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Author Topic: PANART Harbor Tug Anteo 2 / expansion with electric motor, large batteries, etc.  (Read 1214 times)

baerlin-line

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    • PANART Harbor Tug Anteo 2 / expansion with electric motor, large batteries, etc.


Hello ship model builder,

In this thread I would like to describe my structure of the harbor tug Anteo 2, inspired by various model builders, here illustrated.

In my idea "Beginners start here ...! / I'm new here - Hello dear model building friends", I describe myself and my experience in model building. Among other things, I have not made a good relationship with wooden hulls in my youthful inexperience.

Take courage. No more plastic as far as possible. Renewable raw materials should also be processed with priority now.

Above all, I would like to address the model builders in this thread who have also not yet built a wooden hull with planks and frames.

Here we go. After I see the picture and the thread of Mark and his harbor tug Anteo 2 here in the forum

https://www.modelboatmayhem.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,59708.0.html

I made up my mind for the next project. Now I looked for further illustrated descriptions and found also under
 
 https://modelshipworld.com/topic/9472-anteo-harbour-tug-by-rvchima-finished-panart-130/
 - by rvchima
https://www.baronerosso.it/forum/navimodellismo-riproduzioni/247559-anteo-ii-panart.html
- by penelope
https://www.laroyale-modelisme.net/t3279-remorqueur-vapeur-anteo
- from Evenos
https://anvomodelboats.com/la-flotta/marina-mercantile/navi-da-lavoro/anteo/

further suggestions that encouraged me to start this project with these great descriptions.

Unfortunately, Brexit thwarted my plans. Order cannot be delivered or the price has increased enormously. But searching the web was worth it. In the largest action house, an Anteo 2 harbor tug entered the 3rd round. The price got lower and lower. So I sent a short email with a price proposal and took it.
For about 12 years the kit has been in the original packaging, stored dry with renovation splashes on the packaging in a model sports club, waiting for the builder. Super packed and arrived at me completely for half the price. Thank you very much for that.

Here are some pictures of the contents and the packaging with the 50th anniversary of Krick from 2008.

Greetings Ralf
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baerlin-line

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Here we go on ...


Of course, the kit was immediately inspected and quote Mark from his thread:
"The kit seems very well thought out and contains a very impressive set of accessories. On the face of it, there are a lot of well-made brass parts and what looks like a very good windlass that I believe can be made with a little bit of cleaning Could work with a small engine, there is also all of the rigging, a 55mm cast brass propeller and a massive tow hook.

The laser cut parts appear to be neatly cut and the plywood looks like it is of good quality. The planking is made of lime wood and there are 135 strips with a size of 1.5 x 7 x 930 mm. It includes a cardan shaft and 4 large 1: 1 scale drawings to make construction easier. The rest of the guide consists of 4 A4 pages of poorly translated Italian instructions so I'll see how I get along with them. "

Oh well. Now that the open kit is unpacked in front of me and all the individual parts are in front of me, my conscience speaks to me.
Hello spoiled model builder, you are finally moving up in the premium class. Please, I'm supposed to be a spoiled model maker. But the conscience is right. All model kits manufactured up to the first day as in my imagination "Received start here ...! / I'm new here - Hello dear model building friends" are closed, all kits with ABS or GRP fuselage and prefabricated parts belong and with a very good description. My mishap with the wooden hull trawler leads to the demissed.

Pampered model maker. Fortunately, only my conscience spoke to me and that is definitely a warning. Do not just start building instead of carefully considering the same, the same construction kit succeeds.

Components numbered in pencil as shown in the construction plan. Looking for a straight and stable wooden base for the slipway in the workshop. 2 x 90 degree angles for left and right next to the course of the keel adjusted.
Afterwards the keel was fixed on a tarpaulin base and glued. The numbered frames checked for accuracy of fit without glue on a probe and inspected.

Very little space in the fuselage due to the frame construction. The thought drawing in the plans didn't reveal much. The PC must take over the further planning in advance. I was piloted the planning with graph paper, pencil and eraser. Battery set, RC system and other expansion kits such as a more powerful electric motor, smoke generator, sound module with steam engine noises, anchor chain noises, announcement, fog horn, etc. I may still bring the steering gear up to the state of the art. The installation of the stern tube was also considered so that I don't have to saw out the sighting strut of the steering gear when working or changing.



