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[andymart]

Building a balsa hulled boat and noticed a thread about using tissue and dope and not being strong enough for everyday use. It mentioned fibreglass tissue and epoxy.
Is this the sort of stuff? or too thin? http://www.hobbyking.co.uk/hobbyking/store/__10905__Glass_Fiber_Cloth_450x1000mm_18g_m2_Super_Thin_.html

Secondly is PolyC ok for boats? I see mention of another product called Ezecoat both seem to be water based. I have an allergy to some epoxies and why I mention these. Can anyone tell me if these dry to a hard finish that can be rubbed down then painted on with acrylic sprays?

[inertia]

My very simply answers to your questions:
Yes it is.
No it isn't thick enough - certainly not for a balsa hull. You could use two layers of it but that's tedious and expensive.
PolyC? Never used it but it sounds and looks very much like.......
EzeCoat, which is what you say it is and does what you say it does. I have used it and it is quick, easy and not messy.
On the whole I prefer 1oz glass cloth and Z-Poxy Finishing Resin to anything else.
Other opinions are available................... 
DM

[newbe7]

I used a hand sand epoxy and fiberglass mesh on my wooden boat 20 min working time  let it sit over night and sanded smooth  filled small blemishes and painted with wood primer latex turned out very well.
Rick

[John W E]

may I make a quick comment with regard to using tissue covered with dope and soforth, not being strong enough for everyday use.    I am surprised my owld mucker didn't pick this one up - owld man Dave ya nar from ACTion - as well as the rest of us has also built models and covered with them with tissue and dope and the models have been around and in regular use for years with no ill effects.    Have a look at some of Glyn Guest's builds, this is his favourite method of covering Balsa Hulls.   

If you have a look at the Swordsman build - for beginners - in the Masterclass - we did the tissue build there and Mr nice man Dave did a write up about the procedure of covering using tissue, dope etc.

aye

john

[andymart]

Hi one and all the problem I face is actually getting hold of dope, sanding sealer and tissue both cost wise and logistically. I am from old school and can remember covering control line planes with firstly silk and dope then moving to nylon and dope. Still have a couple built in 1970s that although covered in dust could still fly and finish would be ok. If I price up including postage glass cloth 2 metres and 500ml of Polyc it comes to £23 for similar amounts of dope, sanding sealer, thinners, and tissue you are looking at best part of £40. I am sure you can appreciate why I am asking. Don't really want to go down epoxy route due to sensitivity.

[jarvo]

Andymart


As an old school modeler, why dont you use nylon stockings or tights, applied with Eazycote or Epoxy finish. PLEASE ask the missus first, she might still be wearing them!!!!!


Slide the leg part over your boat hull pull the creases out then paint on the finnish, 2 layers are bomb proof


Mark

[inertia]

    I am surprised my owld mucker didn't pick this one up - owld man Dave ya nar from ACTion - as well as the rest of us has also built models and covered with them with tissue and dope and the models have been around and in regular use for years with no ill effects.    If you have a look at the Swordsman build - for beginners - in the Masterclass - we did the tissue build there and Mr nice man Dave did a write up about the procedure of covering using tissue, dope etc.
aye
john

Tha's reet there, m'duck, but Swordsman is plywood and not balsa. Anyroad up, them clever b*ggers from Z-Poxy have made their poxy so easy to slop on and sand dahn that it dis'na make any sense to use smellylose nah.
Things move on, marra - even me!
Dave M

[andymart]

Mark

Thanks for that, I did see reference to this on another posting. I might just give this a try, cant wait to ask her indoors for some stockings or tights

Andy

[spearfish99]

Rather informative answer to this question in current Model Boats Design Special magazine in the article on Twinkler. Also an alternative offered in the July 2015 ( ie current "normal" edition) of Model Boats  in the Beachbaby build article. Both mags worth buying

[andymart]

Hi thanks for that I do have the special edition and noted the comments made, that given choice again he would use glass and epoxy. I am assuming the other article is about stockings and ezecoat or tissue and dope? Unfortunately I live in a very outlying area so not easy to get these mags unless I drive into major towns some 15 miles away. Yes I could get a subscription and have had these in the past but found about only 5 magazines in a year had interest articles for me. The local newsagent does not stock any magazines like this, and won't specially order in either as wholesalers are a nightmare.

