodies, its stupid, ignorant, and disrespectful to other modellers. "My aerial is down" etc etc etc is NO EXCUSE. Had my boat been damaged by anothers stupidity I would have been seeking an insurance claim, oh yes, you should be insured also!! >:(

Imagine the damage and potential harm that would have occured if the fast electric had lost control?

If anybody out there does not understand this, you do not turn on your tx without consulting others, and you should have adequate insurance.

[Ghost in the shell]

when did there become a pennant for 2.4ghz?

as for model damage I had been struck and sunk a couple of years ago, so had to wade in and fetch the model off the bottom, luckily only 4ft down.  however had it been in deeper water I would have been somewhat p***ed off!  luckily no damage.

As for joe public, the amount of times when they turn up with these didellysquat range toy grade radios and sail, then wander why their radio doesnt work when their Tx may say 40.665 and your hobby grade stuff says 40.025. 

The other week, some one with a fastie boat came within half an inch of Nord Icelandia, Nordie was sitting in the water, winching her tow-fish up, when this white blurr came screaming in and skimmed the side of the ship.  Im not sure if the fastie actually skimmed the hull but it was way too close for comfort.

[Reade Models]

the rules and regulations set down by RC governing bodies

What governing bodies?  Are there any for informal weekend model boating?

Ofcom set out the frequencies that one may transmit on, here at http://www.ofcom.org.uk/static/archive/ra/publication/ra_info/ra60.htm 

Isn't pmdevilin perhaps confusing 'regulations' with etiquette?

Malc

[Ghost in the shell]

even so, would be nice to check.

the club that I'm a member of has allocated user frequencies on 40mhz

[offshore1987]

We get the same thing happen at my local lake because its a public lake :( so all me stuff is now 2.4 ( 2.4 ftw )

All the best

[red181]

Why "nit- pick" Malc, you are experienced enough to know what I am referrring to, etiquette, regs, common courtesy and common sense. I fly helicopters, BMFA regulatory body for this has detailed instructions for turning on your tx. I am not referring to kids with toys, but experienced senior gentlemen who either have forgotton the etiquette,  cant be bothered, or never knew in the first place.

[Ghost in the shell]

the BMFA, british Model Flight Assoc, isn't a government body parse, but an independent watchdog.  mainly because model aircraft are akin to missiles, BUT they do have some good points to take up.  Dev's can you post the rules up or a link to them please

[red181]

Here you go Ghost, thanks for input, it just agravates me that my pride and joy could have been destroyed by others. You have a nice tug, that you have spent considerable time and money on, and I am sure you would be equally annoyed if it happened to you. When challenged, politely, I was then ignored and the offenders carried on.

I appeciate that if kiddies turn up you cant help that. I would, and have,  turned my boats off, so the kids can play, and my faster boats dont cause a wake which spoils their fun, like going early this morning to avoid the later arriving "sunday sailors" My term of "governing bodies" wasnt meant to be disected, but was a generalisation of associations that lay down rules and regs for clubs etc.

http://www.ofcom.org.uk/static/archive/ra/publication/ra_info/ra60.htm

I wont bore boaters with the BMFA link, but if anyone is interested, google BMFA, and read the various links, in particular flying and the law. Interestingly, you can buy a relatively cheap rc electric helicopter, which (some) have a rotor tip speed in excess of 100mph, go and fly it in a public park, potentially cut someones head off, all without any knowledge of insurance, clashing frequencies etc.   :( at least we (boaters) dont have that   

[Ghost in the shell]

I wont bore boaters with the BMFA link, but if anyone is interested, google BMFA, and read the various links, in particular flying and the law. Interestingly, you can buy a relatively cheap rc electric helicopter, which (some) have a rotor tip speed in excess of 100mph, go and fly it in a public park, potentially cut someones head off, all without any knowledge of insurance, clashing frequencies etc.   :( at least we (boaters) dont have that  

it was the BMFA link I wanted, lol

[Reade Models]

pmdevlin

Were you using a frequency peg board this morning?  Was it in open view of the modellers who turned up at the lake after you?

Malc

[malcolmfrary]

The behaviour described is unacceptable, as any club turning up for a "regular" session at a public water, or just individual members, should show common courtesy.  The people already there, if not already members, are potential members.  Setting out to alienate them by a display of ignorance, either by negligence or deliberately, is bad for the entire hobby.
At "my" lake, we often get buggy drivers in the car park and flyboys setting up for the beach, as well as toy sailers and visiting modellers.  Approaching them has never yet met with a negative responce, and has gained the member or two.

[The long Build]

Which Lake was this ?

[nightowl2912]

the rules and regulations set down by RC governing bodies

What governing bodies?  Are there any for informal weekend model boating?

Ofcom set out the frequencies that one may transmit on, here at http://www.ofcom.org.uk/static/archive/ra/publication/ra_info/ra60.htm 

Isn't pmdevilin perhaps confusing 'regulations' with etiquette?

