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[Neil]

silver solder is a lot stronger craig, but the simpler and more honest excuse for silver soldering is I'm crap at soft soldering and reasonable at silver soldering............and was given a bundle of silver solder many years ago that was good stuff.
 
I only soft solder very small parts and electrical joints these days.

[craggle]

Ahhh, Fair enough then.
I'm the other way around, I tried silver soldering once, made a mess and burnt myself!

Carry on...... 

Craig.

[Circlip]

Two points that may be helpful regarding Silver Soldering. Although the firebricks shown are ideal for stopping setting fire to the work area, they aren't giving much radiant heat back. If you can get hold of some pieces of "Gasmiser" ceramic elements and place these around the job, the heat reflection is immediately noticeable. Thicker SS wires can be bashed thinner so that it melts easier and for more control over where the stuff is going, Silver Solder paste (In syringe tubes) by CUP alloys is to be highly recommended (No connections)
 
    Regards  Ian.

[Neil]

cheers Ian I'll have a look at some of that solder paste.
The fire brick are actually proper brazing hearth inserts that you buy and cut to shape your own use.........normally gives good radient heat when built around the object........I just couldn't get the heat into the area I needed though because of the shape of it and the fact that the thing was acting like a flue at the rear, and couldn't block it up.........just an odd shape to solder.........but got there in the end.
 
neil.

[irishcarguy]

Neil I have watched your work since I joined Mayhem & I must say you are a constant inspiration to me & many others to keep on going & to try and complete our boats. As you know I have lost a lot of the use of my left hand, particularly my fingers because of a stroke. This is very hard for a left hander & I drop a lot of bits. It seems everything is three times as hard as before. However when you show your mistakes as well as all the nice stuff that you do you have no idea how much it helps people like me. Before I really could just about do anything & not give it a thought. Now simple things are difficult & the hard things are impossible for now. Keep up the great work, it is much more than you might think to people like me, it is a constant motivator & I thank you, you are certainly one of a kind. Mick B.   

[gribeauval]

thanks Mick, and it inspires me to carry on when I have comments like yours said about me.
 
I have always tried to help and I tell my tales "warts and all" as it's no good doing something like this and hiding your mistakes.........if I make mistakes and cover them up, it doesn't help someone else who might be following but think they would like to do it another way.....a way that I had made the mistake of..........so, tell it like it is and every one learns from the mistake.........just like Circlip pointed out to me re: silver soldering...........I also learned from his comments and will implement those points he made, next time I come to silver solder a larger job........had never thought of flattening the silver solder rod to a thinner profile to make it melt quicker............so we can all learn from one another....
 
I know that there are those in the modelling and any other hobby for that matter who like to and do keep their knowledge to themselves............but it's not for me I 'm glad I feel that way.
 
neil

That's exactly how I feel about modelling Neil !!


There is no point in keeping knowledge to yourself or it becomes of no value in the long run, even mistakes are of value to others, and I make lots of them!!




Mike

[Neil]

here here, Mike and Mick.

[baloo]

I am a "MISTAKE"does that help lol,but apart from that,everybody make`s mistake`s and it`s great when people even own up to it instead of brushing it under the carpet.Carry on the good work neil,mick,mike.


baloo 

[irishcarguy]

We are a group of guys that building is everything to us, we are not into the EGO trip.It seems to me we have no secrets & are more than willing to share even our mistakes. In my business I am sometimes considered an Expert (after 50 years) & I have difficulty with the term, I say I am not an expert,it is just that I have made the same mistake more often than others & learned how to correct it & to share the fix with them. It is good to make a mistake sometimes, it keeps you on your toes. It can be a real humbling experience to strip down an engine or gearbox that you had previously built & find it was not as perfect as you thought it should have been.I always say that the next engine I build will be the best one yet, & that is always my goal.Mick B.

[heritorasphodel]

Neil I can't say for certain what material the tops of the drop keel cases are, only that on the two boats we've got that have them (BASP and James Leath) they are metal. For the shape, I would go by the plans because the size and shape of the casing depended on the shape of the drop keel. The Norfolk and Suffolk keels are far longer and therefore of a shallower angle, so only the tab on the top of the keel protrudes through the deck, while on a Watson they are shorter and therefore to fit them completely into the hull more of the keel has to be above the deck.


As for the seats, there are some boats (such as William Riley) that have timber seats on top of the thwarts, whether they are original or not I don't know but they don't look out of place.


The problem of the general arrangement drawings is they were only really made to show the boatyard where all the various bits went, but not what they were. For that they made separate engineering drawings, from a drawing of a single block to the precise rudder arrangements on a Rother (and we seem to have hundreds of odd drawings that have found their way to us)


Andrew

Edit: having looked at the photographs of the plans you posted right at the start, I would say the shape of the drop keel roller casing you've made is correct, but they look to be much thinner, and I would say they are most likely made of metal. I can't say I'm 100% certain though.

[derekwarner]

Hullo Neil.......on page #24 of this brilliant thread I picked up the scale as 1:12 which is a big build.....
But an M3 bolt as used below would be M36 in real life & with a 63 AF hex........... could these be a little large?......
As an alternative you could maintain the brass pulley/rollers as machined & a 3 mm shaft but.....but consider a stepped keeper plate & smaller fasteners to secure the shaft  ........
Please don't feel the need to use your planned standard response .... ##f  term to me as I only trying to be helpful........Derek

[Neil]

cheers andrew............must agree they are thinner in profile/plan..............but I have only two other choices......either silver solder a whole load of brass together in that shape........which I don't fancy............would be here till next christmas going down that route...........or plasticard..............do you think that would be strong enough??............
 
as for your comments derek.......totally agree about the bolt size..............but don't understand what you mean by your solution to the problem........could you draw me a diagrame please and post it on here.
 
