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[KBIO]

Hello !
I have a Star engine which is rotating the wrong side for the propeller that I have .
I do not really hnow what to do. Whatever I try , this damned engine keeps going on the wrong direction.
Does anyone knows how to proceed and if eventually someone has a detailed drawing, I would greatly appreciate.
Thanks for your help.
Regards.

[rhavrane]

Bonjour Yves,
Perhaps Roy could help you https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bkxNfAf85ak ?

[KBIO]

Good morning !
I am not sure that Roy is the right person to explain to us how to time a Star/Sun engine , as he connected the inlet steam to the exhaust port.
The way , it is connected, it is impossible to lubricate the engine .
Timing such an engine is easy as Stuart did some marks for it.

There must be a way to change rotation of the engine. I'll try again today but the "PROs" of this Forum must know ! 
[size=78%]Have a good day ![/size]

[KBIO]

I come back from my shop.
We can see the marks made by Stuart for timing the engine.
I did a mark 180° oposite to the one on the shaft . This should reverse the rotation.
if not ....

[KBIO]

Another question !
What type of oil to fill the bottom Carter with?
I use to pour 20/50 engine oil just enough to have the crankshaft splashing ! Is it good enough ?? 


Cheers !

[DBS88]

Hi KBIO Re the Star engine, I have no experience with the Star, but I do have some experience with the Sun engines and their for runner the MTB 1B 180 engine. As has been said, for the sump, use an ordinary engine oil so that the crank splashes oil up and lubricates everything inside the crankcase. Re the timing, the Sun is set at 110 degrees, so this will be a good place to start with the Star - please see attached photo. I have not tried this, but what would happen if you set the timing at 110 plus 180, so 290 degrees? So with No1 piston at bottom dead centre?  Also are you able to turn the engine round and use the other end of the crank? If so, the engine will already be running the other way round.
Here are some links to videos of my engines that fellow Mayhemers have helped me with to get them up and running.
Here is the MTB 1B 180 running on steam https://youtu.be/abuFc46Ce2o
Here are a pair of Sun engines running on steam https://youtu.be/o5hhbtoC7To

[KBIO]

  I must be the stupidiest idiot in the world as , as you say, I just had to turn the engine round !
i do not know why, I didn't think of it , as all was in place ! Why to make things easy when I can make them complicated !
KBIO ! You should never steam up when you are sober ! ;-))
Anyway ! Thanks for your help David ! I got the engine running the good way now , by rotating 180+10° the shaft .
For the oil : 20/50 engine oil , according to the temp of the steam @ 60 psig , it will tolerate some mayonnaise for the time I shall run it .
Then rince and pour clean oil for storage and it will make it.
Thanks a lot gentlemen , for your kind help and have one on my account !


P.S : Star , Sun & Sirius are based on the same principle and must be timed the same way.

[KBIO]

Here is the reward !
The engine runs in the right direction now [size=78%] , [/size]I do not need to change the propeller as I have only one.
The noice comes from my gears which are a bit too large.
I do not dare to push it at max RPM as it is running with no load . I'll make a video when I sail the boat.
One thing is sure ! I have too much steam for this 6 cc engine. I am preparing the Sun (11 cc) for the next step !
Retired is a hell of a job as you never end up your work and when you finish , the pubs are closed !
Regards.


https://youtube.com/shorts/sQH3Qa5EVow?feature=share

[DBS88]

Well done that engine runs very well, love the twin burners and their red hot heat shields, I will watch with interest to see how your build progresses

[KBIO]

Hello David !
I am not too sure to understand well.
If I read your comment:
Sun is set at 110 degrees, so this will be a good place to start with the Star - please see attached photo. I have not tried this, but what would happen if you set the timing at 110 plus 180, so 290 degrees? So with No1 piston at bottom dead centre?[/size][size=78%]quote][/size]
[/size]
[/size]And then I look at the drawing; it says T.D.C . Does that means "Top Dead Center " ??[size=78%]

[/size]The Str is OK now , but I work on a Sun . And no way to turn the engine round as the crankshaft diameter is different on both sides.[size=78%]
[/size]Thanks for your help ![size=78%]

[DBS88]

Hi Yes TDC is top dead centre. The crank shaft on mine extends out both ends of the crankcase, in the photo you can see one end driving the prop shaft and the other driving a mechanical oiler and a boiler water feed pump. Would it be possible to change the size of the hole in the fitting that the crankshaft is going into?

