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Author Topic: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build  (Read 21397 times)

Mark T

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Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
« Reply #200 on: February 18, 2019, 07:11:10 AM »

Your bent planks look great. I didn't know you could bend them so much flat.


I had no idea either until I tried it. If it hadnít worked plan B was to use short prices around the stern so Iím glad it did work.


Thanks for the comments everyone - Derek I take you point about using nails. The trouble with nailing is that they have to be removed as otherwise they cause issues when sanding. They also leave small holes which are difficult to disguise. The plan is to use finishing epoxy over the planks to obtain a durable finish which will also really help bonding the planks together


Mark
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JimG

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Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
« Reply #201 on: February 18, 2019, 12:03:40 PM »





Thanks for the comments everyone - Derek I take you point about using nails. The trouble with nailing is that they have to be removed as otherwise they cause issues when sanding. They also leave small holes which are difficult to disguise. The plan is to use finishing epoxy over the planks to obtain a durable finish which will also really help bonding the planks together


Mark
use a nail punch to push the heads below the surface of the planks, sanding will not be a problem. When finishing use a mix of epoxy and wood dust to fill the holes to represent the wood plugs used to cover the fixings in full size. This makes it a feature of the hull.
Jim
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Mark T

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Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
« Reply #202 on: March 03, 2019, 02:13:36 PM »

Thanks to all for the comments and advice its much appreciated  :-))


Ok I've moved on a bit - Firstly I finished the other side which took quite a bit lot longer than the first side.  Its because I was trying to mirror image it.  The results were ok though








Then I fitted the stern bulwark which I had previously made sure that it was the correct shape.  And guess what it didn't fit  {-)   I have no idea how this happened so I had to fettle it again before gluing in position.  It really fought me all the way and even now the deck will be 3mm longer than it should - Oh well  %%





Now here's where I decided to deviate from the plans again.  The plans show that the stern should be planked with short vertical pieces of wood as the picture below shows.





Now because this joint will be visible when the boat is finished I though that the transition would look awful.  So I decided to wrap the stern at least for one plank to try and get a better finished look.  This proved to be much harder than I originally thought and i wouldn't advise anyone to try this.  You'll end up with no hair  {-)   Anyway after loads of soaking, heat and clamps





I ended up with two plank layers but to go any further would have sent me over the edge - I just hope its all worth it in the end.  Here's the roughed out pictures - it needs much more shaping and a little sawdust filler.











I then changed to vertical planks as these will not be seen as they will be clad in brass.  Sorry I forgot to take any pictures in their rough state but here they are after a quick sand to rough the shape








And this is what they look like wet, so hopefully this is a representation of what they will look like after a coat of epoxy








Finally I cut and glued in the vertical planks on the port side this morning so they are drying as I type.








And that's it for now.  I hope your enjoying this build as much as I am and that I'm not going to in-depth.  Next jobs will be to shape the rest of the stern and then plank the bulwarks and the forecastle which I'm hoping will be a fairly easy job.


Thanks for looking - Mark  :-)
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Taranis

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Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
« Reply #203 on: March 03, 2019, 02:19:35 PM »

Enjoying very much. :-)
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ANDY

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Mark T

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Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
« Reply #204 on: April 07, 2019, 05:04:10 PM »

Hi All


Well I've managed to get some more done on the Anteo.  Having planked the stern I started on the main planks up to the gunwales and on the forecastle.  Its been nice working with home cut planks and its been a case of pretty much the same.  Cut planks and then bend them so suit the shape of the hull





And here's a quick tip that I was given that makes gluing a bit easier.  Place a line of PVA on the plank





Then get a bolt and drag it through the glue for the full length of the plank.  It removes all of the excess glue and leaves a uniform coat that doesn't blow out everywhere








Placing the four planks up the the gunwales I had to make one of the planks wider just like I had too on the first layer.  I did this in the same way by making a half stealer in a pre-curved plank





Which was then glued and clamped into place and the results were ok - I do tend to over clamp but thats just me








The finished planks in their raw state which is just glued wood without any sanding








I'll pop some more progress up a bit later on this evening -  Mark  :-)
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Its not the finishing that matters - Its the journey along the way that counts

Fairmount Alpine Build http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/album/bXv
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Mark T

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Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
« Reply #205 on: April 07, 2019, 06:33:26 PM »

Onto the forecastle - I needed 12 identical tapered planks so rather than cut and plane by hand I cheated.  First I cut the blanks on the table saw using the guide on the sled to make sure they were all the same length





I then set up a taper gauge to the required angle and cut the tapers








And then back onto the sled to cut them to length to get identical planks. It only took about 20 minutes to get this done.