Having said that a 36mm nut either side wouldn't be that out of place as the keel is a hefty lump both in model form and real life.
 
 
cheers, neil.

[heritorasphodel]

Personally I would try and make them from plasticard, if you use thick enough plastic it shouldn't matter much. I would assume that most of the pressure on these keels will be lateral, in which case the little piece above deck won't be taking that much strain. I think there'd only be trouble if the keel was pulled down when the rope on deck was tied off, pulling down on the pulley.


I'm assuming you would set the boat up by raising/lowering the keel before you put the boat in the water, and then taking it out before changing the setup. How much trouble would it cause to put a small hole in the keel of the boat and two holes in the drop keel, so you can use a pin to prevent the keel moving? In which case, the fittings on deck would be purely aesthetic and not structural. But yes, I think it would work if you used plasticard.


Andrew

[Neil]

cheers andrew..............I'll remake them in 2mm plasticard.....no bother about putting retaining pins in the hull and yes they'll be set at the lake side.........so no problem with that........the only bit of bother will be to thin down the pulley blocks a little but can do that without using the laithe..............so will do that during the week. cheers.

[Stavros]

WOW simply stunning as usual
 
 
Dave

[Neil]

cheers Dave.........did something today I haven't done in years......worked up a sweat whilst planing.............but boy do my arms and back ache now.lol

[Stavros]

They will be far worse tomorrow HA HA 
 
 
Dave

[derekwarner]

WOW....   a Bailey No 7 long sole plate plane....nothing plain about that    .....Derek

[Neil]

WOW....   a Bailey No 7 long sole plate plane....nothing plain about that    .....Derek

Hi Derek.............is it something special.......just a nice tool to me........and I love good quality tools..............funnily enough, I brought it back with me from Australia in 1978 after teaching industrial arts over there in Canberra............so it's native to you guys

[RAAArtyGunner]

WOW....   a Bailey No 7 long sole plate plane....nothing plain about that    .....Derek

 
Yes, also picked up on the "Stanley Bailey No 7 Try plane" 
 
Worth quite a few bob today
 
Neil also shows how to correctly use a marking gauge

[irishcarguy]

Hi Neil, most everyone in the U/K is selling those fittings now . Look under RB fittings. They are made in Eastern Europe, I think in Poland. Cornwall Model boats & Westbourne sell their fittings for sure. They are very well made & cheap too. Wait until you see their turnbuckles & shackles, you will never buy anything else again. Mick B.

[Neil]

cheers Mick, will have a look at all those fittings.
 
Today, been working on the masts and booms, and in particular inseting the pulley wheels into the mast heads and the yolks for the aft booms on both boats.
take these first, I laminated them in the same Douglas Fir timber as the masts....lamintated them so that they won't split if made from a single piece of timber.
Although the laminates are quite thick they still have more strength than a single block.
 
Tomorrow they'll be shaped and sanded and then glued and pinned to the booms.
 
Also cut the slots in the mast heads with a 3mm drill bit, and reamed out to take the pulley wheels that were turned on the laithe.

[derekwarner]

Hullo Neil...is that a plain PVA laminating glue for  Douglas Fir blocks....   ....... or a white polyurethane? .....Derek

[Neil]

Aliphatic quick grab resin, derek...waterproof and strong, and quick acting.
 
neil.

[derekwarner]

  that's interesting Neil.....I looked a comparison between polyurethane & aliphatic resin as below  ...Derek
________________________________________________________________________________________________
 Polyurethane Adhesives and SealantsProducts and Brands: Gorilla Glue, .............................................; Sikaflex ......................................................

• Where to use: Bonds a variety of materials - metal, stone, wood, ceramics, foam, glass and more. 
• Do not use for: Paper products or rubber materials. 
• Cure time: 1-2 hours and longer depending upon formulation, one component and two component versions, moisture curing adhesives.
• Cautions: Avoid skin and eye contact. The use of protective gloves is highly recommended.

Polyurethanes are offered in both one-part and two-part systems. They are simple, strong and easy to use. Polyurethane adhesives are ideal for the laminating of porous materials like wood. Polyurethanes are water proof  , but moistening the surface before applying accelerates the curing process. Polyurethane adhesives are available in flexible and non-flexible formulations. Polyurethane adhesive sealant products form an extremely strong bond while retaining flexibility and strength above or below the waterline. Watertight bonding / sealing of fiberglass, gelcoat and wood. Alcohol should not be used when preparing surfaces for bonding as it will stop the curing process, causing the adhesive to fail. Polyurethane sealant products are not recommended for use as a teak deck seam sealer. Extended exposure to chemicals (teak cleaners, oxalic acid, gasoline, strong solvents and other harsh chemicals) may cause permanent softening of the sealant. 
Aliphatic Resin Wood Glue (aka Yellow Wood Glue)Products and Brands: Titebond Original Wood Glue

• Where to use: A wood glue designed to work on porous materials only. 
• Do not use for: Non-porous materials and surfaces. Not for structural or load bearing applications. This glue is not intended for exterior use or where moisture is likely  . 
• Cure time: Fast setting.
• Cautions: Avoid prolonged or repeated skin contact. Use only in well ventilated areas.

Titebond Original Wood Glue is ideal for wood, hardboard, particleboard, leather, cloth and most other porous materials. Titebond Original is easy to use, non-toxic and cleans up with water. Also known as yellow glue or carpenter's glue.