[KBIO]

That's all right Dave !
Thanks for the info's !
I don't know how many RPM yet but it sounds good.
I need to  find the right jets and test again before to hog to the pond !
Regards.


https://youtu.be/TtF6dGzB93Q

[DBS88]

Your Sun engine is running well, thank you for sharing, looking forward to seeing it running on the lake with those larger gas jets powering the boiler.

[KBIO]

Hello !
Today was a good day , the launch was sailing steady & fast and when I was ready to catch the phone to make a film ; Bingo ! …..see the pics below.
The right rotation for the propeller is opposite to the one of the engine.
The propeller’s torque unscrewed the shaft at the end of the cranckshaft.
I didn’t plane that !!
Now, I have some work to do !
The easiest would be to screw the gear and its shaft back on the crankshaft with blue Loctite , but I am afraid that the temp of the engine melts it. Pressure is about 6 b (90psig) so the temps is closed to 170°C .
The safiest , I think , would be to turn the engine round , remove the flywheel and set the gear on the shaft. I shall have to make another skid , but when on retirement with a pack of beer, I can stand in my workshop for a while !;-))
Anyone having an idea ??
Thanks.
Regards.

[DBS88]

I have been giving more thought to setting the timing so the engine runs the other way, and realise the previous idea probably was wrong. Currently  to set the timing the engine is rotated so that the geared shaft that moves the piston valve, rotates anti clockwise and when the No 1 cyl reaches top dead centre the timing is set a 110 degrees, suggest trying rotating the engine the other way and set the timing at 110 degrees with the geared shaft turning clockwise and when the No1 cyl reaches top dead centre. Looking at the drawing, try a mirror image of the settings. So the 110 degrees would now be to the left of the centre line - hope that makes sense? It’s probably as clear as mud!

[KBIO]

Hi Dave !
This is very clear ! I put everything back the way it was originally and I rotate the top excentrique by 180 °
i drill the pignon  to 7,15 mm to fit on the original crankshaft diameter. I didn't touch it.
I machined down a small stainless steel rod  to fit the flywheel and I drill a 4 mm hole in the crankshaft , tapered for this rod . The 3 mm originally drilled was not strong enough to whistand the inertia of the fly wheel.

And you know what !
That's work ! The propeller turns the right way to make the boat move forward ! .....Sometime I surprise myself !
The engine runs good and I should be able to do a steam test this week to go sailing next Monday !
Thanks for your help !
Kind regards.

[KBIO]

Hello !
Test = OK ! Nothing fall apart with 5/6 b and > 3500 RPM. Pressure drops though.
Next time lets see what it woth on the water.
Have a good evening !


https://youtu.be/yPdeV4eVj7Q

[Martin (Admin)]

 Are these engines any good for fast tethered Hydro at all?

[rhavrane]

Bonjour Yves,
Great job, could you remind me/us the bore / stroke of your machine because, even with its single action, it needs a lot of steam. 

[KBIO]

Good morning gentlemen, !
To answer to you both, I join a paper describing the Sun.
It is said that the one made of cast iron and with piston valves (the most common) is designed for flash steam.
Here ! I have a doubt because of the condenser oiler  is working good with steam ; low pressure & temp. And no oil in the piston sleeve (or slides sleeves) is not recommended at all
Flash steam being dry and hot , they use mechanical oilers.
The engine is 3/4x 3/4 = 11 cc and the autonomy I expect is  about 10' depending on the propeller RPM. This has to be checked and confirmed , still. I'll know more when I sail her !


11cc x 2000 RPM = 22 000 cc / min.
@ 7b abs >> 3,6 g / L     6b gauge
So : 3,6g x 22 liters  = 80 g/' of water .
80 g x 10 min = 800 cc.


The boiler contains 750 cc. So I may be short for 10 min sailing. If  am not wrong !
Field testing will tell !
That's all I can say but there is some specialists of the Flash steam who know more on this Forum ! I have the names !
Have a god day !