Recordings after alignment of the frames on the keel and first grinding work.

Greetings Ralf
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baerlin-line

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And go on ..

Here are my considerations for further expansion with different battery capacities.

The belt drive was picked up but dropped by me.

The time lapse continues on the next page

Greetings Ralf
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derekwarner

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Welcome Ralf...it is always interesting to view design concepts and from your point it is a learning field


I have little knowledge of Tug Boats, however understand there are quite a few alternate propulsion systems [Voith Drives, VPP to name but two


With single engine, universally spinning a large diameter propeller a relatively low speed


The 700 series electric motors in direct drive are I understand relatively high speed/high current draw examples, both of which are at the opposite end of the design spectrum that a model Tug Boat - simgle propeller drive would need


A rather unqualified yardstick here is the diameter of the electric motor should be similar to the diameter of the propeller, however using this parameter will lead to lower speed, high torque motors with continuous rating and lower current draw.......


A range of motors from mobility scooters are a good place to consider, or a T12 or T24 Series electric motors is some I have seen in Tug applications


https://www.mobilemarinemodels.com/t12--t24-motor-592-p.asp


Derek


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Derek Warner

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Now about 5 weeks have passed and the implementation of the sketches here in fast motion.


The auxiliary decks, which guarantee the requirements for aligning the frames and the rigidity of the planking, would be removed after the planks have been put in place. Since these auxiliary decks are adapted to this model, I have planned these for the stiffness of the hull and lateral attachment of the batteries and processed them accordingly. So I added another stiffening to the torso in the abdominal area. I feel safer too.

The stern tube (ship's shaft) now fits without sawing open the cross bracing of the stiffener. However, I will exchange Die Schiffswelle for a waterproof and maintenance-free one from Raboesch. The supplied propeller will also be found on the ship as a set of fittings and is only used for adjustment.
For the time being, the auxiliary decks remain loose until the engine and the ship's shaft are delivered. It is not necessary, as I have designed the removal and installation wide enough for maintenance work - but it is more convenient to work at first.


Variable accumulation can now be used in the battery compartments. For this I will construct an adjustable slide gauge in the intermediate deck that will hold the batteries in place.
The frames were reinforced with 3mm hard fiber in the area of ​​the battery holder.


So much for the interim result.

Greetings Ralf and I hope you noticed a smile on your face while reading and looking at the pictures.
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baerlin-line

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Hello Derek,

thank you for your interest and the recommendation. Your recommendation fits exactly and there is no contradiction from me.
Since today is a bridging day after the holiday, I have planned a night shift to put this thread on the net and can give you an answer right away.

Didn't have this engine in the short list but a similar one. The following thought went through my head and first of all, the Raboesch 700 didn't turn out to be either. Another one has arrived, but hasn't had the time to unpack it yet.

I want to install the motor as deep as possible to get a straight line between the motor shaft and the ship's shaft. Since I cannot incline the built-in ship's shaft, I had to find a motor that has a radius with the bracket together with the height from the keel to the ship's shaft.
With the set recordings you may see the small distance from the keel to the motor shaft. The motor shelf is 50mm wide and is placed up to 10mm in front of the frame end. So I only have 23mm keel left in this area with a width of 6mm from the keel. I didn't want to go any further and so I was able to add a reinforcement under the engine shelf between the ribs on the keel.

In addition, I always install an adjustable power reduction device so that the motors do not reach their maximum voltage. I've had good experiences with that. Of course, the driving behavior should also be true to the original. However, I would also like to be a little faster and generate a wave without reaching maximum power. On the other hand, a reserve thrust in the control stick saved my ships from sinking in some situations when a hobbyist misjudged his maneuverability.

So, now I'm still lively and unpack the engine.

Best regards from Berlin from Ralf
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Martin [Admin]

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 Pepper Powered?    ok2



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baerlin-line

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In the post today ... arrived on Wednesday.



