Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length.

[nsa66]

I need a bit of advice re. sail control. I've found some interesting stuff on the forum regarding sail arm setup, servo throws etc. but I've never quite found the info I need. I'm new to model yachts except for a tiny almost ready to sail job many years ago which managed with a standard servo for the sail arm but would lie flat on the water in any decent blow (even with an extra lead bulb on the keel).

I'm seriously considering a Thunder Tiger Victoria as my first decent yacht. Apart from the slightly higher cost (and it's not massively more expensive), is there any reason why a winch shouldn't be used instead of the high torque servos Victoria seems to need to keep her close-hauled? Are there any overwhelming advantages of one system over the other?

Radio will be non-computer Sanwa so limited opportunity for range adjustment etc. Any advice appreciated.

[BlueWotsit]

Where are you planning on having the top of the winch - above deck as with the racing yachts or underneath ?

Are you planning on racing or just fun sailing ?

On our old and battered Victoria the first thing we did away with was all the cord above decks, and instead used a standard Futaba ordinary servo inside the hatch and for the servo arm, we connected one of those narrow stainless steel 6 inch rulers and made a two point connecting arm from that ?

This has worked well for years, and as we dont race the boat it wasnt an issue.

[Islander1951]

Howes are selling a 17Kg servo(at 6v) for just £15, so no need to spend megabux!
It has metal gears too.   

Edward.

[Dekan]

Where are you planning on having the top of the winch - above deck as with the racing yachts or underneath ?

Are you planning on racing or just fun sailing ?

On our old and battered Victoria the first thing we did away with was all the cord above decks, and instead used a standard Futaba ordinary servo inside the hatch and for the servo arm, we connected one of those narrow stainless steel 6 inch rulers and made a two point connecting arm from that ?

This has worked well for years, and as we dont race the boat it wasnt an issue.

Sorry for the noob question, but I'm thinking about building a Victoria.. how does your sail servo set up get rid of the cord above the deck

[malcolmfrary]

Do as Islander suggests, follow the instructions carefully.  The only real change I would make would be to set things so that when fully pulled in, the arm on the servo is facing as directly as possible away from the hole where the cord enters the cockpit.  Using an arm length as suggested will give the right travel, possibly using the trim tabs alongside the "throttle" stick to give the full range.  This will let you sail in any conditions that you consider it sensible to stand there.

[tigertiger]

I have a sail arm servo as I prefer them to drums. They are much faster than drums and there is no chance of tangles. It is all below deck, neat and tidy. But you do need a sail arm servo, as the standard servo will not have enough torque when the wind gets up. 7kg/cm torque should be enough 9 kg/cm is better. I know they are more expensive, but consider it as the cost of a few beers, and remember that once built your sailing is free.

A drum below deck requires a tensioner, made from elastic, however there is not a lot of room under the hatches to fiddle about with this, I hope you have small hands.

If you go above deck with a continous loop you will need to install pulleys, and this costs extra, it is visible as well.

[Tombsy]

This website has a step by step guide to modifying the Victoria, there are some pictures of the sail arm and rigging.
http://www.okanaganmodelsailboat.org/Index1.html

[Klunk]

This is the best site for Victoria mods,
http://www.victoriarc.org/building.htm

[Dekan]

Thanks guys a lot of good info on both the sites. I now understand why the ruler was used...  

Next decision is....Micro Magic or Victoria....

[exvtop]

Next decision is....Micro Magic or Victoria....

The standard answer to that is that it depends who you sail with.
If you're in a club and others have a Micro Magic or Victoria you go with the majority to give you someone to race against.
If you're on your own I suppose it doesn't matter. Both are pretty straightforward reliable boats. Possibly a little more construction involved with the Micro Magic.
The racing Micro Magic will cost about 50% more (assuming you have have to buy Servos etc.) because the basic kit is nearly double the price of the Victoria.
Micro Magic a bit easier to transport but the Victoria will fit into most cars fully rigged. Mine goes onto the back seat of a Skoda Fabia easily.

