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[John W E]

Hi there


After reading through Martin's topic on 'scans from Model Boats' - it has me wondering how many of us have actually built from 'free' plans published in Magazines.


Here are a couple which I have built - and let us see if we can find some more - amongst us Mayhemmers


john

[dougal99]

here's one of mine

[dougal99]

This is a bit of a cheat. I used the hull plans from Pacific Buccaneer and rescaled them to suit Anglian Sovereign. So halfish free plan

[dougal99]

One from a GG plan I think (at least 16 years ago still going strong). This was an attempt to get my then teenage son into the hobby - no go.

[Umi_Ryuzuki]

This is totally a cheat. 
I built the model of the SDM in 2006-7, and it was later used for an magazine article in 2015.
My thanks to Xtian for being a friend and a fan, and later promoting the model.

[RST]

I've not really made much from free plans because I used to freelance from GG, Hal Harrison and anyone out there.  But I just got a copy of "SMALL RADIO CONTROL BOATS" out of curiosity and Mr Guest couldn't really make it any easier to break into the hobby.  I'd be ashamed to say what I paid such a low amount for a new copy on E-Bay and know he probably won't get any back royalties.


Rich

[GG]

Rich,
        Don't worry about my royalties, I never joined this hobby to make money..!!!


Thanks for the comments, I do try to "demystify" things that people might find problems with.  I have to say that this is sadly unlike the approach (intentional or otherwise) of some, as T,S, Eliot said "Expert beyond experience".


Offering a solution to someones problems without also including reasons why it is a problem and how the solutions solves things, is only viable for those who want to maintain their image of superiority over other mere mortals.


Now back to the latest model, which always seem to generate new problems to solve.  But, I'm an Engineer and problems seem to be my "bread and butter".  Better than watching, reading or listening to the rubbish that seems to pass as "entertainment" these days..?


Glynn Guest
P.S. There is also the booklet "The Basics of Model Boats".  Bit dated (1995) perhaps but it covers most of the things that novices (and perhaps a few people who ought to know better?) need to know. 

[John W E]

Looking at the response to this thread - it gives the impression that not many modellers take advantage of the issue of free plans - either from the internet or magazine - it begs the question it is financially viable to offer these.   I do appreciate that a certain amount of plans wont appeal to everyone - but - I would have thought that given the cross section of modellers on this Forum, I thought there may have been a bigger response.    Having said that though - here are 2 from Glynn's stable - which I built from free plans:

[davidjt]

this is seaforth conqurer i built 10 years or so plus about 25 others all from magazines plans, the puffers i built for each of my grandkids, even my avatar picture


david

[ChrisF]

Hi John

I might be completely off the mark but my take on it is that whilst, as per the example of this forum covering  a good cross-section of modellers, is that while that is true, many of us tend to build what we are interested in e.g. warships, sports cruisers, tugs, lifeboats, yachts, the classics (Sea Queen,  Rapier etc.) etc. and with time being limited tend to concentrate on those, building  either from kits or scale plans and rarely build another type of boat or ship.

There are exceptions of course, where some folks build all types of craft. I'm relatively new to the hobby and over the four years since I've started I've only ever built Faireys and I've got at least a couple more to build before that itch is scratched. I am planning to build something non-Fairey in the near future but it will be a similar type of boat i.e. a sports cruiser. Whilst I appreciate the builds of all types of models, many of which are fantastic, I've got no interest in building any of them myself, and that also applies to free plans, from well, only the one magazine now. In the four years I've been buying it there has only been one I'd consider building and that probably won't happen.

I'm guessing that in the hey day of model boating that many would have built from free plans but in recent years I don't think that is the case, as I think most concentrate just on those builds that they are interested in and find the kits, plans or draw their own.

Just my take on it and happy to be shot down!

Chris

[DavidHughes]

Yep!

See here: [size=78%]Inspired by Glynn Guest & in memory of my Dad (modelboatmayhem.co.uk)[/size]

And two more half built - a Vosper MTB based on the Model Boats/Glynn Guest plan (planning to detail up a bit), and a Fireboat based on the Eezebilt plans

[GG]

I can't help but think that one value of the "free plans" published in hobby magazines that has not been mentioned yet, maybe even overlooked by many? is the information they contain.