Just haven't had the time to open the package.


Here is the engine for the harbor tug and the characteristics:


DC motor 1 - 12 V, 2 ball bearings, 2 x 4 mm shaft, seven-pole armature
Seven-pole armature, obliquely grooved and balanced for high torque and
gentle starting and stopping, extremely smooth running, sensitive controllability
Durable Cu - graphite brushes guided in shafts
Large stainless steel shaft with two outlets
Bearing with two 12 mm ball bearings
Stable steel housing with 3 threaded holes for attachment
Elaborately suppressed with 2 pin core coils and 2 capacitors


All information about:
Diameter: 36 mm
Housing length without / with bearing shells: 57/66 mm
Total length: 92 mm
Shaft diameter: 4 mm
Shaft length: 1 x 20 mm, 1 x 6 mm
Weight: 200 g
Starting voltage: 1 V
Current consumption without load: 0.8 A.
Max. Current consumption in short-term operation: 10 A
Speed ​​without load:
  3000 RPM at 3V
  6400 RPM at 6V
  9760 RPM at 9V
  12720 RPM at 12V

Let's see if I can find time to manufacture the aluminum motor mount next week.

Greetings Ralf
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baerlin-line

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 Pepper Powered?    ok2

Yes Martin,

I need all vitamins, herbs, fruits and vegetables to stay fit for the expansion of the harbor tug.

Greetings Ralf
 
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Mark T

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It looks like you have made a fantastic start to your Anteo  :-))


Good luck with your build and try and get the batteries as low as possible in the hull. It will make for a more stable boat on the water

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I am enjoying your approach to this and will follow with interest, just a thought re the battery placement, if you are able to place them lower down and further apart, even if that means leaning them over it will help with stability. If all the weight is close to the centre line the model will rock side to side quickly and look unrealistic, placing the weight further apart will slow the motion to a more realistic roll. The same goes for placing the weight forward and aft, it works and looks better. Good luck with the build
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baerlin-line

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It looks like you have made a fantastic start to your Anteo  :-))


Good luck with your build and try and get the batteries as low as possible in the hull. It will make for a more stable boat on the water



Hello Mark,

nice that you look into my thread. :-))

Can I address you by your first name? I hope.

You are absolutely right. The lower the center of gravity, the better the stability of the ship in the water.
I didn't dare to separate the frames in the middle because I fear that the stability with a load of approx. 4.85017 lbs would not be sufficient for the large battery. That's why I kept a 6mm offset on each side. Actually wanted to keep more misalignment, but then came across the opening size of the deck.

Between frame 7 to 9 I separated frame 8 to get the engine in a straight line to the ship's shaft. But that was my only courage - thanks to propeller glue. The keel also became quite thin, which I additionally reinforced under the engine support.

I enclosed the dimensions of frame 4 to 7 as a drawing. I don't think I can set frame 4 any deeper. Frame 5, 6 and 7 could be milled 10mm deeper with the Dremel. Would distribute the load from 4 frames to 3.

Also had the idea, as described below by "DSB88", to place the accumulators further back up to frame 8. Then it would be exactly in the middle of the fuselage. But the engine is in the way. Moving the motor forward between frames 6 to 5 would have, I believe, the following disadvantages: The ship's shaft would become very long and any imbalance in the shaft and propeller would have an increased effect. Since I can't get deep enough here to create a straight line between the ship's shaft and the motor shaft, the universal joint would have to compensate for the difference. Since a stable metal is installed here, it could cause noise. I put that aside.

I will soon mold the motor holder and after the fitting decide to implement your idea.

Thank you for taking care of me.

Greetings Ralf
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baerlin-line

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I am enjoying your approach to this and will follow with interest, just a thought re the battery placement, if you are able to place them lower down and further apart, even if that means leaning them over it will help with stability. If all the weight is close to the centre line the model will rock side to side quickly and look unrealistic, placing the weight further apart will slow the motion to a more realistic roll. The same goes for placing the weight forward and aft, it works and looks better. Good luck with the build



Hello DSB88,

nice that you look into my thread.
:-))

Can I address you by your first name? I hope.