I didn't take any pictures of bending or fitting the planks as there's loads of pictures like that - so here's what they all look like after gluing them on

















So thats the boxwood planking finished - well it will be after its been sanded down.  Its a shame that 80% of it will be hidden by brass cladding but I think its coming on ok.


So now I need to cut the mahogany planks to size and start planking down towards the keel.  I think I'll plank the entire hull before sanding but I'll see how it goes


Thanks for looking - Mark  :-)


Oh on a side note - I've actually learnt how to sharpen my chisels correctly with a small micro bevel on the tip.  They literally fall through the wood - Oh and skin - I've never had so many little cuts in my hands since doing them.  So now I need to learn how to handle them properly  {-)
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Its not the finishing that matters - Its the journey along the way that counts

Fairmount Alpine Build http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/album/bXv
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KNO3

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Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
« Reply #206 on: April 27, 2019, 07:43:41 AM »

Beautiful work! Where did you get that taper gauge from? Looks like a very useful tool.
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Mark T

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Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
« Reply #207 on: April 27, 2019, 08:48:35 AM »

Thanks KN03  :-))   I am now working my way through the second layer of mahogany planks. I've not posted anything as its slow going and all of the pictures will look similar so I'll wait until I get a lot done before I post again.


The taper gauge is an accessory that you can buy for the small table saw.  You can purchase them at most table saw suppliers but if you look on youtube there are a few videos on how to easily make them.
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Its not the finishing that matters - Its the journey along the way that counts

Fairmount Alpine Build http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/album/bXv
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KNO3

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Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
« Reply #208 on: April 27, 2019, 10:21:22 AM »

What model table saw do you use?
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Mark T

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Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
« Reply #209 on: April 27, 2019, 03:38:55 PM »

Its a Jim Bynes table saw it really is a fantastic bit of kit.  Here's a link


http://www.byrnesmodelmachines.com/tablesaw5.html
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Its not the finishing that matters - Its the journey along the way that counts

Fairmount Alpine Build http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/album/bXv
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KNO3

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Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
« Reply #210 on: May 02, 2019, 08:07:05 PM »

Thank you!
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Mark T

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Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
« Reply #211 on: May 06, 2019, 06:21:18 PM »

Hi All


A bit of an update as I've been busy getting on with the mahogany planking.  I've been using the magnets as clamps which are doing a great job as well as the screw clamps I made last year.














First section finished








A few pre-bent and shaped planks waiting to go on





Second section finished











Which was then repeated on the other side














So far so good - its no mirror image not by any stretch of the imagination but its looking ok.  I've made quite a few mistakes but managed to pull it straight as I've gone on.  I'm learning on the job but thats ok with me.


The next stage is to start planking at the keel and start working downwards.  I need to cut some more planks on the table saw first but I'll keep you updated as I go along


Thanks for looking - Mark  :-)
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Its not the finishing that matters - Its the journey along the way that counts

Fairmount Alpine Build http://modelboatmayhemimages.co.uk/album/bXv
Anteo Tug Build http://www.modelboatmayhem.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,59708.0.html

KNO3

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Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
« Reply #212 on: May 06, 2019, 08:57:18 PM »

Looks great so far.
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derekwarner

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Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
« Reply #213 on: May 07, 2019, 12:04:42 AM »

Yes, very tidy indeed Mark :-))


Are you using your taper attachment for the table saw to achieve the 5.0 > 4.75 and 4.5 > 3.5 mm plank width reductions then of hand sanding or using a hand plane to achieve the total uniform taper in each plank?


Have you completed a hull weight check recently?