Malc

I think pmdevlin is on about the club's regulations, that's why thay have safety offices.
as for a peg board no we did'nt have one, as we are not members of said club

Andy

[red181]

Long Build, I would rather not say, as there is no mileage in pointing fingers at individuals. My point was a general one, with my experience being an example. Great words from malcolmfrary. I have 3 really nice boats, my friend has 4, with a 5th on the way, and we both have young boys with their own boats, another 5 in total. I am prepared to travel anywhere in the north west, cheshire, wirral to sail in nice surroundings with good company, but due to our RC helicopter background, safety and courtesy HAVE to be paramount in any body of club members. Even individuals turning up alone, such as us, should be good ambassadors to our hobby, and show a common courtesy to others.
This post has gone on long enough now, it wasnt meant to become a banter, just to remind certain individuals of their responsiblities to themselves, fellow club members, and the general public

[nightowl2912]

Hi the long build,
sorry dont whant to name the club at this time,
but it should'nt have happend if my fast electric scale boat had hit the ramp 25-30 mph and hit someone, there car or boat, what would thay said then,
yes we do have insurance but that's not the point

Andy

[nightowl2912]

o'well im typing slow again.     
Andy

[tigertiger]

I understand your annoyance and cause for concern, and I hate to ask the obvious, but I will.

Has any one of you had a friendly chat with the boat club mentioned?
We are mostly enthusiastic amateurs, not professionals. And sometimes our enthusiasm runs away with us. They probably just got caught up enjoying what they were doing and didn't think.
Often people do things out of thoughtlessness. Me especially. It doesn't make me a bad person.

I am glad you have not mentioned the club concerned, as flaming never achieves anything positive.

If you do the club the courtesy of talking to them politely, explaining your concerns, I for one would be interested in the outcome.

[djrobbo]

Hi guys..been following this with interest.....now correct me if i'm missing something here  , but were these thoughtless individuals members of said club.
     
    By their behaviour and seemingly lack of knowledge about frequencies etc , it seems likely that they weren't actually members of said club.

    We also use a public lake and have found from experience that it is not active club members who do this sort of thing , but joe public who has no idea of pondside etiquete..

                Please feel free  to correct me if i have missed the point .

  regards....bob.

[Circlip]

I used to bash on about safety a long time ago  Bob, on this very subject, Nowt changes keep taking the pills  Ian.

[hoverboy]

Hi,

Just for the record I know how you feel as I had the rear of my Perkasa damaged by two idiots who could not control an i.c. model.

One passed the transmitter to the other while their boat was at high speed and they were both looking at the transmitter rather than the boat. It cost me dearly.  

What made things worse was that they were members of a well known club visiting our pond. Later in the day I heard them joking about what they had done to my boat.  That hurt. So there are inconsiderate people about.

Having said that these types are few and far between.

Pete

[Ghost in the shell]

The behaviour described is unacceptable, as any club turning up for a "regular" session at a public water, or just individual members, should show common courtesy.  The people already there, if not already members, are potential members.  Setting out to alienate them by a display of ignorance, either by negligence or deliberately, is bad for the entire hobby.
At "my" lake, we often get buggy drivers in the car park and flyboys setting up for the beach, as well as toy sailers and visiting modellers.  Approaching them has never yet met with a negative responce, and has gained the member or two.

The club which I am a member of has allocated frequencies for its members, so we all know who sails on what, and so far that has worked well.  however visiting modellers and joe public who turn up to sail get asked "hey up mate, what ya running on? im on XX.XXX" so yes a little manners goes a long way.

[Peter Fitness]

Those of us from an RC aircraft background are probably more aware of the necessity of strict frequency control than are others. Nevertheless, frequency control is important in boating too, which is stating the obvious, and I believe most clubs implement a control system in the form of a peg board. As has been mentioned in this thread, it is usually newcomers to the hobby who can cause problems through ignorance, and it is up to club members to politely point out the risks involved in not adhering to frequency protocol. There will always be the odd renegade who believes that such regulations to not apply to him / her, and they can be a real problem. Thankfully, such people are a very small minority.
Peter.

[Ghost in the shell]

On the issue of peg boards, there also has to be some curtesy there, like not leaving the peg on the frequency, and so marking it as "in use" then going away to get lunch whilst your model sits on the table, tx turned off, peg on board, so hogging the frequency. 

[malcolmfrary]

Our peg system works by removing the peg and attaching it to the aerial.  The user puts his name and the time on the board in its place using a dry marker.  Not perfect, relying as it does on people putting name and time on the board and actually bringing the peg back, but it does allow a channel hog to be traced.
Allocating a frequecy to each member is good within a club, but effectively is an obstacle to mixing of clubs.

[The long Build]

In relation to the peg board and these new 2.4ghz  tx's how may people could use these before clasing or is it endless.