[spearfish99]

Hi Andy,

 As you surmise, the Beachbaby article advocates two layers of 15 denier stocking material applied with Eze Cote.  I know the problems that you can encounter with lack of shops when living in a rural area.  I live in a major town which actually has a pretty abysmal range of shops for its size. The one thing that it DOES have is a good old fashioned model shop. It has been run by the same family since I was a kid (I am now retired) and I am very lucky as they seem to be a thing of the past now

[andymart]

Strangely we did have a model shop in local town until around 5 years when the owner retired. It sounds exactly like yours had all the latest gear catered for all disciplines of the hobby but also had all the widgets etc. that you could not get elsewhere. I moved from Epsom area and was spoilt for choice their as had Mick Charles Models on my doorstep plus quite a few smaller model shops all within 30 minutes away. Most model shops near my location don't stock anything to do with boats and concentrate on Aircraft, Trains or Cars. The nearest would be Westbourne Models however have not had good experience with them in the past, plus they are 90 mins by car away. 

[JimG]

Fibreglass and PolyC will work to give a suitable finish, It is not so hard as epoxy so more easily damaged. One possible problem with a balsa hull is PolyC is water based so will cause the surface of the balsa to swell. It might be best to give it a coat of PolyC before laying the glass allowing you to sand the surface back again.

Jim

[jarvo]

Hi Andymart


Regards asking for old stockings or tights, my missus thought i had a fetish. Maybe she was right?????? but my daughter and her mates all supply me now, got some in stock so ok for a year or two


Mark

[derekwarner]

Jarvo....we would only worry if you started wearing the pink fish net variety .......with matching pink sequined smoking jacket....  ......Derek

[andymart]

Has anyone tried cloth/stockings and polyurethane varnish as the varnish seems to dry hard?

[spearfish99]

Has anyone tried cloth/stockings and polyurethane varnish as the varnish seems to dry hard?

 In the past, I used ordinary cotton bandage (as per first aid kit) with both polyurethane varnish or  with resin on the internals of wooden built boats ( mostly the old Aerokits range).  While I preferred using poly as it was both cheaper and less messy, I think that the resin had the edge.  Like the originator of the question, I get a reaction from f/g cloth so I try and avoid it. I have tried gloves and barrier cream but still suffer a reaction so try and avoid anything to do with fibre glass

[inertia]

Check out the sheet nylon here. http://www.rcworld.co.uk/acatalog/Fibre-Glass-Cloth-Tissue-Nylon.html
Us owd-fashioned types used to cover model aeroplanes with this stuff, using shrinking dope. Once the material is tight and you've filled the weave it will accept any paint finish you like. I'd say it's almost as tough as glass-cloth and resin on sheet balsa and ply structures. There are several "how to do it" videos on You Tube.
DM

[jarvo]

Derek Warner


There is nothong wrong with my pink fishnets, but there is more resin than support!!!!!!


Mark

[andymart]

My allergy is epoxy and to some extent cyano used them both for years never a problem. Barrier cream and gloves make no difference.
On aircraft I used to use bandage from first day kit (not crepe) and PVA to join wings and to be honest it seemed to be just as strong as epoxy. However doubt if it would be any good as a base for paint

[Colin Bishop]

If you are allergic to epoxy then Eze Cote is a good water based substitute - dries quickly too.

I am OK with epoxy but cyano gets me every time although I can manage with the odourless version.

Colin

[andymart]

I'm going to give ezecoat/Polyc and the stockings a go. One last question I have not glued in propshaft yet, should I do this prior to covering/painting?

[jarvo]

Hi Andy


Seel the hull, stocking epoxy etc, fit the propshaft then finish and paint the hull, that way the shaft wont get in the way of the stocking but you wont ruin you hull finish when you fit the prop tube


Mark

[andymart]

Dare I ask where I put the black seam? 

[andymart]

In seriousness guys thanks. I have tried the stockings on some scrap wood just to try out, I used polyurethane varnish (not water based) first to seal let that dry sand very lightly to remove any nibs then stretched the stockings over then apply another coat of varnish, let that dry rubbed edges off and gave another coat, let dry rubbed down and then stretched stocking over again and followed process with about 4 coats of varnish, actually the finish is quite good. I am going to try the eZecoat/polyc however took the lid off a bottle of eZecoat in the shop and it smells exactly the same as Wickes clear water based varnish, I wouldn't be surprised if it isn't exactly same product or very close.