Derek
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Mark T

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Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
« Reply #214 on: May 07, 2019, 08:23:49 AM »

Hi both thanks for the comments  :-))


Derek I use a plane to cut the tapers by simply transferring the measurements from the hull to the plank. Itís really simple and Iím getting quicker at it too. The tapers are quite long and beyond what the table saw can do. It would also take ages to set up. Itís great for short repetitive jobs but the hand plane is better for long planks.


I havenít weighed the hull but itís not really getting that much heavier with the second planking. It is getting much stronger though.
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Its not the finishing that matters - Its the journey along the way that counts

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Mark T

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Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
« Reply #215 on: May 11, 2019, 04:48:21 PM »

I've been getting on making the garboard planks which I've been worrying about for a while.  The reason being I had to guess and modify the first layer of planking to try and get the the second layer correct.  In all of this time was unsure of whether it would actually work out ok. 


Here's my problem - the diagram shows that the planks do not sit flush around the skeg.  They do in fact sit proud by what I guess is the thickness of the plank.  The written instructions give no idea what so ever on the correct placing so for me its a total guess.  The picture below show what I mean.  I have circled the planks which seem to be proud which then become flush as they move up towards the rudder tube.  This causes a real problem from the transition from the keel to the skeg which is why I rebated the fist layer of planking





The garboard plank is a difficult plank to make as it needs to twist through 90 degrees and allow all of the following planks to lay parallel to the keel.  So first off I made some patterns for the bow and stern as i didn't want to waste too much mahogany with errors





I then transferred these patterns onto the mahogany planks that I had cut extra wide to try and make the job a little easier which were then planed and sanded to shape





Now I've never had to bend mahogany before so I gave it a good long soak (8 hours) in water and then clamped it into place in the rabbet.  This wood is beautiful to use and extremely pliable when wet - it just needs to dry overnight in situ so that I can glue it in the morning








And here's the transition out of the keel to make the plank stand proud.  I'm so pleased the way its turned out and with a little sanding it should look a bit better too





Its one of those things that I kind of planned months ago, unsure as to whether it would work but it seems to be ok. The other side is soaking in the bath as I type so the both of them should be glued on and good to go by tomorrow evening.  This has been a really good building day for me and I'm really chuffed with the results so far


Cheers - Mark  :-)
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Jerry C

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Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
« Reply #216 on: May 11, 2019, 05:51:57 PM »

Hi Mark, good job. My view is that on a 1:1 scale the garboard plank is the only one on the side to be parallel throughout its length with the exception of the ends. Ideally the second layer would also have a rebate into the Skegness/keel but as this is a model and I assume you will put a fine glass mat and epoxy overall it really doesnít matter in this case if you just sand the ends flush.
Jerry.

Mark T

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Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
« Reply #217 on: May 11, 2019, 06:31:56 PM »

Hi ya Jerry - you are right this is probably the only parallel plank.  On a full size ship its also the widest and thickest plank apparently which is why I made it wider (well that my excuse anyway).  I have cut a rebate on the keel so they are sitting very nicely in it except for where they sit proud on the skeg.  It took some thinking about as I had to but a step into the plank to get it to look right.  I just want to get it as close to the original as possible so I'm going to leave them proud as thats why I've gone to all of this trouble.  I don't think its been a hard job as such just time consuming to get them to sit right as they will have a big impact on how the following planks lay.  It will get a good coat of epoxy and cloth so that'll make it water tight as my joints leave something to be desired. 


I've been watching Angelicas Adventures so be sure to let me know when you get to the black country  :-))   The beers on me (well the first one anyway)  Have a safe trip  :-)
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Its not the finishing that matters - Its the journey along the way that counts

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Jerry C

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Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
« Reply #218 on: May 11, 2019, 06:39:50 PM »

Currently we ďon holibobsĒ on brother in laws wide beam on Leeds& Liverpool Canal for ten days cruise. Then back to our boat and heading down to the Midlands canals. Weíll probably have 2 or 3 chances to meet up.
Jerry.

Mark T

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Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
« Reply #219 on: June 01, 2019, 11:08:54 AM »

HELP!!!