A good plan feature ought to contain lots of "Why's and How's".  That is not just a description of how to build it but the reasons for constructing and outfitting in this way and the resulting performance.  This is much more valuable than expecting people to blindly follow the designers path and allows for any changes forced on the builder (such as lack of specific items used in the original) to be made intelligently, rather than on a whim or in total ignorance.


Over the years I'll confess to learning much from viewing the plans published in magazines.  Ranging from "that's a clever idea, I'll use it in the next model" to "there's got to be an easier, cheaper, better, simpler..... way to do it!".


On a final point, why do people insist on calling these magazine plans "free"?  I can understand appeal to marketing types trying to con the gullible, but people have to buy the magazine and the issue may be reduced in pagination to cover the publishers costs in giving the readers their "free plan".  So, where's the justification for using this term...?


Glynn Guest

[Tug Fanatic]

The success / failure of the free plans isn't just about numbers being built by members of the forum.

As Glynn says I have learnt a lot from reading the article included with the free plans and got lots of ideas from them. I have looked at some and thought them beyond my ability / patience and at others & wondered why on earth bother to publish them (2 in the last year).
They are also the first thing that I look at in the magazine.

If they went it would be another nail in the coffin.

[Colin Bishop]

On a final point, why do people insist on calling these magazine plans "free"?

Just marketing hyperbole Glynn, happens everywhere. The MB cover announces it is 'No 1 for Scale and Sail' when there is no comparable competitor.

The standard of free plans does vary but the better ones provide a useful half way house between kits and scratchbuilding even if some are only near or semi scale.

Colin

[ChrisF]

That's a very good point Glynn. I do read the accompanying article in many cases, because as you say often useful tips and information can be gleaned. Same goes for articles on boats/ships I'm not interested in building.

I don't tend to read them the first time I pick up the magazine but I've paid for it so I may as well!

Chris

[Tug Fanatic]

The standard of free plans does vary .................. even if some are only near or semi scale.

Colin

Funny but I don't think of near or semi scale as being "only". The are the ones that are achievable by most people who read the magazine and can be built in reasonable time and with achievable skills. Detailed scale plans and accompanying photos of larger ships are surely beyond what would be possible in a magazine. Complicated plans would also be very expensive to produce.

I suspect most readers could easily identify the two free plans in the last year that I regard as having very little value.

[Colin Bishop]

Detailed scale plans and accompanying photos of larger ships are surely beyond what would be possible in a magazine. Complicated plans would also be very expensive to produce.

Not now, but they used to be at one time! Contributors had the skill sets then. The 'Free Plans' now have to conform to a limited physical size for stapling in whereas in the past much larger quite complex plans were on offer.

Also, the 'Feature plan' articles in the old magazine often contained half page reproductions of the full size plans which went into the plans service. These were of high quality but back in those days it would have been quite difficult to have them enlarged whilst now you can just scan them in and print them out at any size you like such as the paddler I am building at the moment.

Colin



Colin

[John W E]

I always regard 'easy to build' free plans in a magazine as a 'come and buy me' to entice people into the hobby of model boats, such as new-comers.   People will think they may be able to make that - to me its a bit like part magazines that you see such as build the Bismark, build the Hood etc., in so many parts.  The average person who would like to build that model may not have the skills to accomplish such a highly detailed kit.  Over a period of time with weekly instructions will hopefully be able to achieve a reasonable example.  What happens certain modellers tend to look on these and class them as an over priced way of making a model.


I do know some of the detailed plans which have been published in Model Boats in the past may look as though they may not be totally accurate such as the Seaforth - but - I actually obtained the builders line drawings for the Seaforth Clansman and compared it with the free issue in the magazine - the only difference in the hull lines was a slight modification at the bow.   So, it does show that some of the drawings published in the magazines are sometimes quite accurate.