I will now repeat myself, but it is part of treating each other with respect.

I noticed the unrealistic rocking of the Anteo in some videos on YouTube. I absolutely want to avoid that. Up until now I had managed to get my kits from Graupner Wiesel and Weser and Robbe Düsseldorf into the curve. I had practiced it with the Graupner Commedore. However, they are all models with 2 to 3 drive units. At the Graupner Weser, I achieved this with additional ballast. But then had a deeper waterline.

I would also be happy if you keep dropping by at my place.

Greetings Ralf

Repetition:
You are absolutely right. The lower the center of gravity, the better the stability of the ship in the water.I didn't dare to separate the frames in the middle because I fear that the stability with a load of approx. 4.85017 lbs would not be sufficient for the large battery. That's why I kept a 6mm offset on each side. Actually wanted to keep more misalignment, but then came across the opening size of the deck.Between frame 7 to 9 I separated frame 8 to get the engine in a straight line to the ship's shaft. But that was my only courage - thanks to propeller glue. The keel also became quite thin, which I additionally reinforced under the engine support.I enclosed the dimensions of frame 4 to 7 as a drawing. I don't think I can set frame 4 any deeper. Frame 5, 6 and 7 could be milled 10mm deeper with the Dremel. Would distribute the load from 4 frames to 3.Also had the idea, as described below by "DSB88", to place the accumulators further back up to frame 8. Then it would be exactly in the middle of the fuselage. But the engine is in the way. Moving the motor forward between frames 6 to 5 would have, I believe, the following disadvantages: The ship's shaft would become very long and any imbalance in the shaft and propeller would have an increased effect. Since I can't get deep enough here to create a straight line between the ship's shaft and the motor shaft, the universal joint would have to compensate for the difference. Since a stable metal is installed here, it could cause noise. I put that aside.I will soon mold the motor holder and after the fitting decide to implement your idea.I would be happy if you keep dropping by at my place.Greetings Ralf
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Mark T

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Hi Ralf do not worry about the strength of the frames. The strength comes from the double planking. I now know that I could have made my frames much slender than I did. Once your planking is on your hull will be super strong   :-))


Keep the updates coming mate

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Hello everybody,

in the meantime an existing engine mount modified to check the adaptability. The material thickness of the motor support is 2 mm plus 1 mm distance between motor and support.
As you can see in the photo, I made a straight line between the motor shaft and the ship shaft.
Since I would like to have a support made of wood, a construction had to be made on the drawing board in advance.
Before introducing the PC, I always recorded my thoughts with paper, pencil and eraser.
So I can better imagine the later product.
As I said and described, so done.
Start with the motor mount.

Gruß Ralf - Greetings Ralf

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I had more time than I thought.

The weather does not invite you to linger on the terrace in the evening. Grilling and freezing is not my thing.

Then I prefer to indulge in my hobby.

Have already started to construct the motor carrier from 5mm plywood scraps.

Greetings Ralf
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The weather is getting worse in Germany - Berlin. This is how I often come to my harbor tug.

The false ceilings with battery and other cutouts are glued and screwed. The wooden frame now has a high level of stability - as I would like it to be. Looks roughly like half an american football - my point of view. The battery pad has not yet been glued in order to lower it later.

The engine mount was also adapted for testing.

Until then - greetings Ralf
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Hi Ralf - I really like your building style with this tug.  Its very thoughtful and I like the way you design things on your computer and then make the part.  This should be a very nice tug when you are finished.  Keep the updates coming  :-))

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Today the suggestions of Mark T and DBS88 implemented.