Hi Everyone I really need some help as things are not going too well at the moment.  I've been fitting the planks around the keel and skeg and as careful as I've been, I have damaged finish on the plywood on the keel >>:-(


Now as I was planning on having a clear coat finish this is not a good thing as the light coloured wood on the next layer down really stands out.  I've made things worse in my attempt to repair this problem by trying to glue in saw dust using carpenters glue.  This failed and actually made the situation worse as now it needs a bit of filler.  I did think about using CA for this process but CA and clear coats don't go well together at all.


So can you help?  I think I'm resigned to painting the skeg and keel and then clear coating the rest of the hull.  I'm ok with this but I really would like some opinions before I do anything else.  I'm reluctant to try and repair the ply any further due to the damage that i have already done.


So what do you think??  And what would be a good colour if you think painting is the way forward.  Pics below - cheers Mark








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derekwarner

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Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
« Reply #220 on: June 01, 2019, 11:53:59 AM »

Just a question first Mark, how did you originally intend to seal and coat the plywood keel timber [from bow to stern] in the first place?


Being the lowermost wooden section, it is most prone to mechanical damage......[especially around the bow area]


I am sure it has been mentioned and covered, but what type a adhesive glue are you using for this 2nd planking layer?


Prosperity polyester wood fillers are available in many differing tone/hue's to match the original timber......many are actually waterproof


May be a thought to gently scrape & remove that  :o sawdust & glue spread

Derek
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Mark T

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Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
« Reply #221 on: June 01, 2019, 02:56:47 PM »

Hi Derek - The whole hull is going to be covered in epoxy and cloth and polished to a matt clear finish so its going to show every little defect thats for sure.


The planks are all glued on using aliphatic resin so they are going no where it really is very strong stuff.


Its a shame that this has happened in this particular place as your eye is automatically drawn to this area so it needs to be right.  Would you believe that the pictures show the damage to the plywood with the sawdust and glue experiment already removed.


I did think about using a wood filler but the chances of me getting an exact match are pretty much zero which is why its such a concern for me.


I'm thinking about doing this after the planking is finished


1.  Give the hull an initial coating of finishing resin to seal the wood
2.  Air brush as near a colour that I can get over the keel and skeg using Valeo acrylic paint
3.  Resin and cloth over the paint to seal it and carry on as normal


I think that this may work but I'm a bit unsure so all thoughts on this are extremely welcome


The keel and skeg are going to have a strip of 1/16 thick brass running the full length to give it some extra protection



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bfgstew

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Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
« Reply #222 on: June 02, 2019, 01:53:02 PM »

Methinks you are over thinking worst case scenario Mark. With the brass strip and a deft touch up with a coat of paint the only person that would know there was a slight error would be you.
You are doing a fantastic job on this, so don't beat yourself up over it.
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Mark T

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Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
« Reply #223 on: June 02, 2019, 02:24:31 PM »

Methinks you are over thinking worst case scenario Mark. With the brass strip and a deft touch up with a coat of paint the only person that would know there was a slight error would be you.
You are doing a fantastic job on this, so don't beat yourself up over it.


Hi mate - Thanks for the reply I really appreciate it - funnily enough your not the only person who's said thats its not that bad.  I've decided to definitely paint the keel as its only a thin strip and like you say once the brass is on you'll only see the sides of it anyway.  I also think the skeg may look better painted as it will hide the laminations of the ply in the holes and on the far edge too.  My mistake was not making the keel out of solid wood when I had the chance.  Oh well you live and learn  %%


So the issue is what colour to do it?  Should I go for a mahogany dark brown so that is blends in.....or go for a lighter hay/brown to try and match the lighter boxwood up top?  Although I can build things I'm not very creative when it comes to choosing colours and I want to try and get this right when the time comes.


I think I'll use a simple water based acrylic and then epoxy over the top of the colour.  I guess I could do this with the water line too.  Any input on the colour would be really helpful  :-))
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KNO3

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Re: Panart/Mantua Anteo Steam Tug Build
« Reply #224 on: June 03, 2019, 05:50:30 PM »

It really is up to your preference. I would paint all the wood below the waterline and clearcoat above the waterline. Black or dark red are fine, or anything you like.
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