Good luck
Mike

[Dekan]

The club I'm thinking of joining does not seem to race anything.... so it will be just be for fun...unless I get serious

[periscope]

Funnily enough I just got my Victoria ready for its sea trials today (well, club pond anyway)  The boat is all finished except for the decals which I might or might not stick on, but I'll decide later on.  Trouble is there are around 5 or 7 Victorias in the club and if a few are sailing it can be a bit tricky spotting which is yours. I might put some ID of my own on the hull.   Anyway it sailed OK in spite of there only being a very light breeze.  I took other members advice and built the boat exactly to the design plans, then later mods can be made if I decide to change anything.  I've sailed a couple of other members boats in the past and I wanted the yacht to just do some relaxing sailing in moderate winds - no racing or any other spectacular activities, so a really hefty sail servo doesn't seem to be a very strict priority providing that it doesn't just have plastic gearing. I think mine is rated at 66lbs.   As I say I want to just do some relaxing pottering around the pond - if it gets too windy (which it often does at Goole) I'll get my sub out instead of the yacht - the sub is better in poor weather 'cos I can travel under water to keep it out of the rain in bad weather LOL   Best of luck with your final decision - sorry I can't give any advice about the Victoria yet - maybe I'll have some better idea in a week or two, but by then I suppose you will have made your choice.   Here's a couple of pictures of todays trials.

Ian

[Dekan]

Thanks, its bigger than I expected.

[exvtop]

Trouble is there are around 5 or 7 Victorias in the club and if a few are sailing it can be a bit tricky spotting which is yours. I might put some ID of my own on the hull. 

Periscope, far better to put some ID on the sails - much easier to see than hull markings.
You could get stick-on numbers or make your own design using an indelible marker pen.

Mike

[tigertiger]

I have seen a mix of acrylic paint and water used as a wash to colour sails. When dry it is waterproof. I saw this done in yellow. Blue would also be OK. I would not do it in red unless you want pink sails.

Here is a picture of Romainpek's sail colouring experiment. He says the diluted paint did not affect the sail stiffness. The boat in the picture is a Monsoon 900 (not recomended).

[periscope]

Yep I was wondering about marking the sails - the kit has ID marks for various countries in it - a couple of our members have put theirs on the sails so I wondered about sticking on a black dolphin logo that I use on my sub - I've already put one on the yachts stern hatch cover but it's not easy to see except from close up. (Look at the picture with me standing near the boat - the dolphin is the black mark on the hatch cover)

[BlueWotsit]

Thanks, its bigger than I expected.

personally if I were getting a boat for "fun" sailing I wouldnt get either of the two mentioned so far - give me a Kyosho Fairwind everyday.

Ok its bigger and more expensive but they look really impressive when sailing in a good wind - on these occasions the Victorias I have seen at our club look like toys as they are so easy to sail   

[BlueWotsit]

I have seen a mix of acrylic paint and water used as a wash to colour sails. When dry it is waterproof. I saw this done in yellow. Blue would also be OK. I would not do it in red unless you want pink sails.

Here is a picture of Romainpek's sail colouring experiment. He says the diluted paint did not affect the sail stiffness. The boat in the picture is a Monsoon 900 (not recomended).

Hi TT, thats an interesting thought to experiment with - any idea what mix percentages were used ?

[tigertiger]

Hi TT, thats an interesting thought to experiment with - any idea what mix percentages were used ?

Enough paint, enough water

[Klunk]

I had access to a vinyl cutter and made new graphics for the side of the boat in blue and yellow, changed the number in the kit by cutting out different numbers from the transfers for the sails and stuck them on, the graphics give me good visability and the sail number is different to all the stock Victorias!

[periscope]

Got my markings on the boat now - here's what I did in order to identify it amongst the other half dozen on the pond - I made a note of all the letters on the decal sheet, fed them into an anagram searcher and decided on the name of Fiasco - I put this on the foresail so that I can easily spot it.  I've taken a snap with my mobile - hope it comes out OK.

Ian

[Islander1951]

To find yours at the far mark, stick a bit of fluorescent tape to the  top of the mainsail on both sides,
or some ribbon to the back of the crane; beware of this 'coz others can also see what the wind is
doing at that point from your indicator.

             Edward.

[periscope]

Yep - Might try that Edward although our pond is fairly small - the picture I've put on will give you some idea - there's not much more than you can see. lol