Quote: DBS88
(I am enjoying your approach to this and will follow with interest, just a thought re the battery placement, if you are able to place them lower down and further apart, even if that means leaning them over it will help with stability. If all the weight is close to the centre line the model will rock side to side quickly and look unrealistic, placing the weight further apart will slow the motion to a more realistic roll. The same goes for placing the weight forward and aft, it works and looks better. Good luck with the build)

Quote: Mark T
(Good luck with your build and try and get the batteries as low as possible in the hull. It will make for a more stable boat on the water)

The frames have become really solid and almost unbreakable due to the tween decks.I changed the construction a bit, or adapted it.The recesses of the battery compartments in frames 5 and 6 were carefully lowered by a further 2cm with a Dremel, mini jigsaw and chisel in order to get a better center of gravity. Spant 4 and 7, the existing battery mounts were milled off and new ones set deeper. The cut-out parts from frame 7 were glued in again to have a bulkhead between the motor and the battery. Later on, I'll cover the glued-in parts with a wooden spatula. In the direction of travel on the left side I have drilled an 8mm maintenance hole in the sealed frame 7 in order to be able to remove the stern tube for possible maintenance purposes at a slight angle over the battery compartment. The maintenance hole is sealed with a rubber profile.The motor mount is also finished and fits very well. Later fixation together with stern tube and cardan shaft.Since everything is still accessible from all sides, I will next adjust the RC system in advance and manufacture the deck.

Enclosed recordings.

Greetings Ralf - see you soon
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It got a little late tonight and so I took the last photos in the morning.

Attached is the overview with photos and the final location with a sketch.

Greetings Ralf
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Nice job and it really will be worth the effort once it’s on the water  O0

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Nice job and it really will be worth the effort once it’s on the water  O0



Thanks Mark,

I really only dared to do it through your encouragement and through the fixed installation of the tween decks, which hold the ribs firmly in the guide and no longer seem fragile. As you have already mentioned, two layers of planking with lamination and mesh will hold the ribs firmly in place later. And the best part is, it makes more sense - since the main emphasis is now really on wedge level.

I cannot keep up with your highly talented and extraordinary way of working, but I try and it should also encourage others to build wooden ships.

I notice that everyone is helped here with good advice.

Thanks also to DBS88

Greetings Ralf
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Had some time again to relax while building.

"Since everything is still accessible from all sides, I will next adjust the RC system in advance and manufacture the deck". Those were the last lines I wrote. I've started with that now.

But first I have to repeat my statement. I described myself as "a spoiled model builder" and that is more and more true, since the previous kits were almost finished kits compared to this project. But experience also from the almost prefabricated kits is now paying off in this project and I am maturing into a full-fledged model maker.

We come to the deck structure. According to the plan, there is no seal between the deck and the cabin structure. I am making a correction here and will install a coaming border. A model boat without a coaming (sealing the deck against ingress of water through splash water, etc.) is not possible. Since I would also like to ride a wave, as noted here in advance and also like to ride in waves, I see this inevitably to be made.

I cut 15 mm strips from a discarded shoe box of my wife to try on. This cardboard box is 1.8 mm thick. Between the deck cutout and the cabin I still have 2 mm space, so that I possibly enlarge the deck cutout by 1 mm on each side and then build 3 mm wooden strips.

In order to get the front area dry, I moved the lower part of the cabin front 10 mm higher. Since the cabin structure reaches down to the floor through planks, the coaming underneath is covered and thus closed. The rounded sides are filled with foam rubber to make them watertight.
With the installation of the coaming, I then have a solution for a stable attachment of the cabin structure and upper deck in the back of my head, as well as an easy and simple removal of the cabin from the upper deck.

Attached is a picture with scraps of wood that can possibly still be recycled. The 2nd case is intended for the RC installations and until then only contains the motor. The 3rd case is then used for the fittings.

The next article describes the installation and alignment of the chimney on the cabin.
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Here is a brief description of the structure and alignment of the chimney on the cabin.

1. Rounding adjusted
2. Installation of the chimney bracket adjusted at an angle according to the plan
3. Insertion of the chimney on the bracket
4. Firm fit of the chimney without internal adhesion to the curve

The other images show the alignment during the gluing of the rounding to the bracket. As an auxiliary aid, I have fixed an ABS round strip with a length of 1 m from my supply for the longitudinal direction.

Now I let everything rest for gluing. The chimney can be removed again for further expansion because it fits on the curve of the bracket.

See you soon - greetings Ralf
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Wow! This is turning into a real masterclass!

 Great stuff Ralf, very interesting!   :-))
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