[ChrisF]

Not now, but they used to be at one time! Contributors had the skill sets then. The 'Free Plans' now have to conform to a limited physical size for stapling in whereas in the past much larger quite complex plans were on offer.

Also, the 'Feature plan' articles in the old magazine often contained half page reproductions of the full size plans which went into the plans service. These were of high quality but back in those days it would have been quite difficult to have them enlarged whilst now you can just scan them in and print them out at any size you like such as the paddler I am building at the moment.

Colin



Colin

There are those still around today who have the skill sets, especially if using CAD, but I guess their numbers would be a lot less than they used to be and most wouldn't want to put the time and effort into producing a free plan even if the recompense was favourable. There can be an awful lot of work in drawing up plans and producing an article.


I've produced the drawings for my five current Fairey builds with another two in the wings but it is one thing producing drawings for your own builds, where you only draw what is required, and producing them for others where you have to draw everything and have to make sure it all works, with ideally building a prototype. And they are quite simple designs compared with warships etc.


Chris

[RST]

Looking at the response to this thread - it gives the impression that not many modellers take advantage of the issue of free plans - either from the internet or magazine

Maybe true, but also true is we don't have to build something just because it's offered!

There are those still around today who have the skill sets, especially if using CAD, but I guess their numbers would be a lot less than they used to be and most wouldn't want to put the time and effort into producing a free plan even if the recompense was favourable. There can be an awful lot of work in drawing up plans and producing an article.

Hi Chris,

CAD makes things quicker to some extent but you don't need CAD to make a model.  I guess I'm biased though, I'm not a draughtsman, but can draw.  But I agree, getting parts to fit is a major thing if you're passing the dimensions on.

Other comments:

"The standard of free plans does vary but the better ones provide a useful half way house between kits and scratchbuilding even if some are only near or semi scale."

...I have not seen any any plans published in a magazine the last 30 or so years considered to be "sub-standard" or of varying "standard"?   They have all been what they are, otherwise if they weren't good enough for what they were I imagine they woudn't have been published. 

...That said, there is a somewhat alarming post on RCgroups the last month or two who I see is producing a new PoF model and expecting it OK to go to market as a new kit after just the first couple of planks have been fitted on their own workbench!  This isn't how to take a new model to market.

Rich

[Circlip]

Wonder how many circummed  to the 'Hook'? Used to be a Crissy present but since the demise of Muddle Maker in 64 it eventually became a monthly gift. Unfortunately, due to the instant gratification of today, the five weeks I quoted to a couple of the Space Invader culture even forty years ago for the design,construction and flying of a RC thermal soarer was 'Too long'. Vast difference between Smeeds Water Bug and RTTL freebies.


   Regards  Ian.

[tica]

I did a Skimmer 400 designed by GG back in 2010.

[GG]

Ah tica.... perfect trim, slightly bows up and just skimming over the water creating little disturbance.


A deceptively simple design and if I remember correctly, first published in RCM&E.  It drew more on my electric flight rather than model boat experiences.


Glynn Guest 

[tica]

Ah tica.... perfect trim, slightly bows up and just skimming over the water creating little disturbance.


A deceptively simple design and if I remember correctly, first published in RCM&E.  It drew more on my electric flight rather than model boat experiences.


Glynn Guest

Thank you GG 
I also did a Vivace with a brushless setup, not the best performance on the water, it leans heavily to the side when accelerating, sorry no pictures, Mrs. Tica didn't managed to get some good pics of it when it was tested at the Club water. Hmm maybe I should dig it out of the pile of funny stuff at get it back on the water 
Build log => https://www.modelboatmayhem.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,60342.msg635793.html#msg635793

[GG]

I can understand the problem with your Brushless powered Vivace.  The original design was kept slim to maximize the performance with the NQD jetdrive's more modest electric motor.


I recall that it had quite a noticeable outwards heel when turning tightly at speed.  Never a problem and I put it down to the lack of a conventional rudder, which would create an inward rolling moment and usually reduces this effect.


Another model that was an interesting design challenge, mainly fitting the jet unit which needed to sit on a flat surface, into a planing hull.


